Husband insists its over-what now? Please help!

[lea123]

Hi

I posted on the Newcomers board but a couple of people suggested it may be better on the MLC board-although H is only 27!!

Here's my story:

Me & H have been together since we were 16 & 17, split for 9 months when we were 20 (he finished it) went our seperate ways for a bit, then he phoned me, we met up and got back together. Been living together since Nov 03, we got married in July 06, and he admits he was totally happy and in love then. H was a laidback, carefree musician, always smiling and 'chilled', nothing fazed him. Although he has never talked about his emotions and actually we now think he may have mild signs of autism. We hardly ever argued, occassionally 'bickered' but more in a jokey way. He hardly ever got angry or lost his temper.

In Nov 06 he was suspended from work and had to fight to keep his job which dented his confidence. In my eyes, thats when the problems started. He began showing signs of depression-irritability, insomnia, not eating, etc etc. Doctors tried various anti depressants which made his symptoms worse. One night he even self harmed which is something he had never done before or since. He would also walk the streets at night because he could not bear to be in the house, couldnt watch TV because he couldnt concentrate etc. Sometimes if we were out, something would 'switch' in his head, his mood would instantly change, he would say he wanted to be dead and needed to go home straight away. He would constantly snap at me for no reason.

In April 07 his mum was diagnosed with cancer which was a shock. Our relationship came to a head in June 07 when after a drunken row about me not feeling loved he left to stay with his parents. He was insistent that he was depressed because he wasnt happy with his life and our relationship. He was only gone a week before he came back, but in truth me and his parents put a lot of pressure on him to come back and tried to convince him he was depressed.

So he came back, the doctor put him on a different stronger anti depressant which seemed to do the trick and things started improving. He even referred a couple of times to his depression causing the problems which to me was him admitting that it wasnt our relationship that caused his depression like he had previously said. Things were nearly back to normal, when in October 07 his dad walked out on his mum after 30 years of marriage. Totally unexpected, and not long after his dad had been telling my H that he owed it our marriage not to leave etc. His dad was also a Vicar for 25 years and he gave that up! So I imagine this shook my H's world, but he never talks about stuff. Things were fine until Boxing Day when he became very introverted again, showing signs of his depression. This lasted a few days until I forced him to talk. He said he felt unsettled again. He slept on the sofa and the next morning apologised and asked if we could put it down to experience and forget it happened. So we did.

On New Years Eve we joked that we hoped 2008 would be a new start for our marriage. On New Years Day my mum had a heart attack, again, totally unexpected. Things were really touch and go and it was extremely difficult for a while. I went back to work 2 days after she had the heart attack, and H usually has band practise that night of the week. He did not offer to cancel it. He did not contact me at all that day-not even a text-to ask how my mum or I was doing. He came back at 11.15pm that night and I heard him in the living room watching telly. I went downstairs and he casually told me that band practise had been cancelled and he had spent the evening playing video games round a friends. I burst into tears-couldnt believe that my mum was in hospital nearly dying and this was how he helped me cope.

My mum started to get better and things between me & H did too. In Feb I arranged a surprise weekend in London for his birthday, and he told me how much he loved me. We had got into some debt whilst he was depressed because he couldnt work, so we started talks with our mortgage company to get a re-mortgage. I sat H down and said he has to be sure about us because we will be tied together financially if we go ahead with his. He says he is totally sure about us. Late Feb he loses his job-turns out he was working for a dodgy firm and they were withholding his pay so we have to get Solicitors involved to try and get the money back. So he was jobless and we were having financial difficulties and had to put the remortgage on hold. In March we had a week in Lanzarote that had been booked for ages and it was great-not a single row, just really relaxing and lovely. I finally thought we had turned a corner in our M. The day we got back his mood switched again. We put it down to the post holiday blues but his mood never lifted and 2 weeks later I pushed him to talk. He said he felt unsettled and needed time to think. So he went to stay with his dad.

He's been gone a month today. The first couple of weeks he was coming back to the house every day to say hi to me and our dog and cat, and to pick stuff up. Then he said he still didnt think he wanted to come home so we agreed to have a week of no contact. After this week he came round and said he still felt he didnt want to come back, but something was holding him back from making that final decision. He said he wanted to try marriage counselling. We also agreed we would spend 'fun' time together each week. On Sunday we spent some time together and it was good.

Last night we had the marriage counselling and the marriage counsellor seemed to recognise straight away that I was the one who dealt with everything practical in the marriage, that I was 'his rock' and he was giving mixed signals.
Counsellor asked H if he loved me, he very matter of factly said no, that he doesnt love me like he should, hasnt missed me and doesnt see a future for our marriage. He just says that he has changed as a person and doesnt see me as the person he wants to be with anymore, and that he cares for me only because we have been together a long time and its familiar and comfortable. Marriage counsellor says he seems very confused but that their is no point us having any further couple sessions as it will be a waste of money. She suggests he has some individual sessions though. In the car afterwards he said that on Sunday he felt he didnt really have anything to say to me, and that after not seeing me for a week he should have lots to say to his wife. He said that he wants to go to individual counselling but he thinks he is not coming back. He says he is adamant that his depression has been bought on by guilt of not wanting the relationship.

