Trying to set those goals!

[Dom R]

I dont know anything about "homer's book".
That being said;

I don't want any hot and heavy relationship; just some validation from the opposite sex that I'm not a complete failure as a woman. Is that so wrong?

Probably

Look at it this way: You dont really want validation from "a man". What you really want, is validation from your husband. But you're not getting it. So you're starting to look elsewhere for fulfilling your "emotional needs".
you know where that eventually leads to.

Yeah, you might be able to keep a lid on it. Or, you might get to the point where it feels so comforting, that you dont particularly want to any more. Playing with fire.

Maybe look at it another way:
Why do you need "validation" that you're not a "complete failure as a woman"?

Personally, i think you're just playing mind games with youself, that you're lonely, and want affection. but you're couching it in "PeeCee" terms that you're not "looking for affection", but "looking for validation". How convenient. Ahem.

When you're looking for attention "as a woman", I figure that means you are man-hunting. you want male attention.
Where does that lead?


You are you. You are a good person. Be happy with yourself, for you. Look after yourself. Be happy with yourself.
Not because any external person says it. but because you know you are doing the right thing, in YOUR terms.

If you are lonely, try to seek female companionship. you'll still miss your husband.. but i think it helps the little voice screaming inside, "I'm SO LONELY! I want COMPANY!!!!"
I havent figured it all out myself. but I think the magic mindset might be, trying to be happy being single. (ie: not looking for a "date")



I'm being a bit hipocritical.. i know I want company, and I'm not specifically seeking male company. (well, I WOULD, if the guys at work I get along with, lived closer. sigh. and I' not a sports/beer/guns kinda guy, so typical "guy bonding" stuff doesnt cut it for me.)
Instead, I'm seeking group companionship, so I dont get myself into TOO much trouble. Its a mixed group, so i get to chat with males and females. (meetup.com, has various groups in assorted areas of interest)
I've been to 2 events so far.
There are some women there that I know I would reeeaally enjoy chatting to, and spending time with, on a one-on-one basis.
But I ALSO know, i'd get myself into trouble eventually if I did that.
So I dont.

The groups i've been to so far, turn out to be mostly female. I'd ENJOY actually spending some "buddy time" with some guy i met from there. But no-one yet has "clicked". It takes a long time for me to make friends, and I dont really have any regular ones right now. Hopefully, you already have some "girlfriends" you can go hang out with. Go do so.

As a contrast... last weekend , I just vegged at home by myself, the whole weekend. watched tv, played games, read books. Was good, overall.

[Trixi]

He just called to say he wants to come over tonight around 6 to drop off camping stuff.

I can EITHER be here and "act as if" OR I can go to a divorce support group. (I don't know if I really want to go to the DS group. I have a fairly busy week planned.) I haven't seen him since last Tuesday. ...does it matter?

He asked if I would be home, I said I wasn't sure but he knows where stuff goes. He's like "yup-I do." and then he goes "ok, well, I'll be by later and if I see you, I see you."
I tried to sound upbeat. But I didn't ask anything about whether or not he had fun, where he went etc.

This is so horrible. Part of me so wants to see him and the other part never wants to see him again.

[Dom R]

a "divorce support group" doesnt sound like much fun. Do something FUN instead, if you're going to be out.

Erm.. why is he "dropping off" the camping stuff? couldnt he just keep it?

Going without seeing each other for a week, is a long time.

How about this:

make fun (and REAL) plans for yourself, to go do something at 7.
Grab a friend, and arm-twist them into going somewhere with you :-)

When he arrives, make sure that you are either all dressed up reasonably nicely, or in process of getting ready.
Time it so that you potentially have a short time together to chat and catch up, and then YOU be the one to leave first.

PS: **NO SEX**

PPS: after you actually have plans, tell him that you "have plans with some friends", but will probably be there at 6pm.

Ask him to be on time, and if he's late, to just leave the stuff OUTSIDE, or to bring them by another time. If you dont have free run of "his place", and a key, then he shouldnt have free run of "your place".

This should be a positive thing for you either way:
either you have a little chatting time with him, looking fabulous... or, he's late, but you dont care because you're going to be out having FUN!

Enjoy

[Trixi]

Personally, i think you're just playing mind games with youself, that you're lonely, and want affection. but you're couching it in "PeeCee" terms that you're not "looking for affection", but "looking for validation". How convenient. Ahem.

You're probably right. But it's not physical affection I seek. (It hasn't been that long for me.) I really just want to know I'm still attractive.

[Dom R]

thats how it starts.
thats not how it usually ends.


Why do you CARE if you're still attractive? Who are you looking to attract, and why?

isnt the only person you should care about being attractive to, your husband?

