Working on a friendship

[Belle]

Thanks for stopping by optimist. Everything is fine.

H and I went to dinner last night for Christmas and we had a good time. I got him 2 audio books (Live your Best Life Now and Awakening to Your Life's Purpose.)

I haven't been on the boards lately - I needed a break.

I told my H last night that I have enjoyed talking with him more lately and I wondered if he feels we'll just always be friends or more. He responded that he's not sure, he's confused. (Which I figured). I know everyone on the board will say it's a mistake to talk about R, but that's exactly the reason I haven't been on the boards.

I need communication in my life. I haven't muttered a word about the R for 4 month. My psychologist said that just simply asking him that question, that certainly won't make him run the other way if he is considering reconciliation. I didn't pressure,just wanted to know where he's coming from. He may be doing all this purely out of friendship - no thoughts or feelings of reconciliation at all. That would be nice to know for me so that I'm not setting myself up for a huge disappointment.
So, I'm glad I asked.

He asked me where I was coming from and I told him I'm not sure either - I know that our marriage wasn't a good situation and that if we did get back together it would have to be really different. He agreed and said we would have to go to counseling. I know he was a little uncomfortable because he changed the subject by mentioning about his sister and her marriage.

Anyways, we're both headed out of town for the holidays. Him to FL- that lucky dog! Today it's -10 degrees F. Awful!!!

I won't be on the boards for a while - staying at my parents and they don't have internet!

[Belle]

Ok, so I haven't been on the boards in a while. And I know that probably nobody will respond and that's fine. I'm just going to vent.

I know that I'm not supposed to have expectations. I know that I'm not supposed to ask any questions or have any hope. But this situation is very frustrating.

I know my H is having an emotional affair. And he is probably having a physical affair. The frustrating part is that he calls me and likes to chat and wants to take me out for my B-day and blah, blah, blah.

What a fake. Or an a$$ who wants to test the waters because he can.

I feel like this DBing is so detrimental to a person's ego and pride. How can I just sit here and act so fake - like I don't really care if he spends his time with her.

I have been GAL and not focusing on him or us. I am doing well but I have my bad days. But I don't want to be led on by interactions and have hope. It's so easy to say "Don't have expectations", but very hard to implement.

I call and listen to his voicemails once in a while. I know others will 2 x 4 me, but it helps to bring me back down to earth. When he is acting all nice and like he is interested in keeping in contact with me to feel things out, I think that he may want to work on our marriage. But then he is pursuing her and probably doing we all know what to her, and it just makes me realize how far we are from anything at all. I know it's closer than some, but I'd almost rather have it that way. It wouldn't be so confusing.

Oh! I am just so pissed!!! I don't know how we all do it. She's just a 23 year old twerp who doesn't know anything.

I'm ready to confront him. Tell him how I feel. I enjoy talking with him, but I know that he is carrying on with her to test her out. And I feel that is disrespectful. And I don't want to be disrespected. I don't want a marriage like that. As my psychologist said, I am enabling him. This could go on for a long time.

I try to move forward but I keep getting distracted by him -

Which, by the way he just called - I came soooooo close to saying something. He was going on and on about his classes and exams and how stupid they are and how he gets so angry and so mad and fired up. And that it sucks. I kept saying, a lot of things suck, and a lot of things fire people up, and a lot of things make us mad......(specificallly me - he makes me mad, he fires me up and he sucks)

But I didn't say anything. I'm so gooooooood! Puke.

[whateverittakes]

Hello Belle,

Do you know what you want?

The dbing can work. This may sound harsh, but your h is giving you good information about his needs, some of which he may be having met through ow. I think you have a choice about whether you want to step up and try to meet those needs - be the more attractive option to the ow.

I believe the fact that he is telling you these things means that he still has hope and hasn't let go completely. You have a window here to work within, and whether you do so is your choice. If you choose not to, that window will likely close. He will close it when he loses hope and let's go completely.

