I'm looking for some insight, understanding, what the LBS should be doing. Basically looking for sucess stories.
What caused you to be a WAS? How were you feeling while walking away? How did the fog lift? What brought it about? How did you approach your SO about reconciling?
I doubt this is the answer you are looking for but there is no magic bullet, unfortunately. I am not sure that I can tell you what does work, but I can tell you what doesn’t work from the standpoint of a WAS. Please understand that this is from the viewpoint of an LBS turned WAS. My H left and came home. I eventually left with a lot of grief…
1) Words that are not followed by action. Promises to change have no weight because the spouse has dealt with an extended period of “offending” actions that have literally been burned upon their brain and their heart. Let only your positive actions be your words.
2) Holier than thou thinking. I have noticed several spouses on here using their “sacred” vows as an excuse to damn the spouses for walking away. Oh I was famous for this, believe me. However, what the LBS refuses to recognize when engaged in this type of thinking is that they, too, turned their back on their vows. Love, honor, cherish… oh how often we failed on these vows.
3) A lack of real, sustained change. The LBS thinks that they can stop their offending behavior for a week and all will be cured. Not hardly. Each time the WAS “slips up,” they only reinforce to the WAS why they decided to walk away. My H was famous for this. He would promise to change and he would for a couple of days. Then he would slip up and apologize up and down and explain to me that he’s been good most of the time.
4) Change with ulterior motives. Change with motives other than to improve yourself, ALWAYS results in backsliding. If you are only changing to get your spouse back, do not believe for one second they don’t know this, they do. These people have been married to you for a long time. They know you better than anyone. And to think they do not know when you are doing something with an ulterior motive, you are sadly mistaken. Understand very very clearly that your chances of reconciling your marriage are not great. You better be on here to recognize your faults, make the necessary changes and become a stronger person. If you spouse comes back, great. But if he/she doesn’t, hopefully you are better for the next relationship. If you don’t have this attitude, I wouldn’t worry too much about this divorce, you’re facing another one.
5) Making the WAS feel guilty. I have found that this has two profound results. First, it makes the WAS feel bad about themselves. Whenever someone is faced with being with a person that makes them feel bad about themselves, they tend to flee. It’s a natural human response. We want to surround ourselves by people who uplift us, not damn us. Second, it builds resentment. I have been made to feel guilty and it ticks me off because my H didn’t feel much guilt for his offending behavior… rather, he’s justified it…. Which brings me to point #6.
6) Justifying your bad behavior. I know I was a bad wife or husband but I was going through this or that or whatever. Who cares? There is no justification for bad behavior… ever. So when your spouse is presenting you with a list of “wrongs,” you should shut up and listen. Does it mean they are always right? I’m not sure how to answer that. I mean if your spouse feels a certain way, it’s not about right or wrong. It’s about their perspective and their feelings and the very reasons why the walls between you both have been built. You might not agree with them, but you don’t have to. This is not about you and your feelings, it is about them and their feelings. You want to build a bridge back? Shut the heck up and listen. It doesn’t always seem fair, but let’s face it, you are trying to get them back, not the reverse.
7) Games or a constantly escalating tit for tat. “If you are seeing another woman, then fine, I’m going out to date too.” If you want to date, that’s fine. Your marriage is over. But if you are using jealousy as a means of making your spouse “think,” you will do THE EXACT OPPOSITE. Trust me. Also, responding to their crappy behavior with more crappy behavior will NEVER help you. I believe in boundaries. I believe in saving yourself. I do NOT believe in being unkind. In fact, if you ask my H what was one of the biggest reasons he came back, he’ll tell you that it was because I always remained kind.
8) Airing your dirty laundry all over town. Dear lord, do NOT do this. If you want your spouse back, the LAST thing you want to do is create a bad environment for them. That alone will keep them away. Shame is a POWERFUL motivator… unfortunately, it’s a motivator to run far, far away. Think very carefully who you speak to and what you share. I know how hard this is. My H carried on an affair with a woman who worked in the same office both of us worked in. Everyone was aware of the affair. It was humiliating. However, I chose not to talk to anyone there about it. All I would have accomplished is making a bad situation much, much worse.
