GFI, dont worry. I am taking all the advice and processing it. Also, when I feel stuck, I trust that people from outside have "a better view"... I "asked" for help the last few days. I appreciate the help I am getting. As always. I can still think calmly. I am in control.
I thought Bill's post was pretty dead on. Maybe put that in another letter and let him read it.
Let's think about what worked: basically, you letting go was what prompted him to say he wanted to come home, yes? That made him realize that he was losing you, really and truly losing you. But also, you were happy on your own.
He is providing for you and the kids. That is a very traditional/stereotypical role. He almost certainly feels like he is showing his love through that. Obviously that doesn't work for you.
Consider though that what you are doing isn't completely working for him either.
Also consider that he wants a weekend away. Isn't that something you truly wanted? In your list you included a long weekend away. He is trying to make that happen.
Maybe later than you wanted, but he IS hearing some of it.
I suspect if you could bring yourself to encourage that behavior through his LLs, you might see more of it. Slowly probably, but surely.
No, you shouldn't settle. DBing is never about settling. It is about improving your M. It is about changing your tactics so you can get what you need. Sometimes that means taking care of it yourself, sometimes that means asking for it in the right way. And lots of times that means thanking your H in the right way.
If you need a break, take one. Tell him why.
Take care of you.
Hope you are sleeping well.
(((((((Kalni)))))))
Michelle - Proud DR Rockette S: 28JUL07, D'd: 29OCT09 http://tinyurl.com/27j9qo2
....lots of food for thought indeed! On a lighter note (eek, maybe not), here are your weekend stars...
You may have become used to the sort of balance your relationships seem presently to exist in. Uranus, Lord of Change in your sign, has been linked to Saturn, Lord of Tradition. It might seem as if you have been made to stand still at the centre of forces pulling equally in opposing directions - a situation not without frustrations. This weekend things most positively shift, possibly through the intervention of an old friend determined to move you on. Make sure your social life is active now- it seems all you need to change things greatly for the better is one tiny little incentive, one small act that could alter a balance which has resulted in stasis. Single or partnered your willingness to help others is still very dominant. This is all good stuff but make sure it isn't a refuge for avoiding full-on, rowdy, risk taking, heart breaking love.
I agree with Michelle, but I'd also say that settling is always going to be true to a certain degree. You want things, he doesn't give you those things in the way you'd like to receive them, he thinks he's trying. At some point you need to decide how much you're willing to accept who he is and settle. You each compromise.
But you know him best, you know what he's capable of. If you reach the place where you truly think that you could never accept him as he is, even if he made some improvements that fit into his personality, than you need to be honest with yourself about that. And probably that means moving on. But if you think he's capable of more, than I'd try to be understanding and patient. Bridgestone over in WAS has been having an interesting time of changes/realizations her H has gone through over the past year.
"Her H doesn't show any emotion, let alone dislike of her "barking". Personally, I think she is a lot gentler than I would be at this point."
But he has. He has shown some "emotion" and his dislike for the "barking". It is in there.. if I need to go back I will. He says it very clearly to me.. when he says.. "You will never be satisfied." I know this shoe.. I have worn it many times. Her H is not in any way shape or form.. meeting her expectations. That we can agree on. But.. having expectations are great.. you just need to wait on them sometimes.
Remember.. from the first time Kalni posted here.. things started over. What is past.. is past. She chose to build for the future. She did a great job. Now that the future is here.. she is having trouble putting it all together.
Fair enough?
IMHO.. there is still a tremendous amount of "hope" in this situation. He is ready.. she is willing and able. She is leaving him behind.. because she is ready, willing and able.
As silly as it sounds.. if you really want to test my "theory".. then Kalni needs to push for the D. Smiling the whole time. The issue will become.. she can't technically do that. He has to agree. He will stall it for sure. He has already done it.. I expect.. he will do it again.
"Fear is, again in my opinion, holding her back from acting on a decision that I believe she already has made in her heart. In fact, there is not a situation where fear and insecurity are a good thing."
That is a very interesting comment. "Fear" is simply not knowing the outcome. If I take you up in a plane.. strap a parachute on you.. fly to 40,000 feet.. open the door.. and tell you.. you might make this jump.. you might not. Is "fear" gonna be bad.. or good? I am not gonna push you out.. you have to decide to jump. I am gonna wait on you to decide.. what is best for you.. and your fear. "Fear" can make things more exciting.. or make you stand still. "Fear" is something that drives people.. and it shows up at the key moments.
"You see Forrest, and I have told Maria how I feel about this, sometimes the standers are so stern on standing that they lose focus on the fact that not all marriages will be saved."
I don't have any standards.. other than what people tell me.
That's all I have to say about that.
"Mind you, I have not told her to leave her marriage, you should reread my last three posts to Maria and maybe you will understand the direction that I am hoping she will follow."
Never said you did. I have been saying for.. (Weeks, Months, Days).. back off. Not leave.. back off. Cause I know without a shadow of a doubt.. they are right back in the cycle. I like you.. want people to "show" me the way.. cause in that.. I can help. I am really good at "seeing" what people want. Again.. look at where I came from.. to what I am now.
I simply cannot write all my thoughts here. People get confused with .25% of my thoughts. And that is ok.
"Maria continuing on in an unhappy marriage will lead to anger and resentment. Guess what, the kids will see that and feel it and it"
The tone of the kids has changed.. alot recently. I saw it.