So there we are. Sorry its so long.

What do I do now?????

Thanks for reading
Lea

[SirPrizeMe]

Lea, I'm sorry you're here.
The situation sounds very troubling. It's a lot to deal with all in a short time - the health of your mum, his mum, his father walking out, and then of course your own marriage. It's got to be hard on you.

I'm no expert on MLC but 27 sure sounds early for MLC. Sheesh you don't even have kids.

Aside from that it sure does seem that he is depressed.

...flatly said no, that he doesnt love me like he should, hasnt missed me and doesnt see a future for our marriage.

That is right out of the depression book. Everything looks black to him.

As I read what you wrote I was thinking - have you read the DB book? (The DR book, really) It is good reading, may provide you with some comfort. Basically, this happens a lot. You can do specific things to make yourself stronger and happier during this tough time, and the good news is a stronger and happier Lea is good for your marriage, too. Above all you need to be calm and strong for yourself.

Couple other things that occurred to me:

• if the counselor is suggesting that counseling is not useful, I would tend to agree. Counseling is very difficult for some people. if he is not willing, even enthusiastic, then it could be more damaging than helpful. Maybe a prudent course is to take the pressure off.
• he was not there for you during the time of your mum's crisis. And it sounds as if this will continue for a while. I know it's hard on you and not what you want, but it is what's happening. There are a couple paths: you could continue to depend on him now, and state those expectations. Bursting into tears is probably not the best way - maybe saying "look this is a really tough time for me, I would like to talk. Have you got some time for me?" or something calm like that. The other option is to just back off and let him rest, find other interests and keep yourself busy. The DR book doesn't recommend either approach - it offers examples of both, and recommends to "do what works." So ... you could try one or the other and see if you think it makes any difference. If no difference, then maybe change your approach.
• for example, seems to me that going on holiday worked. And also having your fun time on sunday, worked. Could you extend those things somehow? What made your early years really fun? could you rekindle that somehow? If he is truly depressed about the job, maybe he needs to get away from responsibility for a while. Maybe the mortgage is not the right thing, right now for your marriage. Maybe renting a place, change of scenery, would be better. OF course those are big questions, and you will have to decide how far you are willing to go for this man. How much are you willing to divert the course of your life for this person?
• There are some experts who advocate backing off the pressure in order to ease the problems. If you "work on" your marriage, it tends to amplify the pressure for some people.
• Trying to convince someone they are depressed can turn into a war. They resist and it only makes things worse. You do not need to get him to agree with your view of his depression, in order to do things to make it easier on him.
• Gaining some perspective may help. I read some of Winston Churchill's writings and it really put my marriage situation into perspective. Maybe you could do something like that. OF course your H needs perspective too, but an oblique approach might be best. Maybe he sees you reading a book, and his curiosity is piqued. Rather than you handing him a book to read.
• think about the source of his depression. What would be an oblique way to help him to realize that his job troubles won't last forever, that he is not his father, or whatever. Are there new things you can do, things you've always wanted to do that you never quite got round to? Like singing lessons or volunteering at the soup kitchen. Starting something new maybe will show him what is possible.

I don't know if this helps. good luck!

[lea123]

Thanks for your reply, it is really insightful.

The book has arrived but I have not had a chance to read it. Will do it asap!

I think the thing I'm struggling with now is that he seems to be 'over' his depression. He is nowhere near as bad as he was this time last year. He just seems to be convinced that I am not what he wants anymore. The counsellor said that she has known a lot of couples who meet young, get married then one partner has a change of heart. That may be true but I dont think that was good for H to hear-its justifying his actions.

He just talks very matter of factly about how getting married seemed like the perfectly natural thing to do at the time, and he was really happy, but a few months later he just changed his mind. He says that he feels we've both changed (but won't really elaborate on that), that the relationship and I do not make him happy anymore. I asked him if I was the person he saw by his side in his future, and he said no.

He started a new job a week before he moved out, and seems to be getting on really well with it. I feel that he has moved on emotionally from us and I'm not sure how to get that back.

Can this be turned around??

[cat03]

is he still taking meds? he sounds just like my stbx, who is breaking up the M because he feels detached and empty inside, thus, the first person in his line of vision gets it:me. He is horribly depressed and suffers from anxiety and has decided there is gap between us, doesn't know how to fix it and that he'll be better off alone.

Please don't believe anything he says (about the M, how you are now, etc etc) , it is his depression trying to make sense of that void he's got, it is not easy to admit to depression, so now he's trying to cut you off from his life thinking this will solve all his problems, which won't happen.

Of course both of you chanced! it'd be horribly unnatural if after 10yrs you handn't changed a bit, there is nothing wrong with that.

A good book to read is "Talking to Depression" about people with loved ones who are depressed, it will help you understand how he is feeling.

