Hopefulll: Kicked her out while she was in Hawaii

[hopefulll]

Hello all. My original newcomer thread is here: Was kicking her ou a 180 or a mistake? I was hoping to get some new POVs on the situation in this forum.

Really quickly I'll repost some of my entries.

Originally Posted 4/23/08

Hello everyone,

I'm so glad I found this board. I'll try to keep this short because I know reading these takes so much time. I appreciate your help.

I've been with my WAW for almost 7 years (since college) and we felt essentially married. We were actually married last September. After 6 months, (March 1) her coworker turned into a PA. I was suspicious on day-one when she lied about a date. It was confirmed for me when our "bedroom aides" (haha) conspicuously disappeared a few days later. We hadn't had sex in about a year, which I foolishly attributed to 7-year-complacency. I figured it was a phase.

When I learned the truth I exploded and freaked and cried and pleaded and bought gifts. I even said "look how I'm changing!" (oops) Then I started doing a 180. She was staying at his place 3 or 4 nights a week. Texting him until 3:00 am when she was home. Bought a new fancy phone to text him the rest of the time.

Then I learned (spying) that there was a different PA the summer before the wedding. I gave up! I "knew" it couldn't work. Took off my ring. Told my immediate family. I ate the cost of my ticket to Hawaii and let her go on our vacation by herself. (Planning for months!) While she was gone, I packed all her clothes and necessities and dropped them in OM's office. I was calm, but it is a small company so I effectively outed them to the whole company. That night on the phone with her, having given up 180-ing and given up hope, I resorted to R talk and anger. (i.e. major backslide) They are now both super pissed!

Last night she came in angry to get a few things I forgot to pack. I was so thorough, though, that she seemed to be making up things to take. (I can't imagine he doesn't have an alarm clock. There is nothing she needs out of storage...) Was she checking in on me? I was happy that, even though she caught me off guard when she showed up unannounced, I was in full "as-if" mode and was quiet, kind, offered to be helpful, but otherwise kept to doing dishes.

I am now determined to 180, to GAL (i've been crazy busy! going out tonight), to be kind and understanding. I know that I can only affect me. My question for you is: Was it a mistake to kick her out? Did I push us to this place too soon? I know to be patient (now I know it) and give it months, but I worry that I've shot myself in the foot and completely wasted all out potential together time. Will there be opportunities for her to see the (still growing) new me?

2 or 3 times last month she threatened to move out and I got scared and pleaded! I can kinda justify my action in that kicking her out really is 180 degrees away from that. I love her and we have gotten through some of the most awful painful and scary situations together. I realize now that this is what the "or for worse" part means.

I ordered the books. Should show up tomorrow and I'm reading them this weekend. I'm actually feeling pretty good!

Anyway, sorry that was so long. Thanks in advance for your time!

[hopefulll]

Originally Posted 4/23/08

True. What's done is done. And true, I am by no means faultless. I was clingy, dependent, un-trusting because of some of our past life-hurdles. And I'm absolutely determined to fix myself. Grow for the better. She even gave me a list of things I need to work on but, since I was pleading and begging at the time, I didn't hear them all.

I plan on setting some goals for myself but I'm not so sure I know what kind of things I need to address. I'm hoping the books will clarify action-oriented goal setting. I know it's not just "Take that life-drawing class." and it's more "Agree with her without getting defensive" .... I think. Is that right?

Also, update: From the beginning she said that living with OM is not an option (but will never explain why. 4 nights a week is OK but 7 is not?) and that her brother is the only place that could work. Today she chatted "My brother's place won't work, so I and all my stuff will be coming home for the foreseeable future." I just said "Ok."

I'm going to be a friend and make home feel like a safe place to be. I'm worried that the very subject of the kick-out will be rocky terrain. I did it to say "I'm not putting up with this." But I'm sure she thinks I did it to hurt. Not a conversation I'm prepared for, I guess is what I'm saying.

Thank you all for taking the time for me!

[hopefulll]

Originally Posted 4/25/08

Here's an update:

She came back two days ago after work. No stuff with her. I asked "Are you home for real or are you here some nights and there some nights?" The latter was her answer. I said, essentially, "Ok. That's completely disrespectful to me to continue the thing with him and just ask me to be a roommate. We'll need to find some other arrangement." She agreed but right now nothing is feasible. ?? I went out that night with some new friends.

