Compliments & Passive Aggressiveness..Work to do!

[SophieL]

I haven't posted in years on the forum; however I often read many of the threads.

I just have to respond to this:

. Speaking only for myself, I notice that lately I feel defensive if someone challenges what a DB coach says.

To be fair, I usually assume (but not always) there's cherry picking or serious editing going on by the poster and not that the DB coach is off base.

I don't think SM34 was in any way challenging what his DB coach was saying. In fact he appears to be doing exactly what his coach is saying even thought its contradictory to what most of the posters on his thread have been advising.

[SM34]

All I can says is.... WOW

While I was enjoying a Sound Meditation and then getting the BEST sleep I have in months, this is was all going down on my thread!

I am a little flattered that so many people care about my sitch. I know many of you feel I have a chance to fix my M, and I like to believe thats why people like 25, starsky, denver etc.. stick around despite their frustrations with me.

I think there is something to be said for the way this board has changed. I am only new here, and honestly I spend most of the time reading OLD threads from the 2009 and 2010 era. This appears to be the GOLDEN era for this board, when people offered good advise without too much personal judging.

I think, and this is just MY OPINION, there are a lot of folks who have been on here for years, giving up their own personal time, doing something they are not paid for, and helping those of us who arrive here in droves. Hurting and in a hole, we need all of their assistance in picking ourselves up.

Because those folks have explained the affair fog, the speaking in negatives, the confusion, the lack of sound decision making etc.. of the WAS or MLCer, SOOO many times in past years, they now skip that step with some of the newer members.

The vets sometimes launch into what you need to do and keep drilling the GALing home, every single post. And also your 180s are drilled into your head. It is a good approach for the folks that don't question what they are doing, but less effective for people like myself who want to understand what they are up against, so as to better handle situations with the WAS when there is no time to get answers from the vets. Spur of the moment comments or answers to the WAS are hard when you do not understand what is going on in their mind.

To me that is the stark difference between the old posts and the new ones. I read threads from the old days from Satrsky, Denver, GH31, Mr Bond, etc.. and I honestly I learn more from that. They were breaking new grounds in the ways to implement WMD's concepts and to walk in their shoes is a great experience.

However, having said that, I still do think there is much to be learned from the gracious folks who dedicate their time to helping us. But some need to realize, as cat said, that some of their frustration with not "getting through" to someone, is in large part because we don't always understand what and why and how. I know why they take that strategy....because they believe it doesn't matter what your WAs thinks etc.. all that matter is you doing something with yourself that will attract them.

They even sometimes come down hard on people about their own M faults and the things we did that brought us here when in reality you may not be such a bad person, or such a bad spouse, and often times did not deserve this outcome. Many MANY times it is our WAS that is broken. At least that is my take on it. Still, the approach for the LBS is the SAME regards of whther it is them or the WAS that is broken and so many vets have "skipped" the part where you WAS is screwed up and has chemicals in their head, and fog etc..

I see Sandi STILL posts to people about this. She has been there herself and can attest to the power of the chemicals in someone's brain and how they are blinded to the "correct" path. I can't seem to get Sandi's attention on my thread, but I do follow religiously her comments on other people's thread. But even with Sandi, some of her older posts are more along those lines, cautioning people of what they are up against, and how it will take time for their spouse to "awaken". \

The new approach by some is to disregard this notion, because that leads you to scramble to work on yourself. Putting too much emphasis on the brokenness of the WAS may cause you to do nothing with yourself. I understand it completely! And it is effective for many! But sometimes us LBS want to have SOME comfort in knowing that we were not such bad spouses, and that the WAS has a ton of issues with self esteem, with childhood experiences, with divorces of their parents etc.. And this comfort was definitely dished out in HUGE quanities in the older threads.

this is also why I like conversing with GH31 who seems to have disappeared from the board right now. He speaks MAN-ese as he calls it. He gives men the hard up truth about how distorted the logic of their WAW's are, he reminds us of the constant lies they tell, and how to deflect it and push forward. He doesn't blame the LBS for everything that happened as some of the others do.

I LOVED reading Starsky's old threads! I know I told him recently he is an inspiration to me, and to many other men here. And although he also delivers some 2x4's occassionally, he is also gentle and supportive of the hurt and pain we are in. I admire that gentleman GREATLY.

25, has been instrumental in my growth so far. I know she may think that I am not taking it in, but I am. I seriously am. She has made me think about the anti social tendencies I have, she has reminded me that my W point of you is probably completely different to mine, she has lead on a path to try to figure out if I may be border line Aspergers Syndrom guy.

