So back in about November I posted in newcomers but after a lot of reading here and on other sites realize my h is in mlc. Always thought mlc was working out and shiny new car. Not depressed and gaining weight. I'll try and be brief.
We have 3 daughters and with the oldest we went through some depression issues with her. She is doing great now but at the time we didn't agree with how to handle it. He basically pushed me aside.
He says that he didn't feel like I loved him and of course I felt he no longer cared about me. He found an email where I was asking my sister for a name of an attorney. I wasn't planning on using it - only if he did. I was convinced he no longer loved me. We had been seeing counseling for both the issues with our daughter and now our marital issues. He went on antidepressants and pretty much forced me to go on them too by saying I don't care about him because I never listen to him. So finally after about a year I did but by then he was done.
We lived together for a while then he finally filed. A few weeks before the divorce was to be final we both stopped it. (I had counter filed). He moved out.
In Nov 2012 he went on a vacation with a "friend", female. I had found text messages from her in the past where she said she loved him etc. This hurt. Our kids also were hurt by this and ever since he has had some issues with our youngest. While leaving for the trip he said he thought this was a mistake and he had actually been thinking about coming home. He never did. A friend of his also said he had discussed that several times with him.
Fast forward to last weekend. We actually had very nice evening together. He was getting ready to leave and I was taking our dogs out when a car out front said" Is your dad home?" I said "what"? She said is h home? By then h came out and said go inside. I said so who is this? He said OW.
They stayed outside about an hour when finally I went back out (it was late) and said "I think it's time for you to leave. H came back inside and admitted everything. Well I'm sure there are still some more secrets but he admitted the A. It had been going on for at least 2 years. I had noticed that i had a missed phone call on my phone. She had tried to call me. According to h, he had cooled it with her, saying he needed time to think about things and what he wanted. Apparently she had been wanting more. His words. I think he had probably cooled it and she thought she would expose him and I would file.
The next morning I text her and said i don't know why you called and came over but leave my family alone. I know, big mistake but I couldn't stop myself. Otherwise I feel like I handled myself very good. My c also thinks so. She returned with some nasty texts which I didn't return and a nasty voicemail. I never have talked to her.
So h said he needs to work on himself and I totally agree. Like everyone else has experienced, everything is my fault and he has rewritten history. Even justifies the affair by saying I hurt him so bad. Of course he doesn't acknowledge what he has done to me. He doesn't know what he wants. He said that he has been doing a lot of thinking and doesn't think life for anyone would be good with a divorce. Saw some home movies and didn't like some things he saw about himself and also saw that we did have some good times. Also realizes our girls will someday get married and how will that be?
He said that being on the AD's for that long and drinking way to much put him in a fog. I agree but he is also in mlc.
I told him that I loved him but I had a lot to process. I know that may not have been the best thing to say. I also said that I had to learn to forgive him but that was for me that I didn't want to carry that burden. I forgot to mention that he holds on to everything. He doesn't forgive. He can tell me everything I have done to him in the last 28 years.
I also told him I am at the end of my rope. That I took this time to be a better person and although I want to keep my family in tact I didn't know if I would still feel that way if he took too much longer. Realize this has been going on for several years. In addition I am now having to deal with the realization of the A and if he couldn't decide that he wanted to work on his M after all of the hurt that the A has caused, that it would be that much harder for me to decide to work on it any longer either.
I was pretty sure about the A but it was the confirmation that still hurt.
I know I did a lot of things wrong just now but I think I'm just so tired of limbo. I had been detaching and doing things but keeping up with the house, kids job etc doesn't leave a whole lot of time. I need to add that when he would find out I went out he would make snide comments. He would also check my cell phone records. I couldn't check his anyway because he has a work phone.
I'm not really sure what to do. I have been in counseling this whole time and he is just now going back after not going for about 5 months. He was getting off the AD's. While C can't say what happens in the sessions she did tell me she felt she had a positive session with him his first time back. She also said only I know when I have had enough. She said he asked how I was doing (in counseling I'm sure he meant) and she said very well.
I admire alot of you that have so much patience. I have always been a little light in the patience category but I'm trying.
Eventhough I have read a lot on mlc I am a little confused on where he may be in his journey. I realize after reading everyone else's stories that even if he would decide to give the r a chance we have a very tough road. Need a little help. I really want this to work but I am also tired of limbo. He comes around a little but there are still more times when I feel like he wants nothing to do with me. For Mother's Day I got a card from him and the girls as well as a gift. Very impersonal, from All of Us.
I have read DB and DR but did not find out about them until the end of last year. I started by doing all of the wrong things of course.
Where do I go from here? I am learning so much from everyone else, I'm just having trouble seeing clearly in my own case. Any help is greatly appreciated.
M 48 H 50 M 25 T 27 D 20,18,15 6/11 H filed 3/12 H dropped 4/12 H moved out
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy book by MWD, Divorce Busting is also an excellent book.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Do not post any outside links on the forum as it is against the TOS and can get you back on moderation.
