It seems to me that you have made it clear what you want. And he has made it clear that it is not what he wants. Where do you want to go from there? That sounds a little harsh, but at this point it seems to be the way it is.
I want to apologise in advance for what I think will be a long post.
Firstly I want to say that I thought it was really great that you asked B about Portland, and I was blown away that he called to discuss your motives in meeting with him with you. That shows a level of emotional awareness and confidence that is really great, and he was comfortable in having the conversation when he could have easily avoided it. That's great!
Originally Posted By: M
"I do not want to be harsh and I could be wrong
Yes- he could be, you could be, we could all be...... (I hate when people preface what they're going to say by saying this- sorry- it's a pet peeve!)
Originally Posted By: M
but I think that B has always been ambivalent about you.
Do you think that's really true? I don't think it is- I think that if B was ambivalent about you he wouldn't have been with you for 5 years, worked through all the long distance things in your R and wanted to try new bedroom things with you- he could have walked away at any point and he didn't.
Originally Posted By: M
The problem is that you want to be closer to him more than he wants to be closer to him. That has always been the problem between you and it still is the problem, and as long as you want to him back, it will prevent you from reconciling.
I agree with this- the WA usually returns when the LBS no longer wants them. DBing is about letting go and focussing on yourself and I think that's what M is saying too.....
Originally Posted By: M
You totally tipped your hand, he completely knows that you want him
I disagree- you sent the message that you're visiting a lot of people in the area and thought it'd be nice to see B too. It was just a suggestion to meet as friends, albeit with a bit of a journey attached to it. That's fine- you were doing it for others too and not planning on starting LTRs with any of them....
Originally Posted By: M
and he was sending a very clear message that he does not want you to come closer and he does not want you to have hope.
I think this is interesting. B saying that he wants to see you in January and to keep things enjoyable is a message that he's enjoying your friendship. I think that's a good thing. Given how much time has passed so far he could easily have canned the Jan meeting too, and he didn't. Also, if you asked any WA whether they want the LBS at any point prior to them reconciling, they'd say they didn't. You just need to go stage by stage and focus on the friendship right now (and not think about stage 4 til you get there!)
Originally Posted By: M
Why don't you just be friends with him? As long as you are still strategizing, he will be able to smell that, and it will repel him.
Interesting...... I agree with the point about not strategizing. Once you're able to be natural with your interactions with B and not plan them their quality will change. And yes, being friends is what you're doing right now......
Originally Posted By: M
Is what you're feeling actually love? Or do you just not want to let go?"
How do you feel about this? I wonder about this myself- whether I still love H or just don't want to let him/the R go. On balance, I do still love him- I'm reminded when I see him of how much, but it's a tricky one for me to answer....
Originally Posted By: Lovely
I didn't even try to defend myself. I just listened and tried not to cry.
Well done you on listening and not defending yourself- that's such a hard thing to do and I'm so proud that you were able to take and digest M's feedback.
Originally Posted By: T
hOr, maybe B was just facing a custom-made crisis a la Passionate Marriage, and fled, but that's not how most people think about things, including my friend M, who just interprets my situation as "you two are incompatible".
Most people do think that way, but the important thing is what you think. You were in the R with B- you know what it was like and whether B was there in the R or not. What does your heart tell you?
Originally Posted By: T
Do I have a pattern of not being able to see when the people who are close to me don't want to give me what I would like to share? When I was in high school I sustained a relationship for 1 1/2 years with someone who WASN:T EVEN INTO ME, and the whole thing was completely fueled by my own fantasy and stubborness.
Sweetie- was this a high school crush? Don't ALL girls have these? I don't think it sets a pattern for the future- it's what happens when you're a teenager, and it happens to everyone. Don't beat yourself up about it.
Originally Posted By: T
now I feel like I totally blew it by trying to push to see him sooner, like I thought I was accelerating the process (DUH, BAD IDEA)
No, it wasn't a bad idea- it was an experiment, which you tried, and ended up getting different results with. Different results aren't bad- they're just different and now you have more information than you had before. Isn't it useful to know what B was thinking? Trying different things is what DBing is about- don't beat yourself up. Chalk it down to experience and pick yourself up. Also, one interaction doesn't blow anything- it's the overall pattern that counts, and yours has been really positive so far.
Originally Posted By: T
and now we have rewound to... before 5 months of NC. I mean, what am I supposed to do now? Not contact him? Do another 5 months of NC?
I agree with all the others- NC doesn't help your sitch. I liked Essie's ideas on how to contact B coming up to when you were supposed to meet, but leave it til the last minute so he has time to contact you. After he's had time to digest what you spoke about with him, he may well do......
Originally Posted By: T
Did he never "choose" me? Would he ever choose me? Is that because I suck to be with, or because (like passionate marriage) he needed to grow up and choose ? Was I completely delusional for those 5 years that I shared with him? Was I totally blinded by my own self-serving desires and insecurities? I thought I had released control... Am I still as controlling as I've ever been?