She has also given me GREAT advise on how to compliment (after the 2x4 of course but then it wouldn't be 25 without at least one of those on each post). so have people like Adinva who did a stellar job working with me on my 180s and developing them. Tallula, although much newer on here than those folks, has also had some wonderful things to add to my situation. And I know they ALL get on me all the time, but I see it is NOTHING but love for me. I think if they didn't think I could actually stand a chance at bringing my severely disillusion wife back to reality, they may have given up a long time ago.

Crimson has also jumped in and given a lot of usefule advice which has caused me to comtemplate the type of person I am. He is a business type person too, and made me realize that I may be overworking, or being "the boss" at home too.

AnotherStander has been VERY inspirational because his posts and comments are ALWAYS upbeat and uplifting. Rarely and 2x4's in those posts.

So all in all, there is a balance between postives and negatives between each poster on my thread, and even within posts written by the same person. At times they tighten on me, and at times they recognize the difficultly me and others like me are having (especially only 3 months into something that could be a year or more long).

I have been accused a lot of trying to teach or preach etc..when all I mean to do is ask a question. I have also seen how all it takes is ONE person to post something like that for a barrage of more negative posts to flood in within minutes, ALL hammering about the same post. That can be frustrating because I feel like I am misunderstood.

I am an extremely intelligent person, and every IQ test I have taken has consistently put me over 140. So way above average. Its just that as you all know, NOTHING could have prepared any of us for what has happened to us, ripping our lives and our families into pieces. It is hard!! Sometimes we just need someone to just say "Hey man, its not all your fault. Your wife is screwed up and most likely a little damaged by her broken home experience." or something so that we don't go to bed every night blaming ourselves for all that has gone wrong.

I mentioned this before. I said that the only reason my wife is the WAS and not me, is our upbringing. I was raised to believe marriage is FOREVER. Regardless of what happens, you STICK with your spouse. You never leave their side. My parents are still by each others sides, 42 years later. And it is NOT because my dad is a better spouse than me. And it is NOT because my mother has less faults than my WIFE. It is because they share the common belief that marriage IS till death do you part. And although I have read many sitches on here where even I believe that marriage should end because it is a disaster, the MAJORITY of us are here because our spouse does not share this fundamental core belief in the sanctity of marriage.

I don't let the negatives posted about me get to me, because I am intelligent enough to understand this. I know that I am not as broken as people here make me out to be, and that is only a tactic to get you off your ass. I understand that even the vets don't believe we are all broken either! Its there way of lighting a fire under your ass, and they all know that at the end of your journey you will realize you were not so broken, but that all they told you to do with yourself has helped you grow.

I think it was Denver (or AnotherStander?) who recently posted about this on their own thread. he spoke of how he now realizes that A LOT of the problems were in his wife's head. And much of what needed fixiing was in his wife.

Anyway, this post has become too long so let me wrap it up. I value everyone's opinions on my sitch and what needs to be done. I have learned to listen and absorb, and process, AND implement. I have also learned that I should seek help here to better myself, and leave the strategy of bringing my wife back, to my DB Coach.

My DB Coach sees that my wife wanted to be pursued more in our marriage. I did not do a good job in showing her that she is desired, or even desirable. So the first loser that popped up and told her she was hot, rode of into the sunset with her. Laurie sees that I need to counter that with some pursuing of my own.

She knows that my wife said "You didn't even fight for our marriage". On the forums I was told to ignore that comment, and it was affair script. And yes it probably is, but Laurie still thinks it is related to how I did not pursue enough at the very beginning when she told me she was having an EA with some guy.

I research the HELL out of things as you all know. Any my FAST research led me to this site, and to the DR book within DAYS of the BD and so I quickly started to detach and try to do my own thing. That is most likely what lead to W thinking I didn't even fight (read: pursue). Laurie thinks Wife probably feels I am ok with this, and that is why I am not "fighting" or pursuing.

To end my post, I would like to say thank you to ALL of you for coming back to my thread all the time. I know it can be frustrating but I am trying...I really am. And when I post, I am not trying to offend or put people off. I put a lot of my opinions in my post so they can be analyzed not so they can be taken as me "teaching" you anything.

And now for what I actually came here to report today

Sound meditation was AWESOME! If you havent tried it already, definitely do try it. The best hour and half in a long time and I will be joining those folks again next week.

Will need a new thread soon. Lets try to put all this behind us and move forward with self growth. My next thread will deal solely (as much as possible) to GALing.

Thanks to ALL of you for finding my case important enough to even argue amongst each other on your unique approaches.

[SM34]

Sophie

Your last post was in August of 2009. I AM HONORED that you felt the need to post on my thread after almost 4 years of just reading.