We spent the night in the same bed, barely. (She comes in to bed way, way late hoping I'll be asleep.) When we spend the evening in the same apartment, we're actually pleasant to each other. Making jokes. Laughing. Before the talk in the last paragraph she told me, and I kept asking about, Hawaii. It was nice. I'm making sure that I'm never the one with a sharp tongue. In fact, other than that one conversation, I avoid saying anything that might make her mad. She'll seem to want to start fights but I don't reciprocate. That ends them.

Last night, unable to gauge where I was/we were, I quickly caressed her arm as I rearranged my covers.
Her: What?
Me:[sleepy] hrmh?
Her: You brushed my arm.
Me: [sleepy] mmhmm
Her: I was asking why.
Me: [sleepy] mmunno (I dunno.)

I expected a response, and I got one. Now I know not to touch in that context. In fact, that allowed me to look at our situation a little more realistically and I grabbed a sleeping bag and an alarm clock and moved into the den a few minutes later. "G'night." As much as it kills my back, on the nights she's home, that's my new bedroom. (I'm buying an air mattress this weekend! Ouch!)

[hopefulll]

Originally Posted 4/25/08

I could definitely not afford a place of my own in addition to this place. Not in this town. I know that she was planning on living here until the lease is up at the end of June. That was before I kicked her out, though. Now I don't know.

Credit cards and bank stuff is not much of a concern. Actually, I never put her name ON the credit card until I decided not to go to Hawaii with her. She evidently always thought I was controlling of the finances and untrusting re: money. True! (in hindsight) Taking her off there is kind of a "more-of-the-same" for me. I'm watching the accounts like a hawk, though.

However, I have made a completely separate savings and checking account with a small emergency cushion to cover my own butt just in case she does something vindictive or dumb.

I'm thinking today I will ask her what progress she's made on a new place to live. Maybe "I realize now how serious you are about not wanting this marriage to work. I can respect that. If that's true you need to find someplace else sooner, not later." or "Don't come home this weekend." or "If that's true, I don't want to see you." (I'm certain that she is already planning on Friday/Saturday/Sunday nights over there. That was par for the course before Hawaii.)

I feel like I'm foolishly rambling when I post to this board. But I suppose that it's better to do that here than in a conversation with her! Thank you again!

Yesterday I spent a chunk of money on clothes. More than the old me would ever have been comfortable with! Tonight I'm getting a haircut, and I have plans with friends Sat and Sun. It feels kinda great!

This is where I am now. Any thoughts would really be appreciated. I hope someday to be able to help other people like me. Thanks!

[Sugar and Spice]

Hopefulll, my H left of his own free will, but if I were in your shoes I would probably tell her she needed to leave and then start LRT.

I'm not very good at DB'ing, but FWIW, thats what I would do. She has chosen this path and its is apparent that for the time being she is bent on it so let her do her thing while you get yourself together and do some more stuff to make you feel good. Do you know that you want it to work or what is your goal for this R?

[hopeful4her]

Dude, sorry, but the arm caress thing in bed had me rolling. WW and I have not been intimate in 7 months. Sometimes in bed, I will place my hand under hers while we are supposed to be asleep. Or stretching out and placing my arm on hers. With the same sound bits. She's a pretty heavy sleeper, so never really a reaction. Usually she'll feel it and just change positions.

It makes feel like such a dumb a$$, but man do I miss the intimacy between us.

You made me laugh. Not at you, at myself. Thanks.

[hopefulll]

Ok. A phone call (which she abruptly hung up) which turned into a chat may be paraphrased thusly:

Me: I understand, now, that you don't want this marriage to work. I guess I respect that. But if that's the case I need you to find a place sooner than later.
Her: I know that and I'm looking online every day. I don't need you reminding me every four days and being an a$$hole! [click!]

Later...

Me: You hung up.
Her: You were being an a$$. *
Me: Don't come home this weekend.
Her: You can't say that. You have no right to tell me what to do. You cannot.
Me: You're right. I can't.
Her: I don't have plans so I will be home. Sorry.
Me: I would LOVE to have you live there, if you wanted there to be an "us."
Her: Too bad. Need a place to live.
Me: I'll buy an air mattress.
Her: I already said buy a futon.

Now, I feel like this is more of the same kind of conversation we have had before. I thought it was a different approach, I was cheerful on the phone. I feel like I'm treading water. And I honestly don't remember any mention of a futon?!? Am I completely not listening? And here I am following advice and it seems to be backfiring. Or am I looking at it askew? Help! I need a fresh set of eyes!