Kids are like me.. they are just gonna say it.
Ohhh.. I remember her son coming down on her when she was not "doing enough". Now he is OK with it. Fickle he is!! I would still give him a hug.
Some where. He saw a leader.
"We can openly offer her our opinions and we can all express our thoughts on how we think she should proceed. We do not have to agree, many times we don't. All we can do is offer our support and comfort through a very tough period in each individuals life."
Trust me.. I am gonna fight for this one tooth and nail. Don't let my "fight" distract you.
"If I had my drothers Maria's H would make some changes and step up to show her that he can be what she needs."
If I had my druthers Maria would make some changes and step up to show him.. he can be what she needs.
"In fact, statistically I think that is the majority of what this site does and I for one think it is fantastic."
"His inaction and avoidance are so utterly confusing to me."
Me too Bill.. Me too.
I don't get it.. why he would not want to just "do what it takes"
My thought is.. he is lacking the support.. Kalni has.
" He does not act or talk like a man who has said to himself "I have nearly thrown away something very precious to me. I must find a way to show her that I love her and realize that I always have."
At the very core of all this.. she just said yes.
He walked away.. she DB'ed.. He came back.
Now we have a bunch a trash.
Kalni.. is dragging that "can" to the curb.
She is now calling for a extra pickup.
"He does not act or talk like a man who has said to himself "I have nearly thrown away something very precious to me. I must find a way to show her that I love her and realize that I always have."
You came in for a job. I was the interviewer. You are gonna woo me any way you can. You think you have all the skills. I believe you. You got the job.. Yea!
Now.. Bill. I need you too pull that transmission out of that Ford Taurus. The transmission jack is a little finicky.. and wants you to love it some. But it works. Now when you are done with that.. I need for you to figure out why our computer is not mapping drives all the time.
As the person that hired you.. where am I gonna expect you to be?
"It seems to me that if things are now to the point that the end can be glimpsed in front of you, it is time to hold nothing back in making clear just what the status is."
He has no idea.. this is the end.
"A date, a card, a daily call just about the two of us and the love that you have for me - any of these things would have spoken to me."
Everything before that.. drop it.
"I could be convinced to work our way to truly good love, but I see no signs at all that anything but what once was is in your plans."
"Keep your level head about the reality of your situation- by all means listen to other views - but they know nothing (really!) about how it plays out in the real world! - your world!"
In one of your descriptions of your H, you say he has no dreams, all he gives attention to & thinks about is work. It seems that something he didn't dream he could be turned into a reality for him with your support
"Even this work addiction/ambition is a funny issue. He never dreamed of being so successful. For years I supported him, telling him he was one of the best. He left a job 3 years ago (was there since he was 18) and he was devastated and I was smiling. . He wanted to know why and I told him "now you will get to see how good you are, people will look for you and you will get many job offers". Didnt once doubted his value. He thought I was crazy, that I was optimistic, that we would be left with no money. 3 months later he got a job offer from this newspaper he is now a chief editor at. I was smiling again..."
It seems that something he didn't dream he could be turned into a reality for him with your support. You were the optimistic one.
Now he's on his own to be much better than before without the optimism in your eyes.
Quote:
"And he still doesnt feel it needs to be aproached. He wants it under the carpet. It's something he said knows is wrong but cant change it obviously."
You say something like this.. when you just don't know ho to "start" the conversation.. or you feel you may be "judged".
I think Forrest is right about this, I don't believe he knows what to do, so try's to push it away from your focus. The more he does that, the more intense the focus becomes & everything becomes too close up & blurry.
"OK.. thats a hint. I suspect you are not really asking for that much. But for someone that is unprepared for the task at hand.. they will become overwhelmed very quickly. Maybe they even freeze up."
That's what I suspect as well.
"Too soon? Who says it is too soon COry? You, me, him, my kids? WHO? When/how will I know it isnt early to quit?"
Here are my thoughts here, so take them for what they are worth…
The suggestions to be blunt and straight-forward are excellent. Bill’s conversation is one that should take place, as should the simple question of “what have you been doing to strengthen our marriage?”
Face-to-face is a must and I would have you write everything down. Who cares if you have to use it as a reference b/c this is important to you and you don’t want to miss out on the opportunity to speak from the heart.
I know you've said them before, but the problem is he hasn't listened. You can say them again and ask for a response - a letter may do the trick. A non-response from him is also an answer and although he's doing it to you now by not writing back to your letter, it still seems to be a good, direct, blunt way to let him know - "either get w/the program or the train is leaving."
That said, I do firmly believe IC can and will be your friend if you C will challenge you to be better by looking deep w/in yourself before looking elsewhere. If you haven’t asked for this already, I suggest you tell you C to challenge you – even though it will be difficult and sometimes painful – b/c that is the only way you will grow and find yourself.
Remember “to get through the pain, you have to go through the pain.” I’m referring to you personally, not H. He has his own journey to take (and quite frankly, I’d demand his going to IC as well) as do you both still as a couple.
However, until you come to find peace w/Maria, nothing will be solved for you, your marriage, or your H.
FG says “do work” and I think the M should be set aside right now to let Maria work on finding Maria – truly digging and unearthing to find Maria. After that, everything will fall into place b/c Maria will truly and completely know who Maria is and what she wants out of everything.
Again, take my comments for what they’re worth, but from my seat, this is how I see it.