It will probably require you to use words of affirmation - ones that really come from your heart. This may be a 180 for you but perhaps knowing whether you want this man in your life or not could motivate you.

With respect, I disagree with your psychologist. Unless the therapist is familar with dbing, they may not realize just how damaging talking about the r can be at times like this. Your h may feel it as controlling or pressuring. Have you thought about how you could formulate a 180 related to those behaviours?

There's no doubt that dbing can feel "unfair" and "one-sided". But in doing it, if you're being true to yourself and what you want in life, it's really all about you. It may have the effect of helping bring your h to the point of wanting to try to restore the m, then the piecing work happens between the two of you.

One person can't make a marriage work, but your marriage isn't working right now so you need to work on you.

I used to be controlling at times and it came from my insecurities. I've stopped controlling, not just my h but everyone. I'm becoming more secure in myself and letting other people be who they are. What motivates me? In part, wanting to restore my m, but also realizing that no one wants to be controlled. It is my behaviour that I want to change, for myself. Even if my h doesn't return, the next man in my life won't want to be controlled either.

It's a work in progress for all of us. I don't think I've "arrived" anywhere but I'm glad for what dbing is doing for me. Faced with losing something as important as my m has motivated me to look at myself. I've got a lot of learning and growing to do.

I hope you consider joining the DA club and let your h contact you. It sounds like he still wants to. I don't think mine does.

Sorry for the long post and I hope you don't feel like I hijacked your thread. I'm obviously struggling and working things through on a daily basis.

[Belle]

Thank you for your thoughts, whateverittakes.

No, I don't know what I want. I'm actually enjoying living alone. I don't have to worry about making him happy. I don't have to go through 2 more years of hell while he is in school. I can do whatever I want, when I want.

I think I know what he needs and I give it to him. I encourage him, tell him he is going to be an awesome chiropractor, tell him his personality is going to do wonders for him. I sympathize with him when he is down about a test. But last night I drew the line because he kept obsessing about it. I told him he needs to move forward. Allow himself a certain amouont of time to be angry and get his frustration out, but then move on.

I know he hasn't lost hope or completely let go. I know that.

But I don't feel like I'm being true to myself. The person that I have been is a strong, independent woman. I have a lot of self respect and I feel like this situation is destroying that. I'm not sure if I'm willing to give that up to save my M. I'm not one of those people who will do anything to save my marriage. That's sad to say but it's the truth.

Whateverittakes - What is the DA club? And you didn't hijack my thread! I'll have to check out yours.

Right now, I feel I have 3 options. If anyone can enlighten me or revise them, I would appreciate advice.

1. Continue to interact with him, be friendly and try to establish a relationship. This is all the while he probably doing who knows what with OW. I will resolve to not care what he is doing with her - no checking voicemails. It's called detachment. I know it would be hard but for the most part I know I can do it if I really want. The problem with this is that I get optimistic about us and hope we have a future when he gives me little tidbits of hope (Like, "maybe someday we'll go to my family's for the holidays"). So I feel optimistic and get my hopes up when all the while he's having a relationship with and falling for OW.

2. Continue to interact with him but also continue my investigative work. This helps to keep me grounded and not get my hopes up. But it is also very hard on me. I agonize over what he is doing with her and I subject myself to hearing things that will really hurt me. Sometimes I lose sleep over it and it brings me down for a few days after I find out the information.

3. Tell him that I have to discontinue personal contact with him - only talk about "business" stuff. Tell him I have to do this for my own personal self respect. I feel very disrespected by the situation and I cannnot disregard my values and morals. As long as he is carrying on with OW, I need to distance myself. It's damaging to my self respect. (Of all people, he should understand this as this was always his focus - his pride and if I was disrespecting him how others would view him. It's not necessarily how others view me but actually how I view myself)

I don't know what to do and I am struggling.

[MsMelancoly]

Hi Belle, Just thought I would stop by & say hello. You ask some tough questions about which path to take. My advise, would be to stop the snooping, so to speak. For me anyway, I found it as a form of control, in trying to control my own fears. In the end it was only hurtful to me. That is one step in detaching, because you cannot control what he does.

