Finally getting it after three months...

[jp787]

"This was hopeful until the last sentence..."

Sorry:) wasn't trying to give you bad news.
Counselor just said when a third person is involved it complicates so many emotions on both spouses and its really tough while it is still going on.
If the spouse having an A drops it, then obviously the odds get better for reconciliation

Don't fool yourself OR Believe your wife will fool herself,

when the reality of having TWO married's leaving their spouses - WHICH ALSO involves children on both ends, sinks in.

The myth of "blended families" is increasingly well known. The Brady Bunch worked for 2 reasons.

1) both former spouses were dead and 2) it was a TV show.

It's enough to get most spouses to change their mind. (Since you seem to focus on "statistics", here's one. Most affairs do NOT result in divorce and remarriage to the person w/whom they had an affair. Those that do, have an 80% chance of divorce...)

Alsa, there is so much mind reading and negative projections on your thread,

so much CHOSEN hopelessness,

I find it hard to engage in all this speculation & predicting. BUT---here we go.

Here is the WAW letter I mentioned to you. See if any of it applies to your sitch.


FROM A WAW TO A LBS HUSBAND -A H WHO HAS CHANGED AND WONDERS WHY HIS WAW HAS NOT COME HOME YET, & HOW SHE CAN BE AT ALL INTERESTED IN OM….

"When I read your interactions with your wife, I could so easily identify with your wife's feelings/words/sentiments. I have been in her position in my M. I was the ignored, the devalued, the one who was treated as less than.

One of the things that I have tried my hardest not to do, is not to engage with another man. Not just because of my marriage vows, but because I knew that when I truly engaged in any type of R with another man, it would make it that much harder to ever reconcile with my H.

Because being treated differently (better) than the way he treated me would lessen him so much in my eyes. So, I can see where your W is coming from.

When you've been mistreated to the point where you actually let go of your R enough to let another person into your heart or bed or whatever, it takes a boatload of work to get back on a page where you're recommitted to being with your S - and those uncertainties that she's expressed to you, I don't know if you truly, truly fathom how deep they run.

Six months of getting back on a page where you treat her the way that any wife should be treated does not even scratch the surface of the years, the intrinsic devaluing that occurs when you're systematically mistreated for such a stretch of time.

And I promise you that while you have recommitted and worked for 6 months, your W has simply been trying to get to a point where she can even buy into the changes, where she can even think that you might have changed and not scoff at the thought.

Because when you build up hope again and again and again in your H and he crushes it again and again and again, you develop a thick skin, a protective doubt, a conditioned response to even the slightest, grainiest seed of hope.

You are taught that when you hope, you will be disappointed. When you try, you will fail. You are taught that you will never be what he wants and it is hard to shake what you have come to believe is reality.

And for the changes that you've made to have come only when she walked away and OM became competition, I can definitely see how she can doubly doubt that you truly want to be in a M with her, and not just to win.

Even you today say that you are not sure that you don't just want to win.

Step 1 - figure that sh!t out ASAP. Because if you actually do manage to convince her that you really do want her and really have recommitted to her and you actually just want to win, you'll put her through hell.

This unfortunately rings true for me. W tried over and over to communicate with me that she wanted me there, but I was off somewhere else in my head. I treated her like sh!t for years, then was emotionally gone. She gave me several chances to change and I failed or didnt even try. I do wonder if it is salvageable at times, yet I have woken up, this time is different, I cant explain it or prove it, just know it in my heart. I can not give up no matter how bleak it seems. I love my W and want to make up for the past, want to make a new better/different tomorrow.

[jp787]

I just got the 5 Languages Of Love and The Happiness Trap. Starting with the happiness trap today, looks like a good book. After the first chapter I fear that the only way I will get through this is to accept the fact that I may loss my marriage to my wife, yet I can be ok. The problem is I am still at I refuse to accept that I can loose my marriage and wife, it would be easier to cut off my left arm above the elbow with a rusty hack saw. So I guess I have some serious work to do. Act as if... Wow I applaud all of you who can do this, I just can't yet and idk how to get there. I am seriously obsessed with my wife and cant budge from it emotionally. I get it intellectually, but emotionally I am a mess. I dont know who to be OK with out her, I base everything on her being by my side and have for over 20 years. What a mess I am in.

Yes, you are in a mess. A lot of us have been in this state and I know for myself that I sometimes cycle back into that but don't let it control me and it doesn't last long.

Agreed, yet this is when I make mistakes and show my pain, which is not good…

I haven't read completely thru you thread but it sounds like you are emotionally dependent on your wife for your well being. Do you have friends you can confide in about what is going on. An outlet. A pastor. This website is good but it is really helpful to have some people you can discuss this with face to face. And not friends who will report back to your wife or take sides between you or your wife. Friends that will be supportive and compassionate and understanding.

I am very emotionally dependent to W and don’t have friends that I feel comfortable sharing this with. I need to make new friends as part of my GAL, as this is something I have fear of doing. Unfortunately I cant make new friends and unload this on them… But I do need to make new friends for myself, I agree.

Reading these books (Happiness Trap and 5LL) is good. I have read 5LL among other books. I wouldn't make conclusions from these books or think there will be an answer to your sitch on page 178. Just use the information in these books to grow as a person - for yourself. I do believe what I've learned in various books and this website have made me grow and change and my W has noticed it.