I have read a good deal of books on the subject and can give you some suggestions when you are ready.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
I will give you a bunch of homework assignments to read. This is my ultra brand new and improved list of links.
Now you have all the tools to read. Let us know how your doing and if you have any questions.
I suggest that you read the entire thread in the resources. You can also pick out some people and read their whole story.
The stages of MLC as rewritten by HB from Jim Conway are a template which can only be laid over an MLCer's experience retrospectively. It's impossible to see the pattern until it has finished being laid or the crisis is complete.(nickel Cyrena). So do not be too concerned where your MLC'er is in this process. (Although my general guess is that they are in REPLAY)
Depression is the key to the whole thing and it is always present!
Believe none of what he says and 50% of what he does.
I would not ask him anything unless you can have no expectations. Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure. You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H as controlling or pressure.
Lets not worry about her. Lets work on you! Start your homework assignments. Something to DO while you are on moderation. GAL. Eat, sleep and take a deep breath. In general take care of your self first. Detach the single most important thing to DO.
Your H has given you a gift THE GIFT OF TIME use it wisely
You do understand that MLC is not a disease? It's a life shift that everyone goes through. Just some don't get to the point of it being a 'crisis'. This may be who your H is.
It sounds like he has depression issues. When did you first notice it?
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
[quote=complicated]a car out front said" Is your dad home?"/quote]
I just about pee'd myself when I read this! Doesn't say much about OW... and it also suggests you are doing a great job on looking so darned good and young!
Great job on ignoring her after telling her to leave your family alone.
Another thing that struck me is your H suggesting that the ADs and drinking put him in a fog. Sure, that combination won't help, but the fog was already there, no doubt.
On "where" he is? Possibly still in replay, although possibly just having a bit of a relapse but otherwise could have been on his way past replay, if he's going to go back to counselling.
Where to go from here? As your counsellor said, only you know and can decide when you have had enough of limbo and want to move on. Of course, it doesn't sound like you are ready to move on.
You've read DB and DR, so are you ready to try LRT or before you take that drastic step (because it CAN ultimately lead to D), or alternately what 180s and GAL are you doing?
I have already ready both DR and DB. We have been going through this for probably 3+ years but I did not find this forum or the books until about Oct or Nov of last year so before that I admit I did the wrong things.
Yes, H was for sure in a fog before that but did not see it. I do admit that since he has been completely off, about 2 months now, he does seem much better. Probably a combo of being off and being further along mlc? We had been in counseling through most of it but he stopped for about 5 months to get off meds. Why he felt the need to do that I'm not sure. MC was not doing anything but maybe for him individually it might have.
When I read all of the information given to me I get the feeling he is further through the tunnel than not I think. I think he has given up OW although she is pursuing heavily. She stopped contacting me.
KD, I do feel like I am ready to move on. I am very thin on patience at this time. I do think it might be because I feel like if he felt any remorse at all he would want to work on this. I have to keep remembering it's not that easy for him, right? I really don't want to break up my family. Even though my kids are older I still can't give up too easily.
I have read that sometimes they need to be nudged along but you have to be careful. Sometimes I think he got stuck for a while because things were so easy for him. Yesterday he spent the time he got off work until about 12:30 here. But his friend was here and the kids and he was working on our pool heater with his friend. His friend by the way has been very supportive for us getting back together and it is his best friend.
As far as 180s and GAL. I have been going out more and doing more with the kids. The funny thing is he criticizes me when I go out saying "shouldn't you be cleaning up this house instead of going out boozing"? Stuff like that. Another time he got mad because he said I didn't come over here to help clean up so you could go to Happy Hour tomorrow. I didn't even ask him to come over. He stopped by and saw me working outside. He also didn't think I should go see just about all of my daughter's college soccer games. He hardly went to any and I went to almost all of them. He thought I should be home more. So I don't think he likes it but I told him I'm not going to sit around to see if you are going to come over.
He would tell me that he didn't feel like I loved him anymore and didn't appreciate the things he did. I make sure that I am doing both of those. I also have/had a temper. That is huge. Even after he told me about OW I stayed calm. Big change for me. I still tell him when appropriate, I love him. Not sure I should be doing that though. Of course he doesn't reply or he'll say "I know you do".
Like I said earlier, he is starting to see that divorce may not be the answer. My oldest has been watching home movies and he said that has really gotten to him. He said he also started thinking about life when they got older and how that would be if we were divorced. I think he was thinking how would a wedding be, holidays etc. So I think that is a good sign right?
He said he needs time alone to work on himself and I totally agree he needs to work on himself. He blames me for everything bad that has ever happened in his life. But I don't know how much longer I can stand in limbo. He said he has given up OW - which is I think why this all happened with her. She panicked. I would like to do things together, not just at home, but he never wants to and never asks me to do anything. That hurts and even though I have been trying to detach, I think because this has been going on so long I am starting to think if I shouldn't just move on. I am not the type to date while still married.