9) Letting your emotions control the moment. Another thing I have had such a hard time with. I alternated constantly between I am completely done and I want to try again. Now, if I kept that to myself, that is fine. But I didn’t. I let my H in on my roller coaster ride. And believe me, that did nothing to build trust back in our relationship.
10) Lack of trust. DO WHAT YOU SAY YOU ARE GOING TO DO… ALWAYS. You cannot afford to slip up. If you are going to pick up the kids at 5, be there at 5. If you are going to deposit money in the bank on Monday, you better do it on Monday. If you are going to give your spouse space, then give your spouse space. Too often, our anger gets to us and we use that as an excuse to go back on our word of something or another. Again, as an LBS, you cannot afford to do this.
11) Lack of compassion. A lot of the LBS’s feel so wronged that they lack any type of compassion or understanding of the WAS. This is a grave error. Believe me, I think the WAS’s have issues same as the LBS. But the LBS is on here looking for compassion and understanding while often “trashing” the WAS. When you do this, you show to your WAS and everyone else that you have no interest in building a connection or have understanding for your WAS, but rather you are looking to drum up support for your side of things. The LBS so often doesn’t think beyond that. So what if you have everyone in the world agreeing with your side of things? Where does that get you? It might make your pride feel a bit better but it sure as anything isn’t going to get your spouse back.
12) Pride. If you want to know what I think is the #1 killer of any relationship, it’s pride. We are so intent on being right, we are so intent on not feeling badly because someone has left us that we lack genuine, authentic communication. We become so clouded by what wrong has been done to us that we lack the introspection to understand what wrong we have done. We are constantly in a state of lobbing insults and justifying our own bad behavior. Get rid of the pride and get down to figuring out what YOUR hand was in the breakdown of the marriage. Forget what the spouse has done because it doesn’t matter right this second. What have YOU done? Fix that.
I’m sure there are a ton more, but this is what I can think of off the top of my head. Please understand, by no means am I saying that all the fault lies with the LBS. I also think that the LBS could do everything PERFECTLY and still lose their spouse. And a warning to the LBS, I think there comes a time when things truly become so damaging for you, that you do need to move on and save yourself. This is especially the case when dealing with abuse or addictions. I am not saying always, but it’s something to be mindful of. You have to always keep your own welfare in mind. There is no right or wrong here… I wish there were because it would make everything so much easier.
Number 8 on your post hit home pretty good. My W is the WAS in our story, but, she's also the one who made our problems public. Being part owner of her restaurant made it really easy for her to say something negative about me or our kids to someone, and have someone else hear it.
Yes, I talked to a few very close friends and OM's wife, so I'm a bit guilty as well. And I don't know for sure if they gossiped to anyone or not. Being where I am now, I don't really recommend doing either. I got a lot more from my IC than either of those actions.
We live in a small town, and I couldn't even go get gas in my car without hearing 'do you have any idea what your wife is saying about you?' from people I barely even knew. I would usually interrupt them and tell them to believe what they wanted, but, I wasn't having a conversation about my marriage with them.
Eventually I just started going to the next town for most of what I needed. Since she left the restaurant she helped build, things have tapered off and we're no longer the only topic of conversation in town, though, I do still think we're in the top 10 or 15, though. This issue caused a lot of damage that may end up being irreparable, though I am trying very hard to DB. And I've gotten MUCH better responses since I changed how and what I say and do.
What caused you to be a WAS? How were you feeling while walking away? How did the fog lift? What brought it about? How did you approach your SO about reconciling?
