I've been giving myself a short sabatical on men and introspection. It was a blessed relief.
But I've recently started seeing a man who is extremely HD, leading me to reflect on some of the conversations that happen here and thought it might help my thinking process on the road to SchnarchLevel6status to note it and discuss it with you guys.
So the thing is this is a fellow who has demonstrated his v HD status. There’s no doubt about it, he’d do it several times a day every day given half a chance. He’s v sexual, flirty, pursuing – all the boxes, but he keeps this respectful physical distance. For example we dated a couple of times a week for nearly three weeks before we kissed. It was weird, he was obviously into me, and he was constantly talking about how much he liked me, but he wouldn’t make the first move. Eventually I did and he was right into it.
Here’s the thing … he has this view that I know he’s always up for sex, so it’s my responsibility to let him know when I want to have it. I get the logic, but it just doesn’t feel right. I LOVE the feeling of a man taking charge of things. Don’t ask me, just do it. I spend my whole life being a strong professional woman working with traditional, conservative, men and I have to be tough and ballsy ALL the time at work. I want to feel like a woman at home – and strangely I’ve realised that for me feeling like a woman means being submissive??? What’s with that?
So, anyway, the result is that we’ll do whatever we’re doing on a date, we’ll be very superficially affectionate, he might drop a couple of light hints, but if I want to have sex it’s up to me to initiate the physical intimacy. (I’m kind of answering my own questions as I write here, I guess I could quip at one of his hints that I’m up for it as long as he initiates when we get home??)
The interesting thing for me is that having had, on reflection, an SSM I’m not sure if my views are just unhealthy. He says this way, I have total control of frequency of the sexual relationship, and isn’t that what all women want? I can’t argue with that. That’s the feminist utopia. But it still doesn’t feel right. It feels like I’m rejecting him every night I don’t initiate sex. It also makes me feel greedy if I want to have at every opportunity, like “I can’t initiate that often he’ll think I’m a sex-addict!” Know what I mean?
I guess I’ll talk to him about it and give-him-permission (?) to initiate. But that negotiation feels like I’m giving away my power to say no if he does initiate and I’m not into it. Gee, we want it all ways don’t we?
The thing I really wanted to reflect on was the feelings and reactions I had being in this relationship where the man didn’t overtly initiate sex. So obviously the first few weeks were fine (delightful in fact), but after about a month, and during a particularly stressful time with work for both of us things got weird. We work together on one project but I represent the government and he represents the non-government sector so we often have diametrically opposed views and positions. We really respect each other professionally, but we are poles apart ideologically (DanceQueen and Cyrena – I’m not quite at the finding the perfect partner stage but I’m getting there!! this is fun and interesting in the meantime) so there are times when we’ve had a heated day, things are tense, but sometimes it would be nice to reconnect in our personal relationship by being physical – thing is, even though he says he’s always up for it, how do I know if he’s up for it if we’ve just had a couple of hours of cranky debate? What if I initiate and he doesn’t want to? I hate that sort of rejection.
So we got into a pretty nasty downward spiral, me not initiating sex because I thought he was cross, him becoming more and more withdrawn and cross because we weren’t having sex, me noticing his crankyness and withdrawal and not initiating sex. We were both feeling rejected because we were just waiting for the other one to reconnect. Sounds dumb when I write it down like that, but the feeling was awful.
It ended when I was in a particularly good mood for some reason, we hadn’t been working together and I initiated. It was all it took.
If he is as HD as you say he is, he probably knows that and it may frighten him. He may not feel he can allow his inner "beast" out, which is why he wants you to control and initiate ML. You might want to talk to him as to why he prefers that.
Alternately, he could enjoy the power exchange aspects of surrendering to a strong woman who controls him sexually. Some guys are into that.
Some men just want to be held and touched and they only way they know how to reliably get that is through intiating sex. You might want to find out how he reacts to back, shoulder, or foot massages that you give him and if that is enough for a given day.
While I am HD compared to my wife, I really need to be touched and really need words of affirmation from her. There were many years in my marriage where the only times she would touch me were when we ML. Now we both understand each others needs more.
You should, as you say, talk to him and find out what his inner desires are and how you can meet them and he can meet yours. Explain that you like surrendering to a strong man. Maybe you can take turns initiating every other month or so other schedule that allows both of you to get what you need. Conversely maybe there are other physical things that can supplement your respective sexual needs.
Also, figure out a way that you can each say no to the others initiation without hurting their feelings. I have found that really important and very difficult to put into practice.
ML is a wonderful relationship/intimatcy restorative. However, there are also other ways to make a partner feel loved, treasured, and special.
Good luck in your relationship
>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
It is extremely common for women who are very independent in most parts of their lives to want to be submissive in their intimate lives. Sexual arousal is a very primitive part of us, and the dom/sub vibe in the bedroom seems to tap into that. It's normal -- don't worry about it.
Have you clearly communicated your preferences to him? Don't expect him to be a mind reader. And don't think that he'll be offended by your giving him information about yourself in a non-demanding way. Men are often grateful for that. For example, you could say, "I love it when you initiate sex. It's such a turn-on for me. And if you do it and I'm not in the mood, I promise that I'll let you down easy / give you a rain check for another time / [whatever]."
It could be that he is a natural sexual dominant and that he would initiate freely and often if he thought it wouldn't offend you. Alternatively, it could be that he is not so dominant, or that he has mixed feelings about being dominant. If that's the case, there are things you can do to help bring out that side of him. But there's no point worrying about that until you first let him know exactly how you feel.
Welcome back, Little Miss--glad to see you've been progressing in all sorts of ways! I'm sure all this exploration and self-discovery will reward you with a wonderful relationship, in the end.
First off, you're far from alone in finding a more submissive role to be a sexual turn-on. Did you read the thread DQ started about alpha males--I believe most of the women who weighed in preferred this dynamic.
I too am curious about why your current partner has chosen to leave the choice of sexual frequency completely in your hands--this suggests he's been burned somehow in the past, and is still reacting to past dynamics?
I think you know that the most important aspect of any relationship, if any growth is to happen, is for there to be open communication. Assumptions, as your "downward spiral" story illustrated, only lead to miscommunication and frustration. As you say, that episode ended when you were in a particularly good mood (which is really on the same continuum as feeling detached from a situation)--how can you continue to foster this sense of detachment? Also, do you feel that he responds well to clear communication?
Absolutely, communication is the key. Many of the issues in Ims Sunshine's post could have been resolved quickly with open communication. It's strange how we can be so physically intimate, yet not even be as open and honest about our sexual preferences as we are about our dining preferences with the waiter at a restaurant.
As for identifying someone's preferences, don't assume it's just one mode. Speaking only for myself as an example, I enjoy being both dominant and submissive at different times, or equal. They're all separate and different fantasies. Liking one of them doesn't mean I don't like the others.
It sounds to me like Ims Sunhine and her man are trying to figure out what the other wants, and may be misinterpreting each other's actions because they both may be doing what the THINK the other person wants, which may be what NEITHER of them wants, instead of what they actually want.
