Need Patience w/My Un-Confused (?) Husband.....

[not an ex yet]

Hi BobbiJo,
I just read through this thread, and I have to say that your progress and ability to see the positives in your situation has given me some much needed hope in my own sitch. It is very inspiring to see things turn around so quickly.

I can understand some of your frustrations, you sound exactly like me in needing affection and words of affirmation. But as an outsider, things look really good and I'm sure all the stress your H is under has a lot to do with some of those things. I would bet that once some of these MAJOR things are finished, he will be putting more attention to you and your r/m. I am very happy for you!!

Keep up your PMA and patience, it is paying off!

[lizzy]

I think how you are planning to phrase it as "I like when you...." I need to start phrasing things in a positive manner. I too need to work on the trust, you will see why in my post. Good news on the leg cuddles. It is something.

Reading about the text the OW sent in the past makes me wonder how much of the contact between H and EAs is started by them. H always has his phone w/ him. Heaven forbid H miss contact from them. Did your H get rid of the secret phone?

[BobbiJo]

The secret phone was quite an experience, actually. I found it by rolling over on it in our bed one night (H slept w/his phone so he could text in the night, but I didn't know that). I took it out into the other room and read all like 400 messages. Then I hid it in a box of photos high on a shelf in our living room. Then I confronted him. I thought for sure we were getting a D and was hoping I could use the messages for leverage on custody/support, etc.
H threw a fit that I took HIS phone and basically made me the bad guy in the situation b/c I broke HIS trust and stole HIS phone. I kept it for 2 days. Then I realized (don't know where the 2x4 came from) that if he were going to leave me, he was going to do it regardless of what I did and my actions just gave him reasons--illegitimate reasons, but still--to make me part of the problem. So one morning before work I walked up to him and gave it to him. He thought I took it and had the messages downloaded so I could save them. I didn't--I have no idea how you do that stuff. I don't know if he still thinks I did or not. But I told him he could have the phone back b/c I didn't want to be "that person" in our relationship. The one who has to be manipulative and deceitful. I said, "Here is your phone, you can do with it what you want". The very next day he said he had put it away "somewhere in the house" and wasn't using it anymore.

When we were making a budget about 8 weeks ago, (trying to figure out the $$ we needed for H to live in the apartment) we got to the cell phone part. I asked him how much he needed per month for his extra phone. Not in a mean way, just matter-of-fact for the budget. He said not much, he only had to pay for it for 2 more months. He said "That is the soonest I can get out of the contract, sorry". So it sounded like he was stopping the phone. And I have never seen it since, and he sleeps in his underwear half the time now so I am sure I would notice it in our bed.

Besides, my new attitude is that if he wants to talk to ex-OW, he can talk to her at work. He can call her from his normal cell phone. He can meet up with her at lunch or after work when I think he is running errands, etc. The point is if he wants to talk to her, he will. If not, he won't. My worrying about it won't change the facts. And eventually his actions will be revealed if he does get with her, b/c they were revealed last time. So I am choosing to act "As If" his PA is over, and he is just going through the process of detaching from her in the emotional sense. Which will be easier once we are in Omaha.....

But anyway, based on the messages it was about 50/50 who started the texting back and forth each time. But it was 90/10 the OW who sent needy, begging-style messages.

Oh well, moving on.....we have our MC at 11 today.

I thought I screwed it up last night. I mentioned to H how I liked the things he does for me (kisses, hugs, etc.) and how I have so enjoyed them in the past. But when we went to bed, he did the "goodnight, I'm tired" thing again. I got annoying and said something like, "Too tired for a kiss? That takes 5 seconds to kiss me and say I love you" He said, "yes, I am too tired for that." I stupidly pointed out how he wasn't too tired to go to work, move hay, go bowling, find a new job, etc. but was just too tired to do anything for ME. I said, "I need 30 seconds a day from you to give me a hug, a kiss, look in my eyes and say you love me. That is too much?" I got teary and went into the living room
Out there, I realized I WAS DOING IT AGAIN! MESSING THINGS UP!

After a bit I went back to bed. I rolled up to H and said "I am sorry. I promised I would give you the space you need and I haven't. I won't do this anymore"

I barely got the I'm sorry part out and he had rolled over and kissed me smack on the lips! Dumb me, I kissed him back but then finished my apology. Should have shut up and enjoyed the kiss.

