Hi, I am new to this forum but have learned a lot of ideas from reading old posts. Sorry this is so lengthy.
I have been married to my husband for 11 years, together for 15. We have no children. In October, he began acting like I was not a priority. When questioned about this, he told me that he was unhappy with himself in many aspects of life (not taking the time to go to church, seeing his family, doing things to make me feel loved).
My husband has an extremely stressful career that requires rigorous demands of his time, so what he complained about made sense to me. Our marriage has had more stressful situations than I believe the average marriage does. We have always loved each other, rarely fought, and were best friends who enjoyed being together. I will say that we have not had passion in our marriage for a long time, but I always chalked it up to stress, his exhaustion, and the mundane routine of daily life. Looking back, I do feel unfulfilled, but certainly never wanted to put more pressure on him.
He started talking to a priest and going to church. About 6 weeks after the initial complaint of being unhappy with who he was, it turned into that though he loved and cared for me, he was not in love with me anymore. He says that he has felt this way for over a year but did not tell me because I had a close family member that was ill for the entire year. He told me he needed time because he did not know if he wanted to work on our marriage. He felt that we had had 15 years to get it right. I left to give him the space that he needed, though I had not seen this coming. By this time, we had spent very little time together for two months due to his work schedule. While I was giving him space, I had found a few inconsistencies and became suspicious of an affair. Shortly after, he went on a vacation with another woman. He wouldn't answer my calls and denied having an affair via text, saying he just needed to get away and was with a friend. I did what research I could and found out that the OW worked with him and is single and 10 years younger than me. While he was still out of town, I consulted an attorney who recommended that I take half of our savings. He did not come home until 2 nights after he got back in town. By this time, I had taken the money.
When I confronted him about the affair, he denied sleeping with her, saying that he has only kissed her and that she has nothing to do with the way he feels about our marriage. That none of this is about another woman. I asked him to end it and he would not commit to doing so. He said there was nothing to end, that he's not in a relationship, she's just a friend and he'd only been seeing her for 3 weeks. The next day he agreed to go to counseling but couldn't promise anything. This ended up being an independent session for him. That evening we fought and he said he could never see us being happy again, he has no desire to work on our marriage, and that he does not share my optimism that we can fall back in love. He did not want to be the one to end our marriage. He told me he thought I should leave him. I told him I would not file for divorce as this was his doing, that I wanted to work on our marriage.
But I ended up leaving the next day, filled my car with clothes and went to my parents, planning to do PLAN B. I would have liked to have tried PLAN A but felt that he wasn't going to let me try and what was the point if he would not sleep at our house or agree to business only contact with her (which is the best I can hope for since he must give 3 months notice to leave his job.) I had already lost 15 pounds, and still can't eat, can't sleep. I did not respond to the two texts that I got, but he did say that he would read the books I had bought by Dr. Harley and he thought he needed to read them before returning to the counselor.
About 5 days later, we had a counseling session scheduled, so I went to it; he did not, he took the OW to dinner. While I was in the town where we live, I decided to see a friend (whose husband is my husband's business partner and a serial cheater, as is their third partner). My purpose was to find out any info that she might know about the affair.
She knew nothing, however, we discovered that the OW had also had a 2 year affair with her husband. I found some other details and decided that I needed to talk to him before I left town, therefore messing up Plan B. Also, from what I could tell, I think he was staying with the OW while I was gone.
When I told him this information, he knew about the affair but was concerned with the timeframe that I was told it ended. He told me he was going to call her to say that he couldn't be "her friend" anymore. I remembered that he should write her a letter too late. When he came back from calling her, she had talked him out of it.
The next day I told him I couldn't be in limbo for much longer, that I was starting to lose my desire to work on our marriage as well. I tried to get him to spend his week off with me so we could try a little of Plan A, but he did not want to. I asked him if he knew if he wanted a divorce. He said yes. Then said that he didn't know if it was 100% the right decision or if he would regret it. Then he said he needed more time.
I can admit that I have faults but also feel that getting your needs met is a 2 way street. This man is not my husband. He has always been very good to me. This cold treatment and disrespect that he has shown me is totally out of character. This is a person who was mortified by the behavior of his partners and how they treated their wives. He is now adamant that he is nothing like them, even though he is having an affair.
