Not entirely sure what I hope to gain at this point, as I'm generally doing well and DBing, except for maybe some support and occasional insight. Here's a background of my sitch with WAS who also had EA last year. I'll try to keep it semi-short:
My background: Grew up with verbally and emotionally abusive F and cold, distant M. Generally very small, weak and quite intelligent growing up. Between the two, I was a mess. Depressed and suicidal from the age of 6 on, never got help for it until adulthood. Married young (20) and generally happy through my 20s, no depression, life was good. After two sons, 1st W focused almost entirely on them and I started feeling abandoned like I did as a child. Depression came back, but this time I got it treated. I became the WAS and D at 32 (2001).
W background: Adopted and grew up in Colorado, birth M in Michigan. Good religious middle-class upbringing from what I understand. Got pregnant at 17, finished high school and college while raising D alone (briefly M to 1st H, who was a jerk). Found her birth mother and moved here to Michigan. Had several long term boyfriends along the way, nothing more than a few years (when I first met her, one of the things she told me was that she was awful at relationships...should have run at that point)
Us background: Met at work around 2003, started dating summer 2004. Her D lived with her and my 2 S live 10 minutes away with their M. I moved into her house 2005, married Oct 2006, and things were generally good...until summer 2007. SD was at her Dad's in CO when W got a call. SD's dad had been molesting her on her summer visits. We got her out of there and started legal proceedings. Tough junior year for SD, she tried to kill herself that fall and had been admitted to psych hospital twice. Affected W and I really hard. Brought back painful memories for me, depression came back and I didn't really have it treated this time. Fortunately, SD came through everything pretty well with a lot of help.
I had been in a low level depression since then and emotionally shut off from everyone, including W. She continued to worry about SD, especially after her first semester of college in CO (Fall 2009). By spring 2010, I sensed something wrong, but didn't really know what and was too emotionally blunted to do anything about it. That's when W started EA with a close friend of ours. In July, she wanted to separate and I reluctantly agreed. She moved out July 17 but we still did things together. The next weekend, we were out with friends (including OM), a lot of drinking was involved (though not too much by me), we got into the biggest fight ever for us, and I tried to kill myself that night. OM was actually the person who called the ambulance for me. W later told me that she wasn't sure (due to all the alcohol) but she thought she slept with OM that night out of pure rage at me.
From August-December 2010, we alternated staying with my MIL and FIL (who I consider closer to as parent than my own were) about 1/2 mile from our house. I started DBing, got therapy and things were slowly getting better. In December, she went to adoptive parents house for xmas and I stayed in our home to watch our animals. After xmas, but before she got back on NYE, I told her that I wanted to stay in the house. She flipped out and started talking about divorce. I remained calm, validated her feelings but told her I didn't want D and also felt strongly about the house.
Since then, she has been friendly, but we've definitely slipped backwards. She doesn't like my boys at all (they can be difficult) and resents having me as her roommate. We went to Retrouvaille last weekend. It was very emotionally challenging to say the least. We had to leave early because W couldn't take it any more. From this, I found that W has essentially put up a brick wall around herself, both to keep others out and to keep herself in. She knows that her family, friends, etc don't approve of what she's doing, but doesn't care. At one point she blurted out to me that she didn't want to trust, didn't want to forgive, didn't want God in her life. She also told me that despite going out with our single friends to have fun and enjoy life (including OM), she feels empty doing so. IOW, she is very messed up and confused inside, though on one positive note, I'm pretty sure W doesn't see OM as anything other than 'friend' now.
As for myself, I'm actually doing pretty well. GAL and all. I've taken up walking/running (lost 15-20 pounds and look great!), new wardrobe, stopped snooping, PMA, etc. I know that if things don't work out, I'll be fine. We are going to talk tomorrow, and if it goes like I think, she's going to bring up D again and/or getting an apartment. At this point, I almost *want* to move out. Spent the morning looking online for places and think I found a couple. It wouldn't strain my budget much, but if I leave then W will have a few hundred more a month to come up with for living expenses.
I guess if I do move out, then I'm a little confused as to what path I should take. We haven't decided if we're going to the Retrouvaille post sessions yet, but if we do, that is about 180 from the LRT. Retrouvaille teaches daily dialogue techniques where you open up your feelings to the other, but how does one reconcile with minimizing contact, etc with the LRT. Thoughts?
OK, that was longer than I thought (but shorter than I was thinking)
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
Looks like I'm just journaling at this point. W and I had R talk last night and it went very well! I started by reiterating that I didn't want a divorce, but I can't stop her if that's really what she wants. Then I told her that as strongly as we both felt about living in the house, I would be willing to get an apartment for 6 months if she thought it would help. I think the offer, coupled with the validating I was doing kind of softened things up a bit.