No, Yes, No, Maybe, No, No, No.
Originally Posted By: T
I just spent.... 13 1/2 months trying to reassure him I was innoccous, and now I completely freaked him out with what I thought was a harmless invitation.
You are ASS-U-ME-ing here. You didn't totally freak him out- you just got him thinking. That isn't a bad thing- it shows he does think about things, and you.
Originally Posted By: T
I also feel like I blew my shot at actually getting advice for him about my career, now I even wonder if me continuing to bring that up was a form of pressure on him. ??(#$#*($&@????????
I think that if you want the advice, you can still ask for it. Just do it with no expectations and in a friendly way. Can it wait until January when you were originally going to meet? Don't make any decisions about January immediately- just wait and do nothing for now.
Originally Posted By: T
I don't think he explained to me his feelings because he wanted to get closer, I think he explained them to me because he wants to push me farther away. And how much farther away can I go? I really do not know what to do.
don't go any further away! He wasn't pushing you away- he was just saying that he wants to keep things enjoyable. That's a fair thing to say- keeping things enjoyable is good. it means that right now, things are enjoyable. I'd love it if my H said that to me. Imagine! He's just saying that he wants to maintain the status quo (for now)
Originally Posted By: T
Please be gentle with me.
Always, Lovely!
Originally Posted By: T
Part of me wants to say, "look, I am amazing. I am beautiful, smart, talented, extremely loving, and hot as hell. I really care about you. But if you don't want to be close to me, what can I do? It's your loss. I have better things to do than wait around for you."
Yes- say it/do it! I liked what everyone aid about showing B all this stuff.
Originally Posted By: T
Am I becoming embittered?
No- wanting to move on isn't being embittered. It's normal.
Originally Posted By: T
If I continue to be in contact with him... I feel like I should back off and make myself unavailable.
I don't think this will help your sitch- as you say, contact is too sporadic and having none won't make things better.
So, to summarise, you're lovely, B is silly not to see it, and do nothing for now- see if he contacts you before January. If he hasn't by then, nonchalantly mention the meeting to him the night before and then go ahead with being your amazing self. And if he brings up an R talk, look shocked and say that you thought you guys were just friends and you need time to think about what he's said.
(((((Lovely One))))) Don't feel bad. You're doing brilliantly under difficult circumstances. It's not over until YOU decide it is- I know that's hard to remember sometimes, but you need to decide what you want (friendship?) and then focus on your goal. FWIW you are an amazingly caring and beautiful soul. I'm sure that there are thousands of men out there who would kill to have someone like you by their side, so it becomes and question of which one you want. Keep your eyes and heart open while you continue on the path to B- you never know what life might throw at you unexpectedly. (By which I don't mean give up on B, just be open to the world of possibilities.....)
I had a revelation today, and thought of you, then saw Lisa's excellent post.. she highlighted wheh you said...
Originally Posted By: T
now I feel like I totally blew it by trying to push to see him sooner, like I thought I was accelerating the process (DUH, BAD IDEA)
Remember my hideous head-in-hands-oh-god-beam-me-up-Scotty-nightmare in a layby with my ex? 3 weeks ago? And I said the exact same thing... oh god, I've gone and blown it now, he wont want to see me, I have pushed him further away...and you pointed out to me, maybe not...
THEN...I get a very very sweet hour long phonecall AND a pressie and card in the post!! So I didnt 'blow it' with this one awkward moment, but I am blown away by what he did. So.. you never really know what they're thinking.
Like Lisa says, look at the overall pattern and that is in your case, pretty positive. I too was impressed he said he wanted to keep things enjoyable BUT that he wanted to see you still in January.
Love and hugs, Al xxx
Me:40! H:37 Together: 12yrs IDLY & left 11/07 ADs 03/08 OW 8/08 Reconciled 05/09 now married! my thread
Merry Christmas Lovely T! Hope you have a good time with your family. I'm sure that things will work out with B. Or something better will come along! I hope 2009 is a fantastic year for you - where you see the fruit of all your hard work in 2008. Thanks as always for being such a lovely friend to me. I really appreciate the thought that you put into the posts - you have truly challenged me and helped me with your posts. Helped me to look deeper at issues. I owe you hundreds of dollars in C fees! Thanks for being you, and such a good friend to me! Will be thinking of you often over the next few weeks, and sending up little prayers for you! Lots of love xx
Happy Christmas, I hope you have a lovely time. I just wanted to say a big thank you for being such a great friend to me this year and for offering such good advice and perspective - you have really helped me think constructively and I wanted to give big thanks for that.
Hi T. I'm logging in to DB from Singapore - hoping to hear news of you and B. Anyway just want to let you know that I'm thinking of you and hope you got thru Xmas and everything OK. When is the meet up in Jan scheduled for? I'm glad to see you having a break from the DB board though - I think sometimes it becomes re-inforcement for thinking about our stupid stiches.