So I have now left again and am back to trying Plan B. I read about starting to move some things out. I don't feel ready to pack up furniture but what are your thoughts on packing up the things that make a house feel homey (pictures, knickknacks, etc.)? I am also preparing for exposure. I tried to disclose the affair to one of his best friends, who did not take it well. He said he knew we were having problems and that he had encouraged my husband to work it out and would continue to do so, but that my husband denied any affair as a problem.
The OW is single, should I expose the affair to her parents? I am working on what I would like to say to his parents.
Before you expose her to anyone, take a step back. I know you are hurt, but that will backfire on you. I suggest you talk to a DB coach as soon as possible. It is important that you have a clear goal and a plan on how to implement it. You can't just react to everything he does, it will make it only harder on yourself. Your coach will also be in your corner and will help you make decisions and choices that will most likely help you get your marriage back on track. Take good care and I would be happy to talk further to you about this.
Karen, Resource Coordinator The Divorce Busting Center 303-444-7004 karen@divorcebusting.com
Give me a call if you'd like to schedule an appointment to speak with a Divorce Busting® Coach.
I realize that I didn't notify my post previously, but I am going to give an update on my situation. I received some advice from a DB session and was attempting to follow it by doing a 180 and not doing what I'd been doing, which was pleading, trying to reason with my husband, and asking questions about the affair.
I went to stay with a friend for a week after he said he wanted a divorce and needed more time. I didn't hear from him until the end of the week but when I did he was furious over me moving our savings out of a joint account. I had actually done this two weeks prior, so it was odd to me how the anger showed up so much later. While I was out of town he actually cancelled my credit cards, changed the locks on my house, has taken our dog, and my jewelry. At that time, he had not filed for divorce. He told me that I would not get our dog or my jewelry back until I put some of the money back.
I went to my attorney, who advised me not to return any of the money. I ended up telling my husband that I would listen to what his attorney had to say about our retirement funds. I tried several times to get my dog back. He continues to lie all of the time and I have found out that our dog is at the OW's house. At one point, I went to his work to get the key to the house so I could get some clothes, and he seemed to be in a panic that I was there. He does not want anyone to know what he has done, probably because he used to look down on his partners for being adulterers and he made his opinion known. He gave me the key willingly but then was pretty ugly again later that day. When I brought the key back, he again told me that he was not leaving me for another woman. That he was leaving me because it wasn't working and hadn't been for a while. I tried some DB attitude and he seemed to soften his cruel behavior and started to cry again and apologized for being ugly and bullying me, but has since filed for divorce. In the past week, I have read a lot about midlife crisis and feel he fits into this category very well.
I feel that I have no choice to save my marriage now that he has filed for divorce, although I've never had a choice about working on it since this whole thing started. He almost never contacts me for me to try more DB tactics. I just don't understand how someone can treat their spouse this way after never having discussed being unhappy in their marriage. It's still such a shock to me, as I thought we were going to finally try to have a baby. It's hard to believe that I still love him despite who he's become, but you just can't turn love off like a switch. I very rarely feel any anger, just hurt and sorrow. Neither of us believed in divorce prior to this and this is not the man that I married.
If anyone has any suggestions for me, I would appreciate it.
I agree with Karen. When folks get angry, especially after finding out about and affair, and attorneys get involved, things done in the name of protecting yourself can appear as 'acts of war' (examples are moving and controlling the other persons money). One act of war often begets another. Some can be hurtful, but are reparable. Exposing the affair is not one of them. It's permanent. It makes friends and family take sides, and not necessarily the side you hope and expect they will take.
Embarrassment and humiliation for your partner and maybe yourself hurts for a log time. Spare yourself. Give yourself every chance for change.
Like Karen says, step back. Let's some dust settle. Check in with experts, (like the coaches, or Michele's books). Get brainstorming advice from non-experts like vets here (remember they are not experts, but many are very wise).
Wishing you the very best,
sg Love is PATIENT, love is KIND, LOVE never fails / DB since 2001
Thanks for your input. I have given up on exposing the affair for the most part. I have told one friend of ours, but right now my husband seems to be avoiding everyone in his life except the OW. (This is just my impression, not fact.) Interestingly, however, my husband's partner (who also had an affair with this same OW) has recently left his wife as well. She has started telling people at their work that they both have left us. I have told her not to do this for me, since I would like to get our dog back.
