Trying to get WAW back

[DaveJ]

Well, my first thread in new comers got locked. How does it happen anyways?

Anyhow, Wife and kids are back. Feeling a bit better. Disappointed that W wants me to move out on Sat and won't let me stay until Mon. Says she wants to get on with the process and deal with her demons. I do believe she will try to take her time.

Really will try whatever I can to stop talking about the R. Really doing my M in. Grrrr.... Got wife really pissed and thinking that I'm the still same person. Wish she can see the other positive improvements I have made. Hope she will. I think the S will help me with the shutup thing.

Very disappointed that W thinks that the children are young so they won't be affected by a D if we are good loving parents. Of course she is in pain and isn't thinking clearly or doesn't want to. Will have to give her some time to heal. She's trying to decide if her pain can heal and if she can still be with me. I hope with time it'll get better. Have to be positive. Just focus on me and the kids.

[Dom R]

From your prior thread:

If only we can apply logic to emotions then things would all work out wouldn't it? If only I can show my wife that going to Retrouvaille has a 1000 to 1 failure rate that she would magically agree to go. If only things are that easy....

"applying logic/rationality" to your situation, is not the same as attempting to convince your wife to act logically.

When I made comments in that area, it was about YOUR actions and choices.
The logical thing to do, from MY viewpoint, at least, would be to do a whole lot of reading, to learn what kinds of things are effective, and what are destructive, in situations similar to yours.
I made my comments because, based by your current stated plans, either you havent done that, or you are ignoring what the research is telling you.

Based on the idea that, given a similar set of circumstances+emotions+environment, most people will tend to react similarly, this is the logical thing to do.



PS: retrouvaille has a 80% success rate. not 1000/1


PPS: The majority of both lawyers, AND marriage counsellors, tend to say that you should not be moving out of your "marital home".
ESPECIALLY when you are facing the probability of divorce head-on.
you moving out, just because she says thats what you want to do,
is not logical. It's self-destructive. You are hurting both yourself, and your marriage, by doing this.

Why should you help her "get on with the process" of divorce???
That is illogical.
if she wants a divorce, let her do the work. She doesnt need your "help" to do it.
If you choose to help her do so, then you are saying, "yes you are right, we should be divorced, goodbye".

there is a difference between "not controlling her" (ie: directly getting in her way of divorcing you) and actively participating in something you (presumably) believe is wrong/a mistake/bad (you moving out, and "helping her get done with the divorce process quickly).

[DaveJ]

80% success rate is still quite high really. And the other number sounds better for the W. :P Going in there with a positive mentality would boost success rate. Of course she has to go first. I'm hoping she would be interested after some time. She is definitely open to it, just not ready at the moment.

And as I said, not moving out is going straight to divorce. At least I have a chance right now. We both have agreed that this is a temporary timeout for both of us to sort things out. I'll have to give her a little time and see if things improve or not. She wants to keep the family together if she is able to. She is trying to figure out if she can get past her hurting/resentment. A little time hopefully will heal some of that.

It's not a legal separation and she is not "getting on with the process" of divorce. As I said, each person's situation is different. We all have to do what's right for our own situation. One works for a situation may not apply for another.

Also, in the stats of those separation, are they all legal separations? If so usually those are headed towards divorce anyways. Are the people on good terms or bad terms? How many of them are actively DBing and trying to save the marriage? There are so many unknowns rather than just looking at a single number.

80% of married couples separate 2 months or more sometimes in their marriage. If 70% of them divorce, that sure isn't 50% divorce rate....

[Nugget]

Really will try whatever I can to stop talking about the R. Really doing my M in. Grrrr.... Got wife really pissed and thinking that I'm the still same person. Wish she can see the other positive improvements I have made. Hope she will. I think the S will help me with the shutup thing.

DaveJ here is an insight that I had this morning about my own actions, that applies to you comment above. Read post #1180206 that I made today. http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1166235&page=1&fpart=4

Very disappointed that W thinks that the children are young so they won't be affected by a D if we are good loving parents.

That is a big struggle for me also. It pisses me of to no end when my wife says “He will be fine. Other kids go through D and they are fine.” I don’t know if it is a way for her to justify what is happening, whether it is denial or what it is. But, I cannot imagine for one minute that she really believes that. All I do know is that is her opinion and there is nothing I can do about it and it took me several heated arguments with her about for me to realize there is nothing I can do about her feeling it or saying it and letting it bother me and blowing up over it accomplishes nothing.

