Is ther light at the end of the tunnel Part 1?

[Bel123]

Sorry for how long this is but its has been sitting in me for a while and need to put it on here and thanks in advance for reading.

Me 34/W 35
S 15month/D9 not living with us (mine)
M7/T13
OM suspected in 10/12
ILYBNILWY 1st in 10/12
OM confirmed in 10/12 (but not admitted by W)
ILYBNILWY 2nd in 1/13
Both in IC and MC

I’ve been lurking the forms for a few months now and I know I need to detach. I have been doing 180 and GAL. We are both in IC and MC. I have been sleeping in the living room since 5/11 when she was pregnant. She had a hard time during pregnancy and was depressed. I tried to be there for her and told her it will all be ok but she pushed be back. My hurt feeling of thinking she did not want to have a child with me made me withdraw and do things around the house to prepare for our son. Once our son was born 11/11, I thought it would be some time before we can get a handle of things and start working on our M. After that, she withdrew more and kept doing her own thing. I asked for us to spend time together but I was not in her list of priorities. We start MC in 6/12 had have had 3 (they were councilors that were finished up their schooling so when they did it only lasted a few months each and then had to start over again). Now we are seeing a pro who I think is good at breaking down our feelings and where they come from. We both have a tendency to think we known what they other person is thinking or feeling and some communicate about feeling as much as we used to. In our past, I was the one who did not communicate well and kept it all inside, now she is the one doing that.

In 10/12 I suspected a OM (maybe a EM) and had some evidence and confronted her and she said they are just friends. She lied about where she was but she says its not a lie and that she just doesn’t have to tell me everywhere she was. And believe me, I am not the type of person who keep track of where she is but when I am lied to, it feel like she is hiding something. She withdrew more. Said she doesn’t feel comfortable around me anymore and dropped the ILYBNILWY. That day, I told her that I loved her and understand how she feels and if she truly in her heart feels she has given it all her best then I cannot stop her. I also asked if she feels in the last 6 months of seeing MC, does she feel like she has actually tried and she agreed that she didn’t but didn’t know if she can give us a chance since feels she is out of love. She said to give her more space so she can make a decision on even if she wants to try. Same day I called OM’s family and got his number and called him and texted him so we can talk but he did not.

I perused more and she withdrew more. I snooped and found some things that led me to believe of OM PA. She was “hurt” how I would even ask. I did not accuse, I asked if something is going on let me know and we can talk about it and see where we go. She denied it and withdrew some more. For months now I have been the one asking for a hug and it feels a one way and I have stopped asking since it makes me feel so rejected that my W that I love is so hurt by me and have lost the feelings of love to even give me a hug or touch me. It is painful and I don’t wish it on anyone.

During one MC session, I asked if she has taken our son to the OM’s house she says she has and I filled out and told her I don’t like you taking S to the OM’s. You can do what you want but please don’t do that and told her how it made me feel. She said “alright alright I wont”. These days she avoids R talks. I did more snooping and confronted her coming out of the OM’s apartment building. She told me she was taking our S to the store and mall but when I followed her they were no mall stopping. Looking back, this was very stupid of me. I felt confronting her would make her see what she is doing and for her to decide one way or another. But what it does is push her more away from me.

So during MC, when C asked her about her hiding thing and how I does want to be married to a teenager and that she do not need to be married to her father she says she feels boxed in and trapped. She still needs to sort her feelings out. When confronted about the lying she flipped out and said she is not sorry she lied and that she doesn’t feel she owes me anything.

I have been calmer and doing more of my own thing and trying to validate her feelings in MC. We are not to talk about the M outside of MC so it is hard to wait for a week to talk about 13 years of relationship issues but I am doing it. At home I am doing more around the house and spending a lot of time with my son who is so nice to be around now since everything he does is funny. I have also been doing my own thing of reconnecting with old friends and trying to develop new hobbies. W sees some of the changes but I don’t know if it is too late. I know this is more for me than her but I also know I want this M to work. It is hard to be in house where you see all your dreams crumbling down but I don’t want to leave no stone unturned.

A few things I have a question about. I know it is said when there is an OM involved, the fog is hard for them to see. How do I know if this is the fog talking or if she is really done with our M?

Is it still ok for us to go to MC even though W says she hates going there and almost always leaves crying? We don’t bring up the OM in there but of how we feel and have felt and more of me trying to relate to her feelings and validating her. She says she feels judged by me and other, and am trying to tell her that I am not judging her and that I feel bad and sad for her she feels this way. She says even though it is empathy, she hears it as pity. And it is honestly empathy because I can really see how she is torn and is hurt but nothing I can say or do can fix it and I wish I would be able to be there for her but she doesn’t want me to. Is MC still right place to be since that is the only communication about our feelings and the M? The MC is really good at exposing issues that we both don’t generally see ourselves doing but seeing her hurt in there hurts me.

