All hope is lost/help

[Evie]

I have been posting in Piecing, but have decided to swop over to MLC as I think I belong more here.

Long story short: Bomb shell 8th May 2007, ILBNILY.
H sill at home. Has said he is moving out 3 times. We get on great as friends. Occasionally ML. H is not a talker and I'm at the stage where I don't want to talk anymore...

We did for an initial MC session, H found it to brutal and won't go again.

Have good days and bad, don't we all?

Read DB & sexless marriage. I'm trying to have PMA & GAL and lovingly distance.

I would appreciate anybody reading my stich in Piecing and welcome comments.

XD

[Rollercoasterider]

H is adament that his feelings will not change as he has felt this way for so long.

Most are adamant on their wedding day they will never leave; his feelings have changed and thus they can change again.

He's reading straight from the script...Many/most say this.

how do I continue to DB and work on myself at the same time, whilst knowing he will be moving out?

DB'ing IS working on yourself, they are not in conflict.

We did go for an initial C session together, but he now refuses to go as he didn't like it! I have considered going on my own, but I dont want to work at ending the relationship.

Then why would you go to a counselor that would promote you to work on ending you reltaionship?
Find a Pro-marriage counselor. Screen the counselors by telling them what it is you want and that you are seeking someone who will support that.

If I apply DB, won't he just think i'm burying my head in the sand again?

He may think whatever he can that is negative. So do what feels right for you...because nothing you do will make them happy or change their minds. He wants to be gone, and once he's gone he may want to be home. You give him space and he wants you available, if you are available he will feel smothered...

Focus on yourself. So he hasn't told you what he doesn't like...or said there are issues. What do you want to change about yourself?

He may leave. He may stay. Prepare for all scenarios. Those who leave can return.

The most important thing for you to do is focus on you. Keep up with the yoga, this promotes self-focus and peace.

HUGS,
RCR

[kissak]

In reference to your thread title....there's ALWAYS hope. Patience is the key.

[Evie]

What do you want to change about yourself?

Good question. I know I obviously do need to change, but how do you know what to change? I'd like to feel loved, desired etc etc

I've never been on my own to really know what I want or how to be independant. I was married the 1st time very young and then moved in & married current H without a break inbetween.

I've taken up yoga, which is fab for my inner calm & PMA.

I can be negative and I tend to fortune tell, I am trying to be more positive and learning to take one day at a time and be PATIENT. Sometimes it's so hard and I panic and have a back slide.

I am quite homely and H has always been more impulsive in all ways than me. I won't become impulsive with money but I am trying to accept more invitations to go out and to do things on my own or with the kids that I wouldn't have before.

The C we went to see said they needed to know how we wanted to proceed because if we had different views on counselling it would alter the way they counselled us. I wanted to try and work things out. H wanted to work at been able to end the M amicably and come out as friends. Until I went on this site, I really didn't think there was much faith to be put into a counsellor.

Thanks for reading.

XD

[kikifree]

If you say it is hopeless it will be hopeless.

But, I don't think you really believe that.

There ia always hope.

Hang in there

[Evie]

I am hopeful. All the time H is still at home i'm hopeful. We talk as normal and get on great, but we are not physically or emotionally connected. Maybe this is enough for him right now. At the back of my mind I still feel as if he may be staying until he has enough money to move out. I just cannot relax. The younger D is starting a job on one of the nights that I do yoga and I said to H that it would mean I would have to give it up (as noone in the house to look after S's)and H replied 'but i'll be here'...so maybe he is planning on been here longer.

Anyway he bathed and put the S's to bed last night as he agreed to do and I sat and read my book for a while and then went to my yoga class. I was pleasant when I came in but I didn't sit and chat as i normally would. I just felt that maybe i'm not emotionally distant enough with him which may lead him to believe that I think the situation is back to normal with nothing more or nothing less. I am waffling and probably not making any sense? I want him to notice that I am stronger and not so needy and dependant on him.

I was a bit down yesterday. I asked him very casually last week if he would like to come to cinema with me on Friday after work. he said he would be too tired, yet yesterday he told me he was going out for a curry with mates after work on friday, I couldn't help but feel the blow and take it personally.

It seems as if H is happy in the house atm and happy for things to calm, but he is not interested in going out with me?

Would welcome any views.

X D

[Evie]

It will be 1 month tomorrow that H said he was moving out, he hasn't as yet. We haven't had any further R talks i'm not sure if he is working on the M in his own way or if he is just staying and saving?

I need to really start to LISTEN (I don't think i've listened enough in the past). I think the key here is for better communication, we've never communicated on a deep level, It's a new skill i need to learn. Before I would always assume he was been critical of me and I always took things way to personally because of feeling insecure and a need to be reassured. I will remember to REALLY thank him for what he does. I did say it sounded like they were having fun in the bath as there was a lot of laughter as they had been taking some funny photo's with the camera that contorts the face, like those funny mirrors at the fun fair.

My new plan will be to sit down with the girls and ask for more help and less attitude. The 16 yr old will be ok it's the 19 yr old that gives me grief, she feels she works hard at her temp job then she works for H a couple of nights a week and has such a hectic social life that she feels 'put out' if asked for any help, I can see my H's point. Also she is saving for her gap year, but I feel she ought to contribute a little to the housekeeping. My H would agree, but the girls are such a bone of contention atm that I feel I can't talk to him about this. What are your views?

I've been thinking about intuition and instinct. My intuition in May was telling there was OW, now i'm not so sure. But one thing I realised last night is that he is spending more time at home now and doesnt seem so restless in it. He was on the computer last night in another room to me, i was watching a film. He only came into the room to watch the telly when I had gone upto bed. It only dawned on me this morning that maybe he is copying my behaviour and he may have come into the room sooner if I had stayed in the room with him after yoga the other night? Maybe?