We talked a little bit about timing (not until after the Super Bowl at least) and finances (I would want each of us to pay our own housing and related costs). One big kicker in our finances: we're going with a few other friends to Asia on vacation at the end of March! That and W is going to CA for spring break with her D at the beginning of March. Once W and I talked about those things I think she realized just how much this would hurt our pocketbooks and make it harder to figure out when (if) to move. We still haven't decided one way or the other whether I'll move out.
This was around 7pm. We ended up talking about other things, watching some tv, and having pizza and wine until almost 11. At one point, she asked me to look at her treadmill which had stopped working. I found a reset switch that she had missed, and once I got it working she got excited and gave me a big hug (been a while for that). She told me how much SD does not want her to leave me. I guess I was a little surprised SD felt so strongly about me; SD used to be W's complete focus, so I'm sure she doesn't want to disappoint her. Finally, by the end of the evening, she essentially asked me to tuck her into bed. She's never asked that before and it was a nice feeling also.
I know not to get my hopes up to high at this point. Been DBing long enough that I finally understand that. Still, I see lots of positives after doing some backsliding recently. It's definitely a long haul, but like my user name says, I'm finally learning patience
Oh, if anyone out there is wondering why I should move when she's the WAS, it's because the house and mortgage are in her name (we never updated it when we got M). That, and I want her to realize how much she'd miss having me around to do the fixing, cleaning, etc. It would be cheaper for me (hardly a hit to my budget at all). Finally, she could keep all the animals that way (2 dogs & 2 cats).
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
A little more journaling, since it looks like these posts are on the other side of the earth from the rest of the board.
Weekend was a mixed bag but ended up good. Had both S over on Saturday and went sledding with friends. W went to nearby city with other friends to check out new brewpub. Her goal was to get back around 11 and obviously not drink too much to be able to do that. Dropped both S off at their mom's around 8, watched a movie and went to bed around 11:30. Woke up a couple of times to use bathroom and resisted temptation to see if W made it back (we sleep in separate rooms now).
Wake up next morning to see that no, W didn't make it back. Was somewhat angry and disappointed but didn't do anything but take off ring and put it with hers. W texted around 7:40 that she had 12 drinks the night before (she's maybe 120 pounds) but she still planned on checking out a new church with me that morning. I'm an atheist, but I wanted to check out the local Unitarian church more for the social aspects to see if it would work for us. She texts later saying she'd throw up if she went so I went by myself, first church service in maybe 30 years. I'd go back
W texts after the service asking if there was anything she could bring home for lunch. I give her suggestion and we meet back at the house. By then, I put my ring back on as most of the anger had subsided. W apologizes and says if the roles were reversed she'd understand how mad I would be. I was actually very calm and friendly but did admit that I had been angry and disappointed. She admitted that she really likes the person I am now, funny and laid back about things like I was when we first went out. W then stood up and asked for a hug. We must have held each other tight for 5 minutes!
Spent the afternoon with W, enjoyed each other's company and she mentioned doing future things together several times (caught herself once). She mentioned that she was going to a doctor this week to see if she could get some ADs and also mentioned several times how she's messed up our lives. W also said that when she gets her head on a little straighter she'd finish reading Not Just Friends. She asked if I was still looking at apartments and I confirmed that I was. We talked a lot, I validated a lot and all in all I see her trying to get closer to me. I've finally learned to be patient instead of jumping at the chance and sending us backwards. I really do think that DBing is making a huge difference!
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
Sounds like you are doing alright. I suspect you both learned something about communicating at the Retrouvaille weekend, because you seem to be treating each other with a lot of caring and understanding. I think patience is your best tactic here. Keep using what you learned at Retrouvaille. I wouldn't recommend LRT unless you need to do it. I'm sure you see that you can't do both. But if you have been having good, caring communication, and you go into LRT, then she will be bound to notice. So, I guess the best thing is to follow her lead. If she wants to talk, then talk. You are much better off with caring communication than with no communication.
Lotus, just responded to your other response in the rings thread.
As far as our communication, yes, it is getting better. I'm also at the point where I can look back and see that, whoops, my response or tone may not have been right during a particular talk and correct myself later.
Thanks for the good advice in both threads. Even though I see things getting better, I do have occasional doubts. It's good to have a gentle clue x 4 reminder from time to time
For today's journaling, last night went pretty well DB wise. Picked up my kids after work and took them for sandwiches and a movie. Texted W asking if she wanted one, she declined. W called a few minutes later asking if I could pick up her prescription (starting ADs, hope they help) and if I'd be stopping by before the movie. I hadn't planned on it, as W doesn't like being around the kids, but I told her I would. Got home, talked about ADs (I'm on the same one), made her a margarita (from scratch, she likes them) and then took kids to movie. W went out to dinner while we were gone. Came home around 9:30, W still gone. She comes home around 10, we text for a few minutes and then she asks if we can talk for a few. Old me would have panicked, but new me went right to her room smiling. I laid on bed near her, and we just talked about our days filling each other in. Nothing serious, just connections. After 10-15 minutes, I told her goodnight and excused myself for bed. It was a prefect way to end the evening.