M 48 H 50 M 25 T 27 D 20,18,15 6/11 H filed 3/12 H dropped 4/12 H moved out
Many LBS will come here and say, "Before I got DB I did all the wrong things". It can seem like that, sometimes. Yet what the LBS did before DB is neither right nor wrong. It is simply what they did to get themselves where they were, before they started DBing.
I mention that to you because, while you may feel you did the "wrong" things before coming here, it sounds like you did a great job holding it together and making it as long as you did.
That said, your GAL and 180s sound great. Keep doing them.
It appears you have two primary 180s:
+ working on your anger (sounds like it's working for you)
+ showing him you love him
on the second, have you read "5 Love Languages"? It sounds like he may be "acts of service". If that's the case, I think you are doing a great job, there. If you haven't read it, please do. If you have, what is your LLs and what do you think your H's LL(s) is(are)?
As far as saying ILY to your H, it doesn't seem like that's creating any negative results. Yes, he knows and he's told you he knows. Yet he doesn't appear to be getting upset that you are saying it. If you know your LL and it is "words of affirmation", then you are showing him your love with your words. If your LL is something else, then you may be OK with not telling him and simply show him with your LL, while still providing him with his LL.
On the rest? He says he still needs time and space, so keep giving him that. As far as the OW, she will provide him with enough pressure in his life and it doesn't seem like she has much leverage with him, so that will end (if it hasn't already) the natural death that most As can.
And regarding LRT, I would say that IF you can hold off for a bit, see where things go. We are obviously here to listen and support you, and would do so no matter what you choose. Yet, it seems to me as though you are actually on a good path to R. LRT may be too much pressure at this time, for your H. Nudges now and then, but LRT is probably overly drastic at this time and does not keep with your goal of R.
Oh, and as much as it svcks, be patient with wanting to do things with him. Perhaps there can be time set aside that the two of you make time for each other as a "date". Just thinking, perhaps your LL is "quality time" or it could be a secondary.
Keep posting and keep doing what you are doing. You can always change things up later, as you move forward.
KD, I'm beginning to think you are psychic. Yes I have read 5LL and yes I am quality time and he is Acts of Service with some Words of Affirmation. I learned of the book on here. I have been reading this forum for quite a while and it has helped me tremendously. Every time I feel like throwing in the towel I get on here and read.
Yes I think OW has put the pressure on. In a way I think he wanted to get caught because he apparently gave her my phone number. I asked him how he thought she got my number and he said he thinks he gave it to her. When I asked why he said "we were probably arguing and H said here's her number, go ahead and call her". My brain knows he needs space but my heart is hurt and wants this over. I know deep down that if I give him space it will be my saving grace in the end...it's just hard right now when I am so tired of this. Our 26th wedding anniversary is in a few weeks and I'm really nervous how that will go.
Regarding LRT, I agree, I think right now it would only hurt things more. What do I do for nudges?
I don't remember if I said up above but I have chosen not to tell the kids or my family. At this time I don't want the kids to think negatively about their dad. If it comes to D I will probably feel differently. I also didn't want to tell my family because I don't think they will understand why I'm not filing. They have always loved him but I don't think they will understand my standing for my M and family. Most people don't understand why I'm still standing which is why I don't usually talk much to most people I know when they ask. Do you agree? Not sure if I am protecting him by doing this or if it is the right thing to do. I certainly don't want to protect him but in a way I think I am protecting myself. It is embarrassing to have our s cheat on you and of course OW said some hurtful things when confronting me.
I'm actually kind of anxious for my next c appointment because even though she can't tell me what they talk about she does say stuff like things went well, or things are positive. I think if nothing else positives keep me going. One I think positive, maybe, is the night it all happened I had told him what I was going to do for his 50th bday which was right after the D was called off and he moved out. He said if that is something I would also like then maybe we could do it for my 50th which is next year. But, his moods are so up and down who knows what he is really thinking.
M 48 H 50 M 25 T 27 D 20,18,15 6/11 H filed 3/12 H dropped 4/12 H moved out
I would really say the "nudges" are doing what you are doing, especially with the LL stuff. Subtle, but helping him think that his happiness is actually with you (until or unless he finally realizes that his happiness actually comes from within )
It is generally recommended that LBS keep mum regarding the sitch, except to Drs, Ls, therapists, here. For those in the LBS's personal life that know, it is OK to be honest but otherwise indicate that you appreciate their interest and that you would prefer not to discuss it. At the same time, shame is a horrible thing that can be very harmful. Hopefully, a LBS can get past the pain and realize there is no shame to being a LBS, even if the WAS/MLCer speaks poorly, publicly, regarding the LBS, or if there is an OP.
Also, keep in mind that if you aren't prepared to talk about it now, IF the M ended, why would you consider talking about it then? I think too often that happens only so the LBS can feel some vindication.