At times, my husband acts as if he wants to divorce amicably. But my attorney called his after they attempted to serve me and of course the info that got back to him was not the total truth. Then he sent me a text that was just blaming me for everything again and irrational. So I left him a note saying I can't be treated this way anymore and that we could divide our belongings when he could be civil.
It is hard for me to see his side about taking the money for several reasons. First, I found out he was on a trip with another woman. Second, I waited to take it until he should have returned to work and didn't bother to come home. Third, I returned it when he said he would read Harley's books and go to counseling. Fourth, he got furious about his retirement, hid some cash, took our safe key, and changed passwords, so I felt I had to take it back. I feel that he should have told me how he felt about our marriage before it was too late (in his mind) to work on it, that he should never gotten involved with OW. What did he expect me to do? I'm not an attorney and had to do what I was advised. We live in a community property state, so it is still his even though it's in my name. And I've discussed returning some of it with my attorney and he told me not to do this.
I have trouble deciding whether my husband is having a MLC or if this is just an exit affair. By letting the dust settle, I assume you mean to do no contact for a while? The thing is, I'm getting to the point that I don't know if I can keep doing this. I'm alleging the adultery in the divorce paperwork and if I go this route, we could be divorced in less than a month. I feel that for my recovery, the faster that I move on, the better. But it's so hard to accept that my marriage is over, in what seems like the blink of an eye. If I don't do the infidelity route, it would be 4 or 5 months max.
Do any of these WS ever come back for real? I loved my husband dearly and had no clue that he was unhappy with me or us. I feel so abandoned and do so poorly with the 180 tactics and as if strategies. I've read that people who have so many emotional issues left should not be getting divorced.
Spouses do come back often. Marriages do heal from infidelity. It isn't easy. I don't think marriage in general is for the faint of heart and especially when a spouse has been unfaithful.
It's really important to know what you want. And put all of the action that has taken on a life of its own on hold, til you know what you want. You don't have to give everyone the details, you can be vague until you center yourself. See what you want. Then get advice in the appropriate way to obtain the life you want.
It's worth it. You get one go around.
sg Love is PATIENT, love is KIND, LOVE never fails / DB since 2001
At times, my husband acts as if he wants to divorce amicably. But my attorney called his after they attempted to serve me and of course the info that got back to him was not the total truth. Then he sent me a text that was just blaming me for everything again and irrational. So I left him a note saying I can't be treated this way anymore and that we could divide our belongings when he could be civil.
***Excellent! THAT is how you enforce boundaries. Calmly; even lovingly. But it's loving YOURSELF enough to say "I won't allow myself to be treated this way." More on the attorney thing below . . . ***
It is hard for me to see his side about taking the money for several reasons. First, I found out he was on a trip with another woman. Second, I waited to take it until he should have returned to work and didn't bother to come home. Third, I returned it when he said he would read Harley's books and go to counseling. Fourth, he got furious about his retirement, hid some cash, took our safe key, and changed passwords, so I felt I had to take it back. I feel that he should have told me how he felt about our marriage before it was too late (in his mind) to work on it, that he should never gotten involved with OW. What did he expect me to do? I'm not an attorney and had to do what I was advised. We live in a community property state, so it is still his even though it's in my name. And I've discussed returning some of it with my attorney and he told me not to do this.
***You're using money as a weapon, instead of trying to do what your attorney advises you to do to PROTECT YOURSELF. Try to keep it simple -- "I did what my attorney advised me to do, in order to protect myself. If a judge rules otherwise, obviously I will do what I'm told I have to do, but this is difficult on all of us right now." Any good family court judge worth his/her salt isn't going to look kindly to your husband squandering marital assets on his affair, and the amount of detailed financial accounting you will both be forced to do will turn up his spending, you can be assured. Let the attorneys sort it out.***
I have trouble deciding whether my husband is having a MLC or if this is just an exit affair. . . .
***Does it matter? I'm not big on labels: Unacceptable behavior is unacceptable behavior. I know it's a common mistake we ALL make on here (I did too), but try to stop figuring out the 'why' of it all and just learn what your non-negotiable boundaries of personal integrity are, and consistently enforce them. Your husband has to make his own decisions about what he wants to do, and you can't control him. ***
Do any of these WS ever come back for real? . . .
