I believe the EA never went physical. However the OM messaged me this morning, first thing. Since I know him and we helped him out a LOT I felt very betrayed on both counts. Regardless he messaged me and I told him he needed to go away for good. Leave her alone and block her number. I believe he will do that, I believe he's gone now.
I just get confused with the 180 strategies, I mean if someone is telling you how you treated them and you do a 180 opposite of that, it's really not what they expect. I am working on myself, I've got a lot of homework from my counselor.
She's cordial to me, polite even. In fact she just left after collecting a few things with our daughter. I'm not trying to turn her off at all, in fact lighting her fire is what I'm after.
We didn't date very long at all actually. We didn't get that "Getting to know you" time most people enjoy before we had our first crisis and that was the oldest D cutting. A month after that she was raped while at her biodads. Not long after that W decided to quit her job and go to college. Not long after that she moved in with me.
So you see we've only known each other four years total but we've had a lifetime of crisis to deal with. We'll be married for three years this November.
She always had a problem with the house. She hates this house and blamed me for things I didn't do to it before we even met. I'm not a handyman. My skills don't work that way, I suck at it actually. She wanted it all fixed up but she barely worked part time most of the time she was in school and still I managed to get some repairs done on my income.
Sexually I lost interest. She has a temper and eventually I just lost my desire for sex on a regular basis like I had with her before. Those were the key things that caused friction, I mean other than the regular crisis that popped up like us being so broke I took a part time job at Walmart.
She wanted to do normal couple things together but for the most part we were so broke I was overwhelmed with medical bills. To give you an example of what we dealt with over our marriage and a bit before it breaks down like this, cutting D, raped D, strike at my job, my dad dies while on strike, I took a job delivering food during strike, her dad's house burned in fire, her dad moved in with us for a while, our vehicles vandalized, three of them, our fence vandalized, attempted suicide by D, many emergency room visits and hospital stays. That's just off the top of my head, there is at least half a dozen more I'm not thinking of but just as serious.
She said we never felt like a normal couple that just does things.
'We talked, ..yelled' Words will not change her mind at all. She has to see the differences. You are wasting your energy and emotions in trying to convince her of what you are trying to change in your R.
She feels numb to you for a reason..... It is to protect her from the pain of her emotions. You will not change this. Only she can lose this numbness over time - time and space from you to sort out her own feelings.
The more you 'chase' her the more you push her away because she wants space and time...
DO NOT twist the advice you receive on these forums to how you perceive you should act in repairing your R. You are in the thick of it and so - you cant see the woods for the trees. By twisting the advice, you reduce the effectiveness of it.
I made this mistake.
It just prolonged the pain.
Follow the 'Rules'
Give unbiased accounts of your R and your actions to the forum and truly listen to the advice.
It really is sage advice.
Here you will get untainted advice... Listen to family and friends and you will receive tainted advice that is calculated to make you feel better - not improve your R.
Which would you prefer..??
Lastly for now, your time perception is wrong. You are still counting the days and weeks.
It may take months - months - for you to see any improvement in your R, if at all. All you are doing is hurting yourself and still looking backwards...
Regards, Gyn.
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
This a post from 'Accuray'.. Basically he put it better than I tried..
Security is important to married people in general, and pushing your spouse away as she's done is really taking a big chance in terms of losing your security. People generally aren't willing to do that unless they have someplace to land, in terms of someone else to comfort them and share intimacy.
Usually when it happens quickly as you've described, your wife started out in a friendship that very very gradually crossed the line into becoming inappropriate. When she realized that she was over the line, she felt very guilty and conflicted about what she was doing. The new relationship feels *so good* that it's almost impossible to give up. Therefore, the only way to feel good about things is to convince herself that she's being righteous, and the only way to do that is to make you the villain, or the source of her discontent.
Unfortunately, when you get to this point, she resents you. If you want to save your marriage, whatever you do right now needs to be measured against a yardstick of resentment -- will your actions create more resentment, or less?
When you pursue her, she resents you because you are expecting her to reciprocate and she doesn't want to.
When you make her responsible for your feelings by being upset around her, she resents you because she doesn't want to be responsible for you.
If you shame her, she will resent you for making her feel badly.
Basically ANY form of pursuit or relationship discussion will result in resentment and push her farther away.
So what can you do?
Unfortunately, you can't begin repairing things while another man is involved, it's just impossible. All you can do is (1) not make things worse and push her away further, and (2) spend the time to work on yourself and become a husband that only a fool would leave.
This is a marathon, not a sprint, and the majority of it is simply a waiting game. The best thing you can do is give her space, and create a life for yourself. Get out and meet new people, pick up new hobbies. Be pleasant to her, treat her like a friendly co-worker. Do not share intimate details of how you're feeling, don't go out of your way to do anything for her. Don't seek her out.
If she approaches you, you can mirror, but do not escalate. i.e. if she hugs you, you can hug her back, but don't kiss her, that kind of thing. Do NOT say "I love you" for any reason. There is no need to explain how you're feeling or what you want because right now she understands how you feel and she doesn't care -- it's not about you right now.