What's next, no conversations at all? Is that a reasonable approach?

*This is a word that gets my goat as much as "b*tch" gets hers. I hate it because, the way she uses it, it's like there's no comeback. Any defense is "being an a$$."
It's like:"I'm not crazy!" "Yeah, that's exactly what a crazy person would say!"

I'm out of the house this evening. and all day tomorrow. and a little bit sunday.

[karen43]

Ok. A phone call (which she abruptly hung up) which turned into a chat may be paraphrased thusly:

Me: I understand, now, that you don't want this marriage to work. I guess I respect that. But if that's the case I need you to find a place sooner than later.
Her: I know that and I'm looking online every day. I don't need you reminding me every four days and being an a$$hole! [click!]

Later...

Me: You hung up.
Her: You were being an a$$. *
Me: Don't come home this weekend.
Her: You can't say that. You have no right to tell me what to do. You cannot.
And I honestly don't remember any mention of a futon?!? Am I completely not listening? And here I am following advice and it seems to be backfiring. Or am I looking at it askew? Help! I need a fresh set of eyes!

What's next, no conversations at all? Is that a reasonable approach?

I hate to say it but your W sounds a little immature with actions like hanging up on you when you were being reasonable (my H used to do that too!) . I don't think you should be letting her be verbally abusive like calling you a** or crazy or anything like that.

My H used to be like that and I have decided I will no longer tolerate any abuse. Once or twice, I have told him not to yell at me or he needs to leave and I also won't tolerate any more name-calling or abuse by him. Oddly since I've decided this my H seems to have quit the verbal abuse/name calling. Maybe b/c I've gotten stronger and he realizes that and/or H is seeing a therapist for his anger and other issues so maybe he is working on that also. It was really unhealthy dynamic, his abuse and me just putting up with it & getting depressed. The last time he yelled at me and didn't stop I left the room for example, b/c I just won't tolerate it anymore. I think that has to do with respect, and it sounds like she is not respecting you enough.

Re: going to no conversations or not, I try to cut down conversations with my H (which is tough b/c I'm a talker :)), & no R talk at all, but when we do talk I keep things light, positive, happy, mildly friendly. It has improved our friendship at least! Karen

[hopefulll]

I thought I would update you folks.

I've been GAL-ing and it is a blast. I meet a group of artists every Wednesday. From there I made some new friends and went on a day-long road trip with them. I took a life-drawing class with another old friend last Sunday (female friend).

Monday night my W (after spending one night elsewhere), finally got around to unpacking the bags I packed for her. (She's home, as I mentioned, and has only spent one night away this week. Also, she seems depressed, so my hopes are up that there's trouble in fantasy-land.) I think she only then realized how much I had packed. It resulted in a tantrum and screaming. She broke some stuff and claimed I broke them when I packed. I refused to engage her in the fight. (I had hopped out of the shower to see what the commotion was, and then went right back in.) I went out for an hour and came back home to find all MY stuff thrown into my new "bedroom." Instead of cleaning it up, I thought I'd do something unexpected and I stuck it all out on the balcony. I figured if she wanted to throw it over the railing or something, I'd at least be helpful.

...I got a kick out of it, anyway. :P

Since last Thursday, when I moved to the floor, we've said maybe one word to each other each day. It has been really hard! Two nights ago I found that my female friend (the one who took the drawing class with me) was heading to Chicago for a week. I'm now "housesitting" to get away. It's really helping. I guess I'm "dark" now. Darker, anyway. W hasn't asked where I'm staying. In fact, hasn't asked anything at all. I'm sorta sad that I'll have to go back to my floor after Sunday.

I stopped by home last night before the weekly artist thing to get some stuff. I ventured a friendly "How was your day?" Which got me my requisite one-word-per-day: "OK." Anyway, I'm not planning on going home unless I have to. Not until my friend comes back.

My plan is to give her space and alone-time, and then pray that she comes to some realizations. Maybe someone or something will open her heart a bit. In the meantime, GAL-ing is f@#$ing fun!! Quote me on that! A new pal and I are hosting a huge event in a couple weeks. Me! The host of a party at a bar!

[sideswiped2]

Wish my GALing was as exciting...mine involves looking after a 15month old, leaving little time for anything else and very few friends want to hook up when there is a little person around...