Hey everybody... its been a long time

[Was2sad]

Bradley,
You know who she was when you loved her and married her. You since came to know someone very different. So has she. She probably never could have imagined becoming so cold and opposite the person she used to be. MLC

If she's at bottom, she may be ready to say goodbye to the things that pulled her away from reality. If this is MLC, and if she is bottoming out, that could be very good. Yes, there has been a ton of trauma - that is what MLC does. But it may be more limited than you think if she is sincere.

You are so close to the center of the storm, it is hard to focus on anything but the pain you suffered. You feel safe and more at peace with your current life. You have hope for a better life.

Who is she now? Who will she be a year from now? She panicked at the thought of losing her youth, and control of her life. She tried to prove to herself that she still has control over hers, by controlling you. She probably was considering a life with someone else that seemed a safe port. She is confused. This other life may have been real or imaginary, but she was drawn to change something in her life - or everything.

You don't want a life with that person in the storm, and shouldn't. But the person that arives with MLC, usually leaves with MLC. If they face their demons and resolve their conflicts, they are changed again. they aren't the person they were before MLC or during the storm. Neither are you. You know more about yourself, your past mistakes, and the relationship you want in the future.

What you can't know, is who she will become after MLC, or who she wants to be after MLC - if that is what you call this period of time out. I agree with others that some counseling should be at the top of the list of things you use to define progress. That is something that could only help you both. It is something I wish more couples would consider at intervals in the life of their R, just like tuning up a car. I wish I had, but we were too busy, distracted, and the perfect pair - like racehorses with blinders on.

How can you determine who she wants to be, and how she wants to contribute to a better life for herself, you and the family - if this doesn't get communicated? How can you share the same answers with yourself and her, about your hopes, without open communication? Looking back, would you say the two of you really understood how to communicate with each other openly? That should be at the top of your "future" list and you both need someone to help get you there - if there is a future to be had.

This person she became during her time out really surprised you both. Neither of you knew it was going to happen. Neither of you know who she will become post MLC, or who you will become. If she's really turning and honestly preparing to commit to a fresh start, is that something you're prepared to toss aside without giving it a chance?

You'll both keep a guard up. You should. Change is action, not words, and it is mutual. How can your list give her a chance to show you change? How can you include equal goals to demonstrate your changes? How do your ideas and changes compare to hers? Haven't discussed that? Think she doesn't have a list, or fears and reservations? Think again.

Am I saying give her keys to the house and bank accounts? Paleeeez! Go slow in any direction you take. Keep L options open to protect yourself in case she's just plotting her next trick or runaway. But you thought arranging a place for her to live with the kids near you was a good idea when you wanted to save the M; why isn't it a good idea now? If the wounds are too fresh to consider sharing a roof just yet, there are options.

[ericmsant2]

Bradely -

Bro...I agree with Was.

Here is what I would do but hey it's just me..

1) Proceed with caution
2) Don't give up just yet - remember for a sec why YOU came here. Why you put yourself thru the pain....let me answer...cause at one point you loved her. You loved her enough to go on this journey.
3) Take this time to "peek" if you will...take a look at who she is and who she has become. She may surprise you. You may surprise you.

I agree that going to see an IC is a good idea I just don't know if now is the right time to push it. If anything I would wait until she moves down.

Here are a few other thoughts...

When and if she moves down you should not ask for proof. You should continue to do what you are doing. Your normal tendancy is probably going to be to push - DONT. Just take it slow, start a friendship, start trying to co parent the kids. Become a hugh part of your kids lives. Keep living your life and let her live her. She just may realize what I already know and that is under your hurt, under the pain, under the insecurities, underneath everything everyone sees...YOU STILL LOVE THIS WOMEN. I know you do...so please take your time dude. Give it a chance.

You know that pain you feel, that mistrust you feel...Funny I was thinking about our sitch...ask youself this question. What if, she become a little more gentle, what if she really appologized when SHE was ready to, what if you guys just started to get along. Can you forgive her? Before you answer...one more question

Should she forgive you for your mistakes? If so, what is an acceptable timeline? Oh...and who defines the timeline? You or Her?

Just think about these questions.

I know you dude - I do. I am so happy that you have found that place with your kids. I am. I know more about your sitch than many on these boards so I do get what you are going thru and feeling. As your friend....do me one favor...

Think about the questions above. Make sure PRIDE does not get in the way. Extend a hand...carefully...but extend one. AND THINK....how many times/years did she expect another Bradley...how many years...FTR...in my book if she is REALLY willing to try...I think you own it YOURSELF to give it a shot.

Finally, giving her a list of things she needs to do shows a lack of trust. Not a good way to start a NEW r. You have a right to not trust her..I know...but maybe...she may be coming out.



Love ya man!
Eric

[bradley11]

WAS2

That was a really eloquent and thoughtful message.

I really appreciate your words and thank you for taking the time to write them to me.

I"m taking them in.

B

[bradley11]

Saint Eric

thanks for your words and thoughts man...

I'm listening.

