Well, I am going to try and not be longwinded here but this seems to be the most supportive forum I have found on the internet and I could really use some insight and thoughts.
Husband and I will be married 10 years this October, if we make it that far. We have currently been separated for almost 2 and a half long painful months. We have 3 beautiful daughters. We have had problems before but nothing I thought we couldn't deal with. I have been unhappy with the amount of time he spends with the kids and I and often felt that he chose his hobbies over us. I also felt that he didn't do his share of work around the house. I work a full time job and go to school online while taking care of everything to do with our household. He always felt that I wasn't good at managing our money, and I admit at times that I have done a pretty poor job of it. This last year has been particularly difficult for us for some reason. He has actually moved out of the house two previous times this past year, but never for more than a week. I think part of the problem is that he would come home and we would never actually talk about the problems or what to do to keep this from happening again. He is not a great talker and I know that so I would try not to push him. So, here we are again. This time it was precipitated by the fact that I found out he had been texting another woman. We live in a small town so I of course knew her and had actually always liked her. I was livid of course, and we had a big fight one night right after Easter but he said he had put a stop to it because of me and he knew it was wrong. I said it would take some time but I was sure we would be ok. For the next couple of days, though I was not in a great mood and felt pretty insecure about everything. By the end of the week, it all exploded and he moved out to his Dad's. The next month was filled with nothing but fighting on our part. Horrible things were said on both parts. He was insisting that this marriage was over and the sooner papers were filed the better it would be. He didn't have the money for it though, as by the time he pays me child support and his bills he has very little left. He was also still in contact with the other woman and spending time with her. He told me he considered himself a single man, while I insisted we were of course still married. Gradually the fighting started to get somewhat less and we did start to get along...talking on the phone and texting. I tried very hard to not bring up the marriage, its problems, and what we were going to do very often, because it would just lead to very bad discussions and he would get angry and then a fight would follow. Several weeks ago, he texted me from work that he wanted to come and talk to me. That he felt sick over everything. He wanted to tell me the truth and not have me hear it from anyone else. He didn't know if I could ever forgive him and he felt stupid for letting things go as far as they had. I have been praying daily for some kind of positive change and it finally appeared to be happening. We talked and he admitted that he had slept with the other woman one time a couple of weeks ago and he felt terrible. He didn't know why he did it other than he was drunk and it meant nothing to him. He was done with her. I already assumed that he had been with her so this was not news to me but I was of course hurt. I told him that in time I could forgive him and he said thank you. I asked him what he wanted from me other than that, and he said he was unsure at this point. I told him that as much as my heart wanted him to come home to our family, it just wasn't a good plan right now and he agreed. We agreed to take it slow and see what happens. He came back and visited several more times that week spending time with the kids and I and seemed very happy and content. We were all at a family function over the following weekend and something seemed to change. I'm not sure what. All of his family, except his one sister, was happy to see us all together and relieved to see that we were trying to work things out. Suddenly, the next day he seemed to pull back away and do a complete turn around. I, of course, freaked out, which in turn made things worse. He said he wasn't ready to come home and didn't know when or if that would happen. I asked him if he wanted a divorce and he said he didn't have the money. I asked if he had the money right now would he go ahead and file and he said he didn't know. When I push him, though, he changes his tune and says yes he would. I don't know which is the truth. I had a day not too long ago where I was just sad, depressed and tired of everything. I told him I would go ahead and file for the dissolution since I had the money and he said "why would you do that" to me. I told him it should seem obvious to him, why since it didn't appear he wants to be here. He said that in the last month the only time the word divorce has been brought up has been by me and not him. When I ask if he is open minded to us getting back together he either says he is always open minded or doesn't know what the future holds. I have for the most part stopped talking about a divorce or whether we will or won't get back together. We are getting along well as friends and talk to each other about the kids and how our days went. We do sleep together on occasion, although I don't know if this is a good idea or not. I know most would say not smart on my part, and probably it is not. I just feel like it is a way for us to be connected somehow. Stupid and foolish I know. Occasionally we won't really talk for a day or two as he seems to get real quiet. The other