[lea123]

Hello

Yes he's still taking meds; Effexor, which in the UK is an antidepressant they only give after the first 2 or so havent worked. Kind of a last resort. He was taking 300mg a day, but since Jan he has been coming down (as discussed with doctor) and is now on 150mg daily. Which is still a fairly high dose. H says coming off the meds is the only way he thinks he will be able to find out how he really feels about stuff.

The main thing I notice about him is that his spark in his eyes have gone, if that makes sense? Looking at the wedding DVD and old pics he looked so 'alert' but now his eyes look so sad and lifeless. Thats whether he's with me or not.

But he is adamant that he doesnt love me they way he should love a wife, and that he is depressed because he feels guilty and unhappy about being in an unhappy relationship. Not sure there's much I can do about that. I am going to GAL and do a 180-I used to support him so much, I think I forgot who I was and what I needed from a marriage.

Its just so difficult!!!!!

Thanks again

Lea
xxx

[Jack_Three_Beans]

hrnmm...

Some sort of pandemic over there in England...like 28 weeks later.

Lea, you're in a good spot, you'll have alot of support over here.

Check out both AliSuddenlyAlone and OneDay...both I believe live over there in Sunny Britian. : )

Angelica too...several others.

Have you checked out the MLC Resources at the top of the board here?

A good place to see if your H has any of the symptoms.

MLC is a hellish ride, and one that I am not sorry I missed. I honestly can say being an LBS was the best thing that has ever happened to me...and no I'm not a masochist.

[peacetoday]

lea
whether its MLC or any crises, it may take on the same symptoms
they all say its over, it is us, they just dont love us anymore.
So, they go on to create this new life where they can find happiness
only it doesnt work, many of our mlcers look horribly depressed act confused, spend lots of money and never seem to reach this comfort state they had originally hoped for
you can read alot and decide if you want to try standing for your M for a while
thenn anything can happen
it becomes a rollercoaster ride that lasts for many months or years.
some H return-many do not
we LBS seem to make a lot of progress though toward finding that happiness that our WAS left for
peace

[SirPrizeMe]

Lea, I hate that you find yourself here.

This is going to sound counter-intuitive, confusing, and hurtful, but... maybe... you need to let him go.

Here's the thing - fighting him now may just be counterproductive. "Talking sense" to him, may just push him away.

Check the book. It will give you some insight.

Let him go, and he may come back to you.

[cat03]

Not sure there's much I can do about that.

and you shouldnt' anyway, the battle is his, he has to decide to get out that hole for himself, others' efforts to help him will not give him the resolve to fix himself.

I am going to GAL and do a 180-I used to support him so much, I think I forgot who I was and what I needed from a marriage.

I'll tell you what I was told as I hanged to my cheating H for dear life as he lied and deceived me time and time again "you can't save a man from himself". I had become an enabler, making excuses for him, walking in eggshells, trying to be his cheerleader, his entertainer, taking care of all the unpleasantries: house work, kids' homwork, paying bills, etc etc. What didnt' I do???? even help him deal with crazy ow. Nothing I did made any difference, he just wanted to crawl into a hole and not face the consecuences of his actions nor had the will/strenght to fight for our family.

Sadly, sometimes we must let a loved one fall flat on their faces and see them fail, for only then will they learn-- specially if you, like me, have bent out of shape for so long trying to make their life easier and have forgotten to take care of yourself.

[lea123]

I spoke to him on the phone earlier today and its made me realise that I have to move on with my life now.

He was so matter of fact about the end of us, it was like he was talking about something mundane like what he had for dinner! Obviously his voice was so familiar to me, but from the stuff he was saying I realise that he's not the man I married and have loved all these years. The long and short of it is, he doesnt love me in the way he should love a wife. He cares for me because we've been together for so long but doesnt feel we have that connection anymore. He feels that he doesnt even want to try and get it back. He said that it wasnt something that happened overnight, it was a gradual thing and in hindsight he probably started feeling like this before we got married but didnt realise it at the time. I asked what changed in our relationship, he said just him. He had realised that he didnt want our relationship. He said he feels we've grown apart. He admitted we'd had some good times recently, like a holiday in Lanzarote and weekend away in London, but said he didnt feel the 'connection' as much as I did. Stupidly I said something like 'think of all the things we'll never do together again, like we'll never make love again' and he said that although he found me 'sexy', he wouldnt want to sleep with me because he didnt love me anymore.

I had tears running down my face when he said all this, but its what I needed to be able to say to myself enough's enough. I still can't quite believe I'm here-he was my best friend as well as my husband and having been together for 10 years he knows everything about me. Its hard to imagine a life without him by my side. But I must look to the future and concentrate on me for a bit.

I am a big believer in fate and that things happen for a reason, and feel that perhaps we both need to grow individually into the people we are meant to become. Having been with him since we were teenagers, I think he probably feels that the grass is greener elsewhere etc. Who knows, perhaps it is, perhaps it isn't. Maybe our paths will cross one day again.

Is this DBing or just giving up? Not too sure...

Lea
xxx