Lotus, I think you are right, I doubt we could go dark on each other for more than a day or two. At this stage that is alright.
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
A little more journaling while I think of it (really, it's much more fun to read everyone else's sitch than type mine out)
Saturday woke up feeling not too great. Felt like I was coming down with something. Went for a 5k run with running team first thing in the morning (one of my new hobbies). Did some general cleaning around the house getting ready for SB party. One of W previous complaints was that I never helped plan parties and she did all the work (I acted like her hired help). This year, I planned everything out and offered to do all the work. W actually helped a lot during the day. She went out around 4, I didn't ask what she was doing or where she was going. Felt sick around 6, but felt good enough by 7 to go meet up w/friends. Got home around 10, W comes home 10 minutes later.
Sunday had too much to do to be sick. W helped some with the preparations and then took a nap before the game. Had a great time, deep fried a ton of food, W enjoyed the game and party and thanked me for having it and doing so much of the work.
Monday I woke up early (4am) still felt a little sick and also felt down mentally. Couldn't figure out why but just decided to roll with it. Got a call from apartment complex I looked at saying they had more models open. W was having a down day also and felt sick partly due to her ADs (according to her emails). Got home around 5, W was already in her bed. Did more cleaning from the party, watched a little tv and went to bed myself before 8.
Current sitch is that W is depressed and sleeping all the time. When she isn't sleeping, she goes out without me to who knows where (though I'm pretty sure some of it is w/ OM and friends) but that doesn't seem to do anything for her either. Part of me wants to know if I should still get an apartment, part me is a little excited about the prospect but most of me wants to stay put. W and I will have to talk again about this, but I don't want to be the one to bring it up. Yesterday and today are the kinds of days where I need to remind myself to be patient and that everything will work out like it needs to. Still, while W is down I need to be the rock so if I have to fake it for now I will.
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
More journaling. Getting frustrated that my posts take so long to appear...
Hadn't had much contact with W this week. Wednesday we saw each other for about half an hour after work and yesterday (Thursday) I saw her for 15 minutes in the morning and welcomed her home at 11:30 pm before going back to bed. We normally email back and forth a bit during the day, but I was at a conference out of the office Wed and decided to wait and see if W would write on Thurs. No emails those days at all.
Today W emails in the morning. Mentions that we've hardly talked this week and that she's starting to feel a little better on the ADs. We email a couple of times each, keeping things light. After work we talked a little bit and then she asked about apartments. I told her that the place I found had some more models available. We talk about some of the pros and cons and I validate her feelings that she needs to find herself and she isn't sure she can do that if I'm here. We then go out for a couple of errands and to grab some dinner. I showed her the place I was thinking of and we both agree it's very convenient to a lot of things important to me (work, kids, downtown) and still only 5-10 minutes away from our house. She mentions that we should still have at least one 'date' night a week if I go and makes a few other similar comments. She also says she'll be interested in resuming the Retrouvaille dialoging once she starts feeling like herself again (her depression was really bad this week). We discussed some weekend plans we each had and are considering doing something together tomorrow night. She also wants to get my boys a little something for V-day, even though they drive her somewhat crazy.
I'm feeling a bit down right now but trying not to show it. Sad that I may be moving out, sad that the woman I love is so conflicted inside, sad that we haven't moved past this yet. I know I've been working on myself and W sees it. We both know she needs to work on herself before she can work on our R, but it's tough. It's tough that one of my LL is physical affection, but it's not one of hers and she can't give me what I need now. I'm still doing my best to fill her love bucket and she's mentioned that she appreciates it and will probably miss that when I'm gone.
I guess at this point I'm just looking for some positive vibes from the rest of you. I know things will work out for the best, whatever that is, and I really do think we'll end up together in the end, but that doesn't mean I have to like the sitch
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
Another sad morning. Only slept about 4 1/2 hours, which is not too unusual for me. Bunch of other things going on around me. Friend's Dad just died, another just found out she has thyroid cancer, XW is an emotional mess partly due to S14 and his anxiety, and W may be having an allergic reaction to Wellbutrin. So, how is everyone else's day going?
Me 43 W 38 M 5 T 7 SD20 S15, S13 with 1st W ILYBNILWY June 2010 Separation/Bomb July 2010 Divorce Feb 8, 2011