This is a horrible, horrible thing you're facing, but you're not alone. Post often, even if it's just journaling, and read the books. Realize that you will not see any progress or improvement for quite some time. Before that can happen, things with OM need to be over, she needs to grieve the loss of that relationship, she needs to see and believe that you are acting differently than you did in the past, and that a relationship with you in the future would be different and better than your old marriage. She doesn't want to go back there, so if she thinks it will be more of the same she won't be interested.
Take the time to understand what she needs, what your issues are, and what you need to do to be the best relationship partner possible. No matter what happens with her, that will serve you well -- you'll come out of this a better person and will have better relationships going forward, and that's the silver lining in an otherwise terrible turn of events.
Accuray.
Hope this helps.
Regards, Gyn.
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
I'm new and introducing myself. I asked my wife to leave Tuesday morning after I discovered evidence of an affair. I'm reading the Divorce Remedy now and it really does help a lot, my question would be is it a good idea for her to read this book as well? I can get it to her and I know she would probably be receptive to it.
Just to clarify, you kicked her out but you're hoping to reconcile, correct? There are reasons that she engaged in an EA. It's best not to dwell on the EA itself if you want her back, but rather seriously consider the problems she has pointed out in your M and immediately begin to change those aspects of yourself. She will notice the changes although initially she won't acknowledge them because she'll think you're just doing it as an effort to get her back, and that you'll then revert to the same old person that drove her away. You have to make a concerted effort to actually change yourself and not just go through the motions, and these changes must be permanent.
Originally Posted By: SadGuy2012
One of my wife's complaints about me is that she feels that she doesn't know much about me. That I never share personal stuff with her like my favorite Christmas or future dreams, childhood memories, things like that.
So essentially not talking to her is what she expects from me, not pursuing her is exactly what she expects. Pursuing her is the exact 180 of that.
Regarding that first thought, opening up to her and letting her get to know you would certainly be in line with DB and is an appropriate 180. She wants to know not just your thoughts but your feelings, so work on that too. Read the "5 Love Languages" if you haven't already, it has some great tips on how to communicate your feelings.
Regarding the 2nd thought, while pursuing may indeed be a 180 for you it's not a good idea at this time. The harder you pursue the more she'll pull away. Concentrate on 180's that don't put any pressure on her.
Originally Posted By: SadGuy2012
She and I had a long discussion last night. She was actually driving to her boyfriend's house and I called her on it. We talked, yelled, and argued about it.
No yelling or arguing or deep discussions! That's pressure. Again, DBing is about changing YOU, not HER. Change yourself into a man she can't resist.
Originally Posted By: SadGuy2012
I told her I am working hard on being a better husband, I am truly too. My counselor and I are working through my communication problems.
Good, but don't dwell on trying to tell her how much you've changed or what you're changing. Show her, don't tell her. Remember 180 #29:
"29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write."
Originally Posted By: SadGuy2012
My wife said that being separated is identical to being married to me, she's alone and not having sex. She said she wants to be desired, talked to, understood, and that I treated her like a piece of furniture or a possession. All true but I didn't realize that was what I was doing.
Count yourself lucky that she's telling you about these things, many women when they get to the WAW stage are done, they won't tell you anything about what brought them to that point. They feel like they've already tried and it's not worth the effort anymore. Whenever she opens up like this then it's a great opportunity to empathize, tell her you understand why she feels that way, that you appreciate her telling you this and you are committed to changing yourself based on her feedback. Then show her the changes as much as you can within the context of a separation.
Originally Posted By: SadGuy2012
She said she doesn't feel married to me so why should she care about what I want. She says I'm a great dad and want me involved that way and she wants us to be friendly but she doesn't want to reconcile with me. Our separation will be three weeks tomorrow, Tuesday the 4th of September.
The thing is that I don't know what short term goals apply here. She says she's numb and doesn't feel anything anymore.
Another DB tip is "don't believe anything she says and only half of what she does." She's angry, upset, confused and in turmoil right now. Do not argue with her feelings, just let her express them and empathize with her. And remember this is a marathon and not a sprint, prepare for this to take many months. Read DB and review the "baby steps" info, don't expect a big instant turnaround but rather watch for small signs.
Your M, and your family life, has suffered much more than most young couples. I hope you are seeing a very well trained therapist and not just some MC...b/c of having so many crises in such a short span of time.
Many MC's will tell you the opposite of how you need to deal with a WAW. For example, some will tell you to do all these things with your W (or for your W) that she has stated she wanted. But here's the thing......although she tried to tell you what she wanted from you in "past times".....is not going to work in the "here and now". That's why she won't respond to what you think she'll want from you. She's not going to do it "now" b/c she's numb. She feels like she has nothing else to give to you. She feels emotionally dead and she wants so badly to feel happy again.....and to feel in love.
It can happen. But you might as well prepare yourself for a very long stretch of time laid ahead. I'm not just talking "months", either. If you don't know for sure if you love her enough.....you'll find out.
Most of all, I pray that your family can heal from so much pain. I hope you'll take extra care of yourself b/c you will need it.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Wow that's alot to go through. Although after being together for 3 years prior to getting M'd, I'm not sure why you think there wasn't enough time to know each other.
From what I can see, the OM could be a form of escape from all the stress in your lives. Have the two of you ever attended any type of crisis counseling? It think that's what needs to happen first.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