There isn't any more on the affection or intimacy side. I was sending signals the other morning but he wasnt budging, he phoned me later and casually remarked that he was really stiff from the excercise he had done the previous night. It felt good to hear that.

I feel I want to tell him I love him and will say it when the time is right and not expert it to be said back. We used to say it every day and we both tell the kids every day we love them. What wories me is that if he says he hasn't loved me for a few years and I think he's never loved me as much as I have him (except maybe in the beginning, when there were 2 less kids and hardly any resp)that his feelings can return and be deeper than they were before?

I don't want to iniate any R talks atm b/c I don't want to here any bad stuff, it's unproductive, negative and brings out the worst in me, I would rather work on me and this change produce positive results. I'm gaining strength every day from reading the advice i and every else receives on these boards.

Thanks for listening. Anyone experienced anything similiar?

Look forward to hearing from you.

XD

[azhira]

It sounds like things have improved, at least some. It doesn't sound like time to push just yet.

Your instincts are usually on. I learned this the hard way. But...let me caution you...don't go running with it too much. Worrying about an OW will just make you crazy. Instead, focus on your marriage and yourself.

Luvvy duvvy feelings aren't important. What's important is the deeper kind of love. All that mushy romantic stuff can be rebuilt, with time, patience, and learning each other's love languages. You feel the super-romantic stuff when your needs are being met, and you feel respected. If there's still that underlying personality connection, then you can rebuild the romantic aspects.

As for your teenager--if she says she feels stressed, she is. Try to listen to and validate her feelings first. Then, maybe, try telling her how much her help would be appreciated.

[Grace_O]

disappointed,

My H dropped the bomb 8 months ago. He still lives in the house with us. I got the I don't want to work on the M, I'm done, I want to have other R's up to and including falling in love with someone. We did some talking for about a week then nothing. I aske him to go to MC he said no, but that if I wanted him to come with me he would. I asked if this was so he could "dump" me on the C and he admitted it was. Nice huh? Anyway, I've closed a small business (money drain) and I now work part-time, looking for a "real" job. I question is he's home until I get a "real" job or if he's saving etc. Bottom line is there is no way to know. I call it "life on the razor blade". There is no way to know what they're thinking or what their time line is.

So, having said all that. I wouldn't say ILY. I would work at GAL. You say you're not sure what to change. Who do you want to be next year, in two years, five years etc? What are YOUR intrests. The only changes you should make is the ones you make for you. Anything else won't stick anyway. You practive yoga, do you meditate? I find this helpful in making decisions for myself. Let's face it though we're in a wierd position b/c they're still in the house so you feel like you have to consider them. If things are friendly and you can bounce some important decisions off of him fine. Otherwise, I wouldn't. I keep the conversations to "light" topics or if it's really important about our D's.

I know you've never been independent. It doesn't matter. You can and will be. Is a another option? If there is I missed it on my form.

I hope you have good instincts. My were shot and I'm just starting to be able to trust them again.

Personally, I wouldn't care how "put out" your D19 is with regards to helping some around the house. She's old enough to realize the stress in on you. While i agree if you can talk to her and use reflective listening that's great. If not, does she live there and does she want to continue that arrangement? I get lax with mine sometimes, but when I say step up, they do.

Remember this takes alot of PATIENCE. Do you have enough fight in you? After all, "It ain't the size of the dog in the fight. It's the size of the fight in the dog."

Flirt, but don't race for the goal line (ML). Let him lead here. Try not to take anything personally, This is really hard, but detaching will save your sanity. Even if you get angry, if you can state what's on your mind without screaming, it usually works better.

[Evie]

Thanks for listening.

The advice i'm receiving on these boards is invaluable and I couldn't do it with out everyone's help.

I agree with timelines. Someone suggested that only I know my timeline and only H will know his timeline??? I don't have a timeline atm, i'm just taking every day as it comes. I think H's timeline is when our property abroad sells and we have more cash, we had talked about paying our mortgage off on our current property, but I think he will then wish to sell the home and then move on?

Perhaps I should look beyond Christmas, but even then I'm not looking to end this R, I need to learn my H's LL & pray I can do all I CAN to improve things. When I think of how things were in May things are much better now, not so tense and I don't feel so anxious, maybe b/c things are in the open now and H has his space & i'm working on me.

If we were to go on holiday again like we did in July i know I would be much more independant and not be treading on egg shells around him as I have been. I need to sit down and look for the small improvements and maybe re-focus my goals.

I just don't think my H is open to rebuilding the R, he doesn't understand the concept of deeper love as opposed to the first flush of romance, I have no idea what is in his head or if he is feeling any kind of connection??

Grace - whats your stitch? What r u doing to DB? is it working?

i hear what you are saying about where i want to be in 2,5 10 years? Time to think outside the box.. Maybe i have been so wrapped up in my ssoooooo busy life i do NEED to think about what i want and start to actually listen to the non verbal talk in my house. It's such a busy household that we hardly have time for one another.

I have been through 1 very bitter divorce and do not want to go through another. I have to work full time and I also have to help out with our business, if I don't, I stand to lose out financially in the long run. I have 2 teenage D's and 2 small s's, can't change those. H works 24/7 and things won't change there ( I think he really likes the pressure from it. I feel history is repeating itself and that I will be left will 2 small kiddies while H is free to have freedom). I guess what I would like is more time with H and time as a family.

I'm sorry, i'm waffling, good to vent though.

Grace - keep posting me, I would love to hear more about your stitch.

XD