day I was not going to text or talk to him at all and he texted me. When I did not get back to him right away, he said what aren't you talking to me anymore. Ugh!! I just don't know what he wants and I am not sure that he even knows. He comes over to the house a couple of times a week and visits with us and by outward appearances it appears normal. He of course leaves and goes back out to his Dad's. I love having him here and us getting along. I want my marriage to be reconciled more than anything and I just don't know what to do anymore or how to act or react to him. I try to not ever at this point bring up any topics about the relationship, but it is difficult sometimes. When I do he asks why I do it and why can't I just leave things alone. I want to wait and see what happens with all of this but I sometimes think I am waiting to see if we can work things out or not and he is waiting til he has money to file papers. I don't know. I may be way off, who knows. He said right now his feelings on coming home and the marriage haven't changed but at the same time he seems happy to come here and have us talk and be friends. He seems in no hurry at all for a divorce. He has not moved hardly anything else out since the first weekend he left back in April. I do know he is not seeing the other woman anymore so that is a comfort, but I am scared of the future for us here. I don't know how to work things out if we don't ever talk about anything. It's all so confusing and some days it just seems overwhelming. Some days I am relatively calm about it all and other days, I just sit and cry. Does he seriously want to end this marriage or is he trying in his own way to figure things out and give us time? Help! Oh, I just got my copy of The Divorce Remedy in the mail. Is it really going to help when we aren't even living together anymore? I am going to start reading tonight after the kids go to bed but just don't know where to start or what to do. So so sorry for the length of this post.
I'm not an expert and you probably would get the same advice from the book. I think if you want to save your marriage, you should stop talking about divorce. I've read quite a few posts here and it seemed the consensus is that we should not bring up M issues when speaking with a WAS. It seemed to me your situation is quite positive since your husband told you he is done with the OW. Do you think your H would consider M counselling?
M 39 H 41 T9 M6 EA found Dec 09 Separated Apr to Jun 10 Currently in house separation
I don't understand something. He came back to you, told you everything, said it was over, you believe him but he's still living at his dad's. Why? If you have verified that he's telling the truth, set some boundries (no other people, etc) and have him come back. Others may disagree with me but I believe it's always better be in the same house.
It's hard but do not have any relationship talks for awhile. Keep everything light. Work on reconnecting. IMO, it's not bad to continue to sleep together as long as you're sure there is no other person involved. I always recommend getting Dr Phil's Relationship Rescue as well as DB. It compliments DB very well and helps you establish new communication patterns.
There will be good days and bad. Just keep reading and posting.
Thanks for the replies, as I seem to be getting replies on both of my posts since I reposted this same thing with page breaks. I am virtually positive he would never consider counseling as he feels counseling is just someone telling you what to feel or do. UGH! His reasons for being unhappy are at best vague. He often would spend all of his free time on his hobbies and interests and not much time with myself and the girls, but would then later complain that he wants a companion to do things with. My response would always be well all you have to do is ask and include me. I have heard the "I love you, but I'm not in love with you" speech sometimes only later for him to take it back and say he of course loves me. He claims we fight all the time, which in fact we do not. Nothing out of the ordinary except when he does this sort of stuff. Sometimes I have honestly thought that he has some sort of depression issue or something that he is just not happy but doesn't really know why.
As far as I know he is not in contact with the OW although responses in my other post seem to think he may be. I don't know. He has not moved back in with me as he really doesn't seem to know what he wants. He doesn't seem to want to be here but is happy when he is here. I don't want him to return simply for the kids to only have the same thing happen again. This is not the first time he has moved out, although it is definitely the longest. I want him home with me and our daughters more than anything but for good. I have dropped all talk of divorce or the relationship. Other than that I am not sure what else to do. Some days I feel hopeful and other days, like today, I feel pretty down and feel like giving up.
I am virtually positive he would never consider counseling as he feels counseling is just someone telling you what to feel or do. UGH! His reasons for being unhappy are at best vague. He often would spend all of his free time on his hobbies and interests and not much time with myself and the girls, but would then later complain that he wants a companion to do things with. My response would always be well all you have to do is ask and include me. I have heard the "I love you, but I'm not in love with you" speech sometimes only later for him to take it back and say he of course loves me. He claims we fight all the time, which in fact we do not. ...