[Dom R]

And as I said, not moving out is going straight to divorce.

This is exactly why I say you havent evaluated the situation.
You do NOT KNOW THIS as a 'fact'. You are not omnicient. you are not a mind-reader. you cannot "see the future". you can only guess.

The fact that you make this statement, shows that you havent done the research about people exactly in your situation, who have been threatened by their spouses, "i want a divorce", "move out"... but they did not get a divorce in the end.

Certainly, divorce is still possible. But it is in no way a certainty, if you do not move out right now.
Just the opposite.
moving out == separated == HIGHER CHANCE OF DIVORCE.

you cant stop your wife from moving out. but you can choose not to go down that road yourself.

It's supposedly 90% for legally separated. I dont know actual numbers for physical separation. but it is higher than non-separated.

Look at it this way:

If YOU move out... she has the more comfortable situation. She thenhas reasons to keep things how they are after separation.

If SHE moves out.. it's going to be inconvenient. she might miss being "at home". She has more incentive to come back.
(presuming she actually likes your home. hopefully she does)

Is that not logical?

[DaveJ]

If she moves out she's taking the kids with her. Also, I will appear as a jerk and there's no way no how she'll even consider recounciliation. It would be the end. Dom, just let it go ok? It's the decision I made and I'm at peace with it. I will make the best of the situation and do what I have in control of to save this M. I am not on bad terms with my W. It's the past history and not the present that's our problem. Her brother is about to get a divorce and their situation is beyond wacked.

In fact, I got an ILY, couple hugs, and a very nice kiss this morning. She's not looking to screw me, she's a very genuine person that is not evil and manipulative. She just needs some space and time to think. She doesn't have ulterior motives. She is just hurting. You can call me naive, stubborn, or whatever. It is the way I feel and I'm trying to turn this into something positive in the long term.

[Sara]

Dave,

If this is really just a 30 day separation, and when it's over you will be back in the house, then get it in writing. Before you do it, have her sign a piece of paper that says in 30 days you will move back in and she will not attempt to prevent you from doing that. Or whatever it is you've agreed to. And you should get a tit for tat. If you are giving her the 30 day separation that she wants, she should agree to give you the Retrouvaille weekend that you what. Working together is a two-way street. No one should get everything without giving something.

[DaveJ]

No I don't know how long it is. At first she said maybe 30 days, but I want her to take her time and think things through and see that I have changed. It will probably take a lot longer. By making her sign agreements or whatever will only push her away from this M. I will give her 30+ days and see how she feels. Maybe float the idea of Retrouvaille up again. She said she's definitely open to it but just isn't ready right now. There is one in Phoenix on 11/16 or something like that and I'm hoping she'll be up for that by then. I've been pushing this entire marriage and it's one thing that gets her really angry. For her to see I have changed I need to stop that behavior. Otherwise it will just go the other way.

I'm also hoping that after a little bit she'll be comfortable with more contact, going out on dates and etc. Here's hoping.

[JMC]

Maybe float the idea of Retrouvaille up again. She said she's definitely open to it but just isn't ready right now.

I would agree. However, be cautious for what you ask. The comments earlier about the success rate are interesting. I have read between 70-80%, but by no means 1000:1. Anyway, I was able to get my W to attend, and while she thought the program was very beneficial she came to the conclusion afterwards that she 'could not find that feeling of love for me' and moved out the next week (6.5 months ago). Perhaps it would not be a bad idea if Retrouvaille should be mandatory before anyone gets married!! Good luck.

[DaveJ]

Unfortunately what is she looking for that feeling of love? Is it the passion from the beginning? If so then she's dillusional. That's all hormones and it won't happen again. Is it just romantic feelings for you? If so then it takes time to rebuild. It's build on positive memories which needs to happen between you two slowly over time. It certainly took years for the marriage to deteriorate. It will take a long time to rebuild. I read some where that to love someone is a choice. You chose to love somebody.

Anyhow, I'm hoping in a little while she will want to work on this M instead of feeling hopeless. Of course if she's hopeless, she may not even want to go.... *sigh*