Trying to filter things... trying not to let anger drive my decisions.

I am clearing my head out here at the beach... coming up with a game plan.

[ericmsant2]

Dude - I know you are man. I have SO MUCH Confidence in you dude. Whatever you do....you know I got ya.

I'll let you know when I am down in your neck of the woods.

Peace and love

Oh...and if you can...have a few drinks (Malibu and Cranberry - just a splash of cranberry).

Eric

[Bworl]

Just to be clear, I am strongly on the side AGAINST any thought that her statement about coming home was in any way genuine.


My post to you earlier had absolutely nothing to do with trying to encourage you to consider her request. Nothing at all.


My post to you earlier was meant to point out that you have once again swung to an extreme position, something you have done alot of in the time that we have known you here.


I don't know about the rest of the people who have been here for awhile, but my time in the MLC vortex caused me to be very hesitant about moving in the direction of the extremes.



Real life too often seems to be lived in between the extremes.



It's nice the relative positions seem to have changed, although I would suggest that your recent happiness is not at all a sign that you have finished the storm and found your full self again (though it's certainly a good sign, eh?).



My message to you is that NOW we will find out who Bradley really is. NOW we will find out how much Bradley was in love with his wife and how much he valued the sanctity of his marriage and family life.



When we are being "wronged" it's just too easy to point the fingers at the bad person and in the process have people say and do things that try to make us feel better.



But when we are finally feeling pretty good? Well, now no one has to hold our hand and NOW we get to be who we really are.




So what's it going to be Bradley?



...and for my part at least, I'm not expecting a final OR complete answer (this is a complicated essay type question...)




Bill

[bradley11]

malibu and cranberry?

does that come with a skirt?

truth is yesterday at the pool I double fisted a frozen mango marg and a frozen straweberry daquiri... sprites for the boys.

one boy said, "who's that one for dad?"

I said "me"

then he said... "What about the other one?"

I said, "Thats for me too".

he said, "oh".

anyone else had this script played out?

I'll try the malibu and cran.. but even for a girly drink it sounds really pretty nasty.

[bradley11]

Honestly bill?

I'm trying to compartmentalize and figure out what I really want.

I want my boys living in the same town as me. Thus right now with her threatening to move there this is a good thing. So I'd like to figure out how to keep that ball rolling in the right direction.

I do not, however, want her living in the same house as me right now. There is a part of me that is very angry, very spiteful (no, really you say?) that is not willing to just welcome her back with open arms. she already said she was coming back, moved back for 5 days and bolted. so actions speak louder than words.

What I am thinking of doing, however, is giving her enough money to get her moved in comfortably... to support her in a way that she will not be strapped.

I once she is moved there... I think the best next move is to figure out scheduled time with the boys living with me and living with her. I will use the court system to guarantee this for me... no longer will I rely on her word which is Mudd. I'd like to help her find meaninfgul work.

I feel that if and when we can get into a routine, get the boys into school... and the dust settles... then perhaps dating could be something we could do. I'm not totally shut to that idea but again right now the thought of it kindof makes my stomach turn.

but again of course the pie in the sky family thing would still be ideal for the boys and everybody involved.

but in my heart of hearts right now I do not see this woman as being someone who really cares about me or who would just be simply nice to me...

last week she was trying to extort me for money every day in exchange for letting me have the boys for this week. this is not exactly an attractive way to behave.

so will cut off my nose to spite my face at this point? not sure it is that. I think your first line-- about how her intentions reek of insincerity is the main question to address. and to protect myself and my interests with my boys first and foremost... while supporting her in a way that makes sense and perhaps leaves the door open for other things. though right now that door is locked and I've hidden the key... not sure where it is.

[ericmsant2]

Okay...I'll be honest dude - I love malibu straight. Love it.

If you boys were my boys (remember they are older) they would have said "only two dad" - LMAO.

Dude you sound good. F'in A - dude. You can do this. You freaking rock. Remember...no regrets...and with no anger.

Eric

[Truegritter]

of course the pie in the sky family thing would still be ideal for the boys and everybody involved.

This may be something that sounds good to you and may have been your goal when you first got here.

But this

There is a part of me that is very angry, very spiteful

Is where you are stuck.

You are reacting to the anger and mistrust with tactical measures.

Don't blame you really Bradley that is what 99% (my anecdotal estimation not based in scientific process) of people would do...

BUT

We would be remiss in not pointing toward a greater opportunity here.

This is to find out who Bradley is at his core and what Bradley meant when he took his vows and said he would love his wife through better or worse...

Did you mean

I will love you and honor you all the days of my life

BUT

If you get scared and lose your way

I won't.

I am going to spend my nickel up front on my good friend Mach

It is easy to detach and move on from an a$$hole or (insert your favorite derogatory term for W here)

Much harder to detach and move FORWARD with love.

Love?

What does that mean?

You only will find that answer by looking inside of you Bradley.

I can only tell you that it is what we are here to learn.

And this...

Well, now no one has to hold our hand and NOW we get to be who we really are.

...is when we learn it.