Thank you

And I think it is also good from time to time to take a break from the books and this website and just get out and do stuff for yourself (and kids). Relax, breath, exercise.

Agreed.

Let go of catastrophic thinking. The only thing you can control is yourself and you will feel better if you don't obssess. You have got to quickly get yourself to a point where you know you will have a happy and fulfilling life with or without wife.

Ha! This is a huge goal for me.

[VeryGrateful]

I am very emotionally dependent to W and don’t have friends that I feel comfortable sharing this with. I need to make new friends as part of my GAL, as this is something I have fear of doing. Unfortunately I cant make new friends and unload this on them… But I do need to make new friends for myself, I agree.

This is good you have an understanding of building a support network. I understand the fear you might have of making new friends. Once you get the ball rolling you would be surprised how it can build. Of course, that doesn't happen overnight. You would also be surprised at how sympathetic and understanding men can be with men. I am having conversations with men in my support network that does not include sports or what's going on at work. A big change for me.

The support network doesn't need to be large. I'd say 2 to 5 is good.

One thing I did was join a men's group at church. Two men in the group reached out to me when I shared my story. It wasn't easy to do but so glad I did it and as a result there are a couple of guys I get together with and share our relationships. That is good therapy. It's beneficial for me and the friends I get together with.

[jp787]

You would also be surprised at how sympathetic and understanding men can be with men.

I will defiantly keep that in mind, thank you

[jp787]

W has gone very cold. No hugs, kisses or anything right now. She is working on all of the emotional trauma in he IC and she says it is like living it all over now, but with the knowledge that it is wrong. I really hope she has success getting through this. I know she is in pain and hurting and scared.
I am reading, working out and backing way off on contact with W. Only talking when she wants and listening and validating. I truly want her to succeed.
She has talked about moving home as she misses the girls. she has also said that everything about the house makes her scared, anxious or feel sick. She feels that she doesn't have a safe place, even at my moms. I asked why and she doesn't know.
She is a mess and is working so hard, yet it scares me if she comes home right now. I think that until she can become more stable it would be better to keep our distances. I also would like more time to change myself before we are put back together. I am stronger now, but not where I need to be, not yet.

[jp787]

I have a request. I know that I am an emotionally abusive husband. I have searched high and low for resources on help for someone like myself to change from this way of thinking/acting, but can only find information for women who are in relationships with emotionally abusive men.
If anyone has any links to article or books, I would appreciate it.
FYI, I am starting up with a new IC and will hopefully be able to address this there also.

[jp787]

W was officially diagnosed with having PTSD from her past abuse from her family and me.

[jp787]

W requested I just be a friend to her right now. Wow that hurt!!! I said absolutely! Even though it stings bad, I think it is a great place to start and be with her.

[VeryGrateful]

I am reading, working out and backing way off on contact with W. Only talking when she wants and listening and validating. I truly want her to succeed.

I'm glad to hear this. It does get easier over time. Wanting her to success is the right attitude. And your GAL activities are right on.

I have a request. I know that I am an emotionally abusive husband. I have searched high and low for resources on help for someone like myself to change from this way of thinking/acting, but can only find information for women who are in relationships with emotionally abusive men.
If anyone has any links to article or books, I would appreciate it.
FYI, I am starting up with a new IC and will hopefully be able to address this there also.

Not sure if this book is good for your situation, but I am currently reading. "Hold Me Tight: Seven Conversations for a Lifetime of Love". It is related to Emotionally Focused Therapy (EFT). Basically looks deeper than the issues at the surface. It really goes into building emotional connection and how partners communicate in a broken relationship. So far I like it and see some things in there that are true for my sitch. Kindle version was not too expensive. Anyway, like I said to you before I pick certain things out of the books I am reading but have no delusions that I'll find the answers to my problems. Just useful information to help me grow.

W requested I just be a friend to her right now. Wow that hurt!!! I said absolutely! Even though it stings bad, I think it is a great place to start and be with her.

If you look at the friendship ladder (as my IC explained) - intimate partner / close friend / friend / acquaintance / enemy - you are doing ok at the friendship level and given your sitch that is an ok place to be. Better than the enemy level!

[Sam1313]

I just got the 5 Languages Of Love and The Happiness Trap. Starting with the happiness trap today, looks like a good book. After the first chapter I fear that the only way I will get through this is to accept the fact that I may loss my marriage to my wife, yet I can be ok. The problem is I am still at I refuse to accept that I can loose my marriage and wife, it would be easier to cut off my left arm above the elbow with a rusty hack saw. So I guess I have some serious work to do. Act as if... Wow I applaud all of you who can do this, I just can't yet and idk how to get there. I am seriously obsessed with my wife and cant budge from it emotionally. I get it intellectually, but emotionally I am a mess. I dont know who to be OK with out her, I base everything on her being by my side and have for over 20 years. What a mess I am in.

I thought the same thing about being by my wife all the time for the rest of my life. I know it hurts more than you can describe. I lived it. Here is my advice. Suck it up and act as if. The biggest mistakes I made while DBing was when I let my emotions get in the way and acted needy. You may think that you will not be OK without her but you need to show her that that you will be OK with out her. You are getting great advice from people on this forum. If she it talking about moving back in there is hope. Do not drive her away. Read the Divorce remedy and the LRT!! Again - suck it up!