Do you listen to him without giving advise? That is one of my downfalls. You still have a line of communication open, which is good. In Michele's other book I'm reading it says for men actions speak louder than words. How about not taking all his phone calls & be mysterious???

I too am a strong independent women .... in the end you have to do what is best for you. I'm probably cannot give much good advise, as I'm on the sinking M ship.

Can you evaluate what you have done so far & come up with some 180s to try or different cheesetunnels to go down??? Just some thoughts.

[Belle]

Hey Ms M!

Thanks for stopping by!!

You are from WI - me too! I live in IA now b/c of my H's schooling but I am orginally from Waukesha and lived in Milwaukee for 10 years.

Anyway, I know the snooping is not good for me personally. And I know I can't control him. But what I can control is my actions and responses when I know that he is continuing to be with her. Does anyone think that this should affect the way I act towards him? Or the amount of hope that I have for our M?. I'm not sure.

I'm sorry to hear you are on the sinking M ship. But certainly that doesn't mean that you cannot give good advice!

I know I need to do what's best for me but the problem is I'm trying to determine exactly what that is!

I have not taken his phone calls and it doesn't do much at all. No response, really. Well, actually, this week I did that and then he called me the next morning at 8am. I asked him "Why so early?". He replied that he drove past the house and saw the lights on, so he knew I was up. He was worried b/c I told him there was this ex-con at my church who's been flirting with me and he said that I had him freaked out that the ex-con was holding me hostage in the basement of the house. So I'm not sure really if not answering his phone calls does anything to progress our R.

I guess I will try to come up with some 180s.....

Thanks Ms M.

[whateverittakes]

Belle - I'm on the fly here so will come back to read your recent posts more thoroughly.

Many of my friends who've known me for over 20 years would likely describe me as a very strong, independent and even tough woman. I've had to be that way throughout my life. But I've learned that marriage is not the same kind of challenge as many of the others that I've faced and met in my life.

In the end, the question I asked myself was: do I want to be right more than I want to be married.. to this man?

[MsMelancoly]

What a small world it is.

My POV will be different - because my H never contacts me. So I see your H calling at 8am as a good sign. Call it worried, call it jealous, call it snooping .... fact is he was checking up on you. And he told you.

Question for you, when he calls does he just vent or is there more convo? Does he ask about you .... is he curious??

One thing my DBcoach told me was to be mysterious. I couldn't do it nor had much of a chance.

Independence & strength, that is how I was when we dated. Myself, I realize my faults & know I became to controlling. Good insight to have.

Still just throwing out ideas ...

[Belle]

Hi WIT...

Ok, so it's not about being right. If that's what it was about, I would have been gone long ago. I know that I was wrong in our R, too. I didn't listen to my H, I probably was controlling, and I didn't love my H like he needed me to. (physically and emotionally)

It's about being respected. I just don't know how I can get over the disrespect. If he had left on his own and was sorting things out on his own, fine. I understand. But he is disrespecting me and our marriage, carrying on with her. Which is something that he said he would not do to me. He told me he needed to clear his head, not confuse it more with her.

So he lied about that and he is continuing to lie to me about her.

I know he is messed up right now and I am supposed to be there for him. But it's just hard....

My question for myself is - do I want to be respected more than I want to be married to this man??

I don't know the answer yet but its leaning towards the respected side.....

[Belle]

Yes, it is a good sign that he called to check on me. I know he cares about me still.

When we do talk - he asks about me and how things are going. He knows exactly when I am down - like the other day he called and I had a problem at work. Later that night when I talked with him he asked me about it again and wanted to know if it was resolved and was glad when I told him it was.

I know he cares.....

I know I'm supposed to be mysterious, but it is very hard to. I'll have to work on that.

Thanks Ms M.

I'm sorry you don't talk to your H. How are you holding up?