The reason for me for becoming a WAS was simply too many years of unresponsiveness to my complaints, and not liking the person I had become in order to actually get a response. The feeling is a combination of resignation, relief, anticipation, fear, regret, anger, resentment, disappointment, confusion, determination, desperation, loneliness, angst, loss, emptiness, bitterness, sadness, and more -- often felt in rapid succession of one another. For me, the "fog" has not left lifted, because H has still not addressed my complaints, and he's regularly hitting about 11 out of 12 of the points LIS listed above.
There's some great info here, thanks. My WAW & I are now D. I wish I would have learned about this site a year ago. We have been D for 11 months. While the OM is gone, she rapidly went through several more and has had the same BF for 8 months now.
She has not grieved the R at all. I think she's still in the fog. As for me, I did everything wrong (needy, clingy, begging) during the D and after. I'm just starting to GAL & move on. I'm hopeful for reconciliation one day but realize she will have go make it through the fog on her own.
Me: 48 EW: 40 D8, D12 Married 13 wonderful years D in Apr-12
Do the WAS grieve the relationship at all? or is it grieving only from their point of view (all the bad in the marriage)? It seems they are more relieved than hurting over the loss. I have to wonder b/c my XH went right from our 21 years to OW while we were partially separated and its been 2 years and he's still with her. I really don't know if he grieved. Never acted like it bothered him.
M: 49 H: 49 S23 D24 (disabled from car accident 6 yrs ago) M: 21yrs BD: 1 month after D home from hospital (after 6 months) D: 3/11/11 Moved: 10/11/11 to FL for SCI recovery X: engaged w/OW
As a WAW, yes, I grieved the death of my marriage. I still do. We have been separated almost 2 months and it still hurts. I think a LBS could increase their odds of reconciliation if they tried really hard to do more listening and less talking. I know that sounds selfish but hear me out ...
For me (and most WAS) we have tried to have our needs understood and met for years. In addition to telling you that we want a better marriage, We have tried some or all of the following: 1). Guessing what our spouse wanted and trying to meet that need, with the logic of "Maybe the reason he doesn't want to touch me or talk to me is because HIS needs aren't being met? He can't give back to the marriage if he isn't getting enough out of it." So we redouble our efforts to do/be what we think you want.
2). We tried to pare back our needs to the bare minimum. In my head, I think of this as The 800 calorie/day Diet. This is where we try to do as much as we can for ourselves and only request the things we cannot do on our own (we do the yard work or most of the parenting or all of the cooking/cleaning/etc). We think that if we only ask for a few things we will seem less needy and you will recognize how hard we work - so you will want to do things with/for us.
3). We try to accept the marriage as it is and chastise ourselves for wanting to feel love, passion, or emotional connection. We argue with ourselves that since our spouse didn't engage in abuse, adultery, or addiction we have no right to end the marriage. We chip away at ourselves and tell ourselves that it isWRONG to need more from our marriage than we are getting today - that we have no right to want a partner, a sex life, or a friendship with our spouse.
We may have tried therapy with you and/or separately from you.
But the big thing is that many of us WAS have been trying to get you to listen to us and when that didn't work we tried to ignore or push down our own needs. We tried to deny we even HAVE needs and after we leave (or make you leave) we finally start listening to ourselves again and listening to our needs. It feels GOOD to acknowledge that we have needs and we aren't crazy to want these things. Whenever we see the LBS, we are reminded of the time when we couldn't even admit we wanted more out of life and how much it hurt to try so hard to be what you wanted ... And never succeed enough that you would pay attention.
In reality, you (LBS) probably were going thru your own struggle and trying to have your needs met. We were like two blind people communicating only thru mime. But it's hard to see that, and even when you do see it, it's hard to believe you and the LBS can communicate any better. If you want to change that - you need to LISTEN without defending. You need to ask open questions and ask more and more of them. You need the WAS to feel heard and understood and accepted and believed. And you need to really think about the situation from both perspectives (yours and theirs) so that when you talk, the WAS can hear that you really have grown in your understanding of what went wrong and what might fix it again.