As far as I know he is not in contact with the OW although responses in my other post seem to think he may be. I don't know. He has not moved back in with me as he really doesn't seem to know what he wants.He doesn't seem to want to be here but is happy when he is here.
L&F,
Just take a look at what I've highlighted in your post. Everything is about what HE wants, what HE feels, what HE needs, etc.
What do YOU need in this relationship? Do you REALLY want to resume a marital relationship with this man where your needs are totally sublimated to his??
Are you getting any individual counseling? Rather than work on DBing, I'd suggest you work on your own self-esteem, boundary-setting, assertiveness, etc. I think once YOU feel better/stronger about Lost & Fearful, then you will have a better foundation upon which to DB your marriage (if you'll even want him at that point).
Oh, and you should consider changing your username. DBing is the hardest thing you'll ever have to do in your life. Going into it "Fearful" is not the right tone to set!
I need for my husband to be an active partner in this marriage and family, not me working, going to school, and taking care of the children and household by myself. There have been times in the past where strides have been made in these areas, but they don't seem to last. I need to feel that myself and the children are more important to him than anything else in his life.
No, I am not getting any individual counseling at this point, although I have thought about it. I am working on improving things for myself, such as losing weight and going back to school AGAIN to further my career and salary. The losing weight alone has at least given me back some of the self esteem I seemed to lack for a long time when I hated how I looked. I try to focus on myself and my children as much as possible. I know I fail at that sometimes as I get caught up in all of the emotions going on with this mess.
I want to save this marriage and realize it is going to be extremely difficult, but am willing to put in the time and effort. I love my H and feel that yes this marriage is worth saving. I am worried that if I don't start applying some techniques to get this marriage back on track that time will be up for us.
So what is your plan to articulate your needs to him?
Have you set (and enforced) ANY boundaries with him since this all began?
Sunny, I'm not going to blow smoke up your butt -- I never do. Life is too short. This is a man who is used to coming and going as he pleases, and he is NOT used to you asserting yourself. This is going to be HARD WORK . . . but it CAN be done. IF you are to be able to do it, you need to learn one thing:
Stop operating from a standpoint of, when making a decision or faced with a situation, "If I do this, how will he react? Will he be angry? How will his reaction make ME feel?"
And instead, replace it with
"In every situation, what is THE RIGHT THING TO DO? What is the thing that God Himself would have me do, if He were standing here in front of me?" -- and then let your husband's reaction, anger, etc., be damned.
It's a learned skill, and once you learn to do it, it's LIBERATING.
An IC can really help you with this, and I'd strongly urge you to consider one, if you can afford it.
I feel that I have numerous times over the past year articulated those needs to him, so I guess I don't know how he could not know it. I know that there are things he needs from me, too. As he doesn't seem to be in the mode of talking about the R at this point, I am not sure how to go about talking about any of that. I feel like I am in just a "wait and see what happens" mode which drives me insane at times.
I guess I am somewhat confused on what boundaries I should set with him. Maybe I am dense.
You hit the nail on the head when you said "this is a man who is used to coming and going as he pleases,". There couldn't be a more true statement, and I realize my responsibility in allowing things to be that way. He may have been doing that but I allowed him to do it, because when I would say something it would often cause a fight. He would sometimes make strides in that area but they never seemed to be long lasting. I think he is capable just as I think I am capable of making changes necessary. I have told him before that it is possible to find a balance of time for ourselves, time as a couple, and time as a family. I know it is difficult when two people work and are raising a family, but I feel it can be done and is important. I just wish he would try.
I am virtually positive he would never consider counseling as he feels counseling is just someone telling you what to feel or do. UGH! His reasons for being unhappy are at best vague. He often would spend all of his free time on his hobbies and interests and not much time with myself and the girls, but would then later complain that he wants a companion to do things with. My response would always be well all you have to do is ask and include me. I have heard the "I love you, but I'm not in love with you" speech sometimes only later for him to take it back and say he of course loves me. He claims we fight all the time, which in fact we do not. Nothing out of the ordinary except when he does this sort of stuff. Sometimes I have honestly thought that he has some sort of depression issue or something that he is just not happy but doesn't really know why.