Anyway we spoke this morning on the phone after he went to work. I said I was sorry for my behavior last night. He acted like he barely remembered the conversation and said don't worry about it. But his next words were "what time is our MC today?" So I don't know if he is planning on discussing this at the MC. I just know he was right and I was wrong. I said in my "detach with love" letter when I thought he was leaving, that I was going to focus on me and let him make his own progress at his own pace. And now I am pushing again. SO I am going to do all I can to STOP pushing. And just enjoy the progress..............

[BobbiJo]

Only a little news from yesterday, but it is big for me!

1)At the end of our MC session, the C asked us, "Last time you were here, we were focusing on this as a separation, and how to tell the kids what was going on and how to handle the kids afterward. This time it feels more like before, where you are wanting to work on the M and focus on that during our sessions. Am I reading you right?"

And H and I BOTH said YES!
He still mentioned the possibility of it not working out, but he also included the phrase "If it didn't, that would suck". So at least he is thinking it would be better if we could work it out. Now we'll have to see if we can.

2)I mentioned to the MC about my desire for more affection, that I am doing my best to give H time and space in our marriage to see what he wants to do, and that I assumed that meant give him time and space on the affection issues, too. She actually said no, I think you need to have a discussion about how you are going to show your feelings to each other during this time. It is okay for you to want affection and to let H know. Then he needs to talk with you about what he is/isn't comfortable with at this time.

So we didn't have that talk, I decided not to bring it up and let H take the lead. So instead of talking last night, he initiated with me. And this time, we were able to "seal the deal"--last time he stopped early before he got to finish. So YAY! I know that sex does not mean things will be fine, I have learned that the hard way, but this is the first time since he said he wanted to "work on things" that we have been together all the way. So that is progress. And he came to my side of the bed and kissed me goodbye this morning for the first time in 8 weeks, too. He barely touched my lips w/his like he was afraid to, but he did it. And I think that is progress, too.............I didn't ask for it or expect it.
Off to Beverly Hills with my sister, back late Sunday. No computer access there that I know of, although her bar association is putting us up at the Beverly Hilton so maybe there is a computer in the room? Oh, and yesterday sis called from L.A. to say that the Grammy pre-parties are being held at our hotel Saturday night!! Guess I am working on my GAL plan

[Kalni]

Bbj,

You sound like you are enjoying yourself a lot (!!!!) lately. WOW, kisses AND Sex? Good for you my dear! And on top of that and most importantly "Yes, we are here to make our marriage work!!"

I am so very glad for you!! Keep it up and relax.
(((Hugs)))
Kalni

[lizzy]

BobbiJo,

I hope you enjoyed your big weekend. I could use some of the sunshine. We are off school tomorrow because of the weather. Yea, I get an extra day w/ Ds which is awesome because it was H's weekend.

Sounds like you made some great progress before your trip. Hopefully H missed you and will give you some positive attentions upon your return.

[Wooglint]

Bobbijo,

It sounds like you had a great weekend. Keep up the good work. Let him come to you. I'm sure he will.

[BobbiJo]

Thanks guys for the good words! LA was great. Courtesy of the Iowa Bar Association (via my sister):
1)I got to stay at the Beverly Hilton in B.H.
2)I got to eat at Spago on Rodeo drive (Wolfgang Puck's place)
3)Also got to eat at Geisha House in West Hollywood (Ashton Kutcher's place)
4)Got to go out to Skybar (usually home to the young rich stupid girls, but on Sat. was mostly attorneys)
5)Had two bottles of vodka (actually, I had ONE glass but the rest of my group had much more) totaling $973 at Skybar
6)Got invited into the ballroom where Clive Davis had his party at 2:30 am Sat/Sun, although most of the beautiful people were gone I got free food and coffee--such a nerd, I drank coffee! But i wanted to enjoy the weekend, not regret it.....