Please stick around for more adventures of SM34

[AnotherStander]

Seriously though. What do u think of the concepts of mr nice guy? I mean is it true that being too 'nice' is what landed all of us here?

Did you read the book or just some of the forum postings? Because I did read the book, and the whole point of that book is guys that act nice are really NOT AT ALL nice, but deeply troubled. They pretend to be nice and warm and fuzzy and "here let me get the door for you" and "isn't my car the coolest, look at how clean I keep it" while they're really doing everything to seek acknowledgement and acceptance from others. They are manipulators in the worst possible way. They use their niceness to try to overcome all their underlying issues. When they hurt others and are held accountable for it they hide behind their "nice" facade and try to turn the tables, "how could I ever do something like that, don't you see I'm a nice guy?" The book is all about showing "nice" guys just how narcissistic, controlling and manipulative they are and it teaches them how to recognize what they're doing and stop that behavior. Thus the title "No More Mister Nice Guy." The title DOES NOT mean quit being nice to others because you're being too nice and you're a doormat, it means quit pretending to be something you're not.

So again, if you'll pardon a 2x4, it seems you've read bits of something and completely misinterpreted what it means.

[leopoldstotch]

AS hit the nail on the head in regards to [*] suggested you read it to see if any of it described you. I do agree that you should stop cherry picking things from so many different books. How bout focusing your posts on you from now on. The majority of your posts are focused on your W and OM. When you are focused on her you can't work on you.

So SM in the event the your M doesn't work out what exactly are you doing to prepare yourself for it?

[adinva]

SM I can't speak for all of us but you definitely did not correctly assume why I've been posting to you. I've been posting to you because I saw hope for you...

to improve your relationships by changing yourself.

Not hope for your sitch or your strategies, or getting your W to do anything, nor any useless attempt to predict what she might do.

I think one reason why people have been so frenzied here is, like a convert who's seen the light, when your eyes have been opened to a different way of looking at things, that you never understood before, that made it possible to survive and thrive the unfathomable rejection of your spouse, you feel it would almost be wrong not to try to help another who doesn't seem to see it.

I guess that can be annoying, and sometimes rude, but speaking for myself it came from a belief that I might have a chance to help someone who's struggling, and in doing so reinforce my own learning.

I'm going to take a step back because I think the attention is somehow reinforcing the exact same habits you came here with.

I wish you well and hope that one day I find you really living, and happy.

[25yearsmlc]

I haven't posted in years on the forum; however I often read many of the threads.

I just have to respond to this:

. Speaking only for myself, I notice that lately I feel defensive if someone challenges what a DB coach says.

To be fair, I usually assume (but not always) there's cherry picking or serious editing going on by the poster and not that the DB coach is off base.

I don't think SM34 was in any way challenging what his DB coach was saying. In fact he appears to be doing exactly what his coach is saying even thought its contradictory to what most of the posters on his thread have been advising.

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I did NOT mean SM was challenging his DB coach. If you read the next sentence I wrote, I was referring to other readers/posters. And again, I'm only speaking for myself.

[SM34]

Cant we just all get along?

I am looking on meetup for another gal for this weekend. I like he meditation and now its time for something physical.

I see a kickball gane ..nice

[SM34]

I will start a new thread tonight.

Time to really focus ....

So, I will recap my 180s, Lauries advance, and the GAL effort.

Please stop by.....thanks!

[cat04]

Cant we just all get along?

SM,

Unfortunately no, we can't just all get along. And that is ok.

Something about you though...

You talked about us LBS not being all horrible and it being mostly the WAS.

I suppose that is possible, but NONE of us is perfect. We all had contributions to the issues in our M that got us here.

That is what posters are trying to get you to see. NOT that you are horrible, but there are things you can do differently, better, more or less of, things that you can change to make you a better partner.

In my sitch, many of our male friends stated more than once that they would love to have a W like me. I did all of the housework, got up at 4am to make my H dinner to take to work, took care of the bills, the kid, the animals...Everything...

Not horrible right?

To my X, I did way too much. I didn't allow him to "grow up". And to him, he felt like I did that stuff out of duty, not love.

So that was something that I had to change and it was hard. Hard to watch him learn how to cook, do his own laundry, grocery shop...I know it sounds stupid but it's the truth.

The outcome, he felt/feels much better about himself.

Your comment about everyone getting along...you are a fixer aren't you?

It's ok, most of us here are. However, not everyone or everything needs fixing...

Sometimes they want to figure it out on their own and we have to step back and let that happen.

Just like the debate on this thread. We have to be open to each other and sometimes, we have to agree to disagree...