As far as doing my thing, since we live in the same roof, I am kind and offer help but I think I need to do less of that. I take great care of our son and his needs, I do stuff around the house as in the dishes and household stuff and she does as well. We don’t cook for each other and that hasn’t happened in years so what things we have together I don’t want to do 180 and not do it anymore. Other times we spend together has been me asking if I can join or asking if she wants to join doing things with our S. should I continue to do that? I know it doesn’t make her feel good but I feel if I stop doing that, the only time we would see each other would be during MC or in the house for a few minutes a day. She has detached from me for a long time so I am sure she can go without me and wouldn’t miss a beat so how do I work back into her wanting to do something with me?

Any advice if greatly appreciated especially about how to communicate in MC. Since the first time to now, C has said that she feels like I (and H) have to really slowly formulate our words like it is the last chance we have and we are walking on egg shell especially me. And I hate how it has come to that. What do I do about that. I don’t want share all my feelings because I feel she will hold it against me and put another satiric why she should leave. But I don’t want to be back in a relationship of where we were or go to one that is lopsided of me not being able to share my thoughts and feelings. I have learned from IC and MC that these thoughts have to be shared to at least get them out of your system and deal with them or they will fester into a problem in the end. What’s the balance of validating her feelings but expressing yours as well. Or do you wait to see where we go and then express/work on those later?

I have read both DBing books and find it helpful. I have also been reading other books and the forms a lot and trying to read the good outcomes and see where it relates to me and how I can apply that but every R is different. I am still confused if I have WAW or MLC (she has issues of self image and feel she is getting old and have lost her 20s) though.

On my issues of temper, being lazy, needing to get a life, doing more around the house is changing and improving. I need to keep that going. I need to get my self-confidence back as it has taken a shot over the years and in need of a big repair. I know I will be ok at the end of the day and I know at the end of the day I want to be in my M with my H that is a better M than we have hard in the last few years.

Thank you and sorry for jumping all over the place but I need your thoughts on my not so unique situation!

[Cadet]

Welcome to the board.

First of all try to stick to one thread.
Lets make it this one.

You are on moderation right now so you are going to need some patience until your posts show up.

As far as WAW or MLC you do not do anything differently.
It does not matter what she is, you do the same things.

Take care of your self, GAL, eat, sleep, and breathe.

Keep reading here and posting

[AnotherStander]

I also asked if she feels in the last 6 months of seeing MC, does she feel like she has actually tried and she agreed that she didn’t but didn’t know if she can give us a chance since feels she is out of love.

Very similar to what my W said during MC. Just know that many, many couples here have tried MC early in their sitches and I am not aware of a single instance where it helped at all, much less turned things around. More often than not the WAS just uses it as an excuse to say "I tried everything and this proves that it's over."

She said to give her more space so she can make a decision on even if she wants to try.

That's exactly what she needs, give it to her.

Same day I called OM’s family and got his number and called him and texted him so we can talk but he did not.

Why would you do that? Don't try to contact OM, that just comes off as controlling and manipulative behavior.

I perused more and she withdrew more.

Read Dobson's Love Must Be Tough, he explains this dynamic in detail. The more you pursue the faster she runs in the opposite direction. That's why you have to stop the pressure and pull back.

For months now I have been the one asking for a hug and it feels a one way and I have stopped asking since it makes me feel so rejected that my W that I love is so hurt by me and have lost the feelings of love to even give me a hug or touch me. It is painful and I don’t wish it on anyone.

Pursuing hugs/ kisses/ physical contact are all forms of pursuit and pressure. You should stop all pressure.

How do I know if this is the fog talking or if she is really done with our M?

Oh she's definitely done. She might change her mind later, but it's going to take months of time, space and consistent 180's on your part.

Is it still ok for us to go to MC even though W says she hates going there and almost always leaves crying?

MC is pressure, it's likely not helping and it is probably hurting. I would approach her, tell her it appears the MC is not helping things and ask her if she would like to stop going for a while. You can go by yourself if you think it'll help you.

She says she feels judged by me and other, and am trying to tell her that I am not judging her

This is a typical guy response, we think we're helping by telling them that they are just misunderstanding, but it's actually the wrong thing to say because it basically belittles her feelings and emotions. Don't do that! Ask her how it makes her feel. If she says "sad" then say something like "I can tell you're sad about feeling judged, I'm sorry you feel that way. I don't want to make you feel sad, tell me what I can do differently in the future." And then LISTEN to what she says, and change your behavior accordingly!!

Is MC still right place to be since that is the only communication about our feelings and the M?

Now is not the time for that. talk about the M needs to be put on hold until she's ready for that, and that will likely take many, many months.