***Mine did. Had a torrid affair with a guy 20 years younger than her, nearly 8 years ago now. Today we are happier than we've ever been (she ended her affair after about three months, and returned to the marriage), and have since celebrated our 25th wedding anniversary, our 50th birthdays, and the birth of our first grandchild (and now another one on the way).
It can be done. It'll be the hardest thing you ever did, and you CANNOT control what your husband does, but you CAN control YOU, and there IS hope. Best advice I ever got, was from a guy on here who told me "Life just handed you a big fat s&%t sandwich. It's time to start biting it one bite at a time, and figure out how you're going to get through this, and stop focusing on the unfairness of it all." I was P*SSED at the time he told me that, because I did NOT want to hear it, but it was some of the best advice I ever got.***
It is hard to know what I want. Most of the time, I want him to come back and give us a chance to work on our marriage. My impression was that our marriage was pretty good and that with a few of Dr. Harley's ideas, it would have been easy to get that spark back. The foundation we had based on commitment, honesty, love, and faithfulness was there. We just had lived life day to day without a conscious effort of taking care of our relationship. Other times, I wonder how could I ever forgive him for how he's treated me the past few months.
I have very little anger, mostly still the pain and agony that so many on this site describe. I guess it's because I haven't had the chance to try to repair our situation or a say in what's happened. Maybe if he wanted to try, I would be angry with the affair, locking me out of the house, canceling the credit cards, etc.
I am still in the stage where I obsess over whether or not he will regret this and whether I will ever know that he regrets it. Why does that seem so important?
I have started taking steps on rebuilding my life. I've gotten a job and occasionally go out with friends. I've been looking at different neighborhoods to see where I might want to live when the divorce goes through. But the idea of us being divorced is still devastating to me.
I see what you mean as far as taking a step back. But I do think I have to answer his filing of divorce relatively soon. I just can't decide whether to include the infidelity clause or not. I feel that it may be the only way I can find out the truth of when it all started to get me some closure, but I also feel that every decision I make will affect whether he ever comes to me when he's out of this fog, if that's what it is. In other words, I try not to make him angry and always strive for the high road whenever possible. And the idea of being divorce so soon is overwhelming. I just got the ILYBINILWY speech in mid December.
I did not think that I was using the money as leverage, which he has accused me of. To me it's just money. I thought I had to do what I was advised to protect myself, because he has acted so out of character. But our marriage has always been what was important to me. I wonder how much the OW's opinion plays into his actions.
It is so hard for me to believe that none of this has to do with the OW. He was still making plans for us in the future shortly before I knew any of his unhappiness was over our marriage. I know that he at least took her to lunch a month before I had the speech. And there were some other lies the weekend before I got the original speech of him being so unhappy with himself, when he said it wasn't me.
But here I go again, always trying to figure out the "why". Congratulations to you Starsky on all of your good news!! It is nice to hear of real reconciliation. The success stories seem so seldom.
This is so hard to navigate, I'm sorry you are having to go through it.
I don't think you will ever get one or two definitive 'whys'. An affair just allows the 'escape' mechanism an addict uses. Or someone who is stonewalling,etc. Its about him.
Starsky is right...center and control YOU.
So you focus on you and find out what you want, and be real and present about what is good and what isn't in your life and your relationship, and you focus on the growing what's good and changing up what isn't good.
And if you want to save your marriage (which is worthwhile for both of you even with the pain, because the next relationships hold no guarantees, and actually have less chance of success) you do the same...build on the good, do more of what works and less of what doesn't work.
On another note, and this is NOT a site about how to get divorced, But not exposing the affair, does not mean you can't tell your attorney.
In my personal life I was divorced many years ago, long before I came to this site for another relationship. There was a factor in my divorce the attorneys both knew, but I didn't want to broadcast, especially when it turned out my FIL was in the courtroom, I felt it would hurt him too much to hear it. I was able to have the attorneys keep it in the documents and the discussions that my FIL wasn't privy to.
Be creative. Trust yourself.
All the best to you
sg Love is PATIENT, love is KIND, LOVE never fails / DB since 2001