So the weekend was fun, real life, not so much.....
1)S5 has a fever over 105 since last night, went to Dr. he has ear infection and dehydration, home w/him today and tomorrow

2)Got in a fight w/H yesterday. Same old/same old. He lost a wheel on his trailer (wheel and hub actually and messed up the axle) while returning from a hay trip to Iowa at 2 in the morning Sat/Sun. He and I exchanged texts about the ordeal while I was at Skybar.
Yesterday (Sun) he called me while I was at LAX waiting for my plane. I asked, "Are you dealing with your wheel problem today?" as a way to make conversation/show my concern/support.
He responded by screaming at me, how could he fix it on a Sunday, besides he bought the trailer from the rental place (AND DIDN'T TELL ME) but couldn't find the warranty so he would have to pay $1K to fix the axle himself, missed his chance at moving 2 loads of hay on Sunday, etc. etc. etc. Just blew up at me. Told me I didn't know what I was talking about. I agreed, said I didn't know b/c he doesn't tell me things. Hung up bawling in middle of LAX gift shop, so embarrassing..........
Went to bathroom, pulled self together,sent a series of TMs to H (my phone only handles 140 characters of msg. at a time so it took a few messages)

Basically I said

If trying to speak to you about your life and understand what you are going through = getting my a$$ chewed, I have no desire to speak to you except re. the kids. I know your hay and trailer issues aren't about me (he said I was making the sitch about me), but I love YOU and want to be able to know what you are going through. When you don't tell me things then yell at me bc I don't know what I am talking about it hurts. I was trying to be supportive of your situation & in return I got chewed out. If being w/you requires me to read minds or just sit back and shut up I am not interested. I expect and deserve better from my husband. Why is it so hard for you to say "This is what is going on right now and it sucks and I'm frustrated?" To just talk to me about your problems w/out getting angry at me.

Anyway I was reacting not just to the one conversation but to the things about H that have created a lot of our problems. I know what I do to hurt our R, and I was reacting to the things about him that I think hurt our R. So I spent the flight contemplating my M and whether I could be patient enough to let things progress.
I know I got a kiss goodbye and sex last week. But honestly, I could go months w/out sex if I got an honest, loving look into my eyes and heard my H say he loves me. I would prefer he held my hand and said he missed me/loved me over sex any day. Just the way I am, I guess.
So the kids got home when I did--my dad brought them down from Iowa where they spent the weekend. That is when I found out S had the high fever. So H and I dealt w/him until bedtime. Then I asked S if he were going to address my messages. He said he was sorry he yelled at me. I said it was more than that.....H said he really did want to work on things. I said he needed to do more than just say the words.
I told H he couldn't be my H if things kept on this way. That I only wanted things that any reasonable wife would want. H is taking the day off today to handle the trailer/wheel issues. I pointed out that it was such a priority to deliver the hay that he could take a day off to work on it, but did he give me 30 seconds a day to hold my hand, tell me he loved me, make me feel important to him? Just 30 seconds? He said No, he didn't.
I said I had been telling him (periodically, not daily) for 3 months that those things were what I needed to want to stay in our M, and I just didn't think I could wait anymore. H said he didn't want to stop being my H. I said well you know what I want/need for us to continue trying.
When he left for work this morning he said bye, love you and kissed me. He checked in from the road to see how S's doctor went. And he called again later this afternoon to check in. So we will go from here. It is weird, the closer we get to officially deciding to stay together, the more I seem to be increasing my demands...........
In Nov. when I found out about the A, all I wanted was my H back with me. But now I know I can't just settle for that....Is this normal????????

[lizzy]

BobbiJo, first I'm glad you got to enjoy yourself. (Going somewhere w/out my Ds and H is something I have never done. Looking forward to doing it w/ friends this summer.) I would have gone for the coffee too. Spago! Yum.

Once again I understand where you are coming from. Months ago I would have been happy to have H tell me he loves me and wants to stay married. Now I am starting to make a list of what needs to happen before I would agree w/ that. I was thinking the same thing today about not being willing to just settle. We deserve to happy BobbiJo. I want nothing more to be happy w/ my H, but I am not going to stay w/ him if he isn't willing to change too.

[Wooglint]

Bobbijo,

Glad you had a good time in La La Land. I used to live there and have been to most of those places. Life's a bit surreal there.

I'm not an expert, but my advice would be that now that you've told him what you need, back off for a while. Let him come to you and do those things. Give him time.

Guys (at least me) don't seem to react to pressure in relationships well. Generally men (especially type A guys) like to feel in charge and being told what to do isn't always welcome. I'm not saying its right, just reality.

Give him positive encouragement when he does something you like (e.g., checking in from the road, a kiss, whatever) and avoid the negative stuff as much as possible. Go back to the "I like it when.... you call me from the road,... kiss me goodbye.... etc.

We men can be trained. It just takes the right tools and approach