If you're trying to "attract" other men.. that's a problem right there, i'd say.

yeah, I know what you're saying.. the whole female "am i attractive?" thing.. its a socially reinforced attitude.. but it's a very destructive, harmful attitude for a married woman to accept in herself, other than "am I attractive to MY HUSBAND?"

wouldnt you agree?

[Irish]

I don't post replies a lot as all of you seem so much better at it than me but I couldn't resist and I am trying to get more involved here as I think it will help me as well as hopefully support some of you.
First - I think you should be attractive for you. And if you feel good about who you are inside and out then you will attract the right ones - whomever they may be. and no doubt some of the wrongs ones ;-).
And about tonight - I agree with Dom - find some great plans fast and look hot when he arrives. A quick hi, how are you, let him get a whiff of your perfume and then you leave! And then go do something for you. take care of you.

[Trixi]

Why do you CARE if you're still attractive? Who are you looking to attract, and why?

No one in particular. I feel like a reject right now. I would like to feel like I could be a good man's *choice*.

isnt the only person you should care about being attractive to, your husband?

A lot of good that does me. He has already said that he is attracted to me, that our sex life is great, that he loves me, blah blah blah- BUT "something" is missing. I know *he* is attracted to me. And yet he is still gone. He still wants to "feel broken up." I think it will be just a matter of time before he sleeps with someone.

but it's a very destructive, harmful attitude for a married woman to accept in herself, other than "am I attractive to MY HUSBAND?"

I would totally agree with you IF he was *acting* like MY HUSBAND. It's not like I am a housewife who's husband is at work and I am flirting with the pool boy so I can get validation. If he doesn't come back, I would like to at least have hope that someone else might find me attractive.

Oh-regarding the camping stuff being brought back here--we have a shed for stuff like that and he is currently living in a 2 bedroom apartment with no garage.

PS: **NO SEX**

I'm not worried about that since he "Doesn't want to lead me on."

Interesting idea regarding free run...I am conflicted since he always calls in advance, he is paying the entire mortgage and we agreed that access wouldn't be unreasonably withheld.

[Dom R]

I would totally agree with you IF he was *acting* like MY HUSBAND.

i know it's tempting to think like that... but we both know that's not what marriage is about, dont we?
It isnt "to love honor and cherish... until they act like a schmuck".

you reminded me of something.. which doubly validates what I was saying:
you ARE physically attractive to your husband. you already KNOW you are: he has said so.

So it's not about that. Rather, I think that you're feeling rejected, and you want to be wanted by someone. it's not about "feeling attractive".
you want to feel loved and wanted. I dont blame you
but it wouldnt be right to go looking for that from another man, would it?

Interesting idea regarding free run...I am conflicted since he always calls in advance, he is paying the entire mortgage and we agreed that access wouldn't be unreasonably withheld.

Hey, he's the one who wanted to "feel really separated".
He's the one inventing the rules, so make him stick to them.
Stand up for yourself and all that.
Dont let him give you any guff about "well i'm paying for it".
Counter with "you wanted to know what it would be like for us to be separated: well this is what it is like."

What is that whole "unreasonably withhold access" junk anyway? What does he need "access" for?
He needs "his stuff" from time to time. That doesnt mean he needs unrestricted access to the house.

He wanted to have "his own separate place"? ok, that means separate. His place, your place. right?
Dont let him take advantage of you.

PS: when he gets horney enough, he'll probably want to try to have sex with you again, whether that "leads you on", or not.
he changes his mind a lot, remember? and an top of that, testosterone has a very powerful effect on a man's.. "mind".
So dont think that is completely out of the question for your future.
IF, you choose to make potential together time available to him, that is.

[Trixi]

i know it's tempting to think like that... but we both know that's not what marriage is about, dont we?
It isnt "to love honor and cherish... until they act like a schmuck".

you reminded me of something.. which doubly validates what I was saying:
you ARE physically attractive to your husband. you already KNOW you are: he has said so.

So it's not about that. Rather, I think that you're feeling rejected, and you want to be wanted by someone. it's not about "feeling attractive".
you want to feel loved and wanted. I dont blame you
but it wouldnt be right to go looking for that from another man, would it?

Well, *technically* I suppose not. *sigh* They don't have to love me... Just think I'm cute and funny.

He's been going out and flirting for a long time (even when we were together). What's good for the gander.....

yeah, yeah, yeah, I am in retaliation mode. It hurts so much for him to be going and doing the things *I* suggested withOUT me. It's doubly rejecting. One-it's without me and two-the ideas were good enough to do, but not IF it included me. Make sense?

[Dom R]

Completely.
He's hurting you.
He's being a schmuck. by the separation. by not doing things with you. In a lot of ways.

Dont let him drag you down to his level.


To take a look at the extreme case:
In those marriages where there was definately an affair, I've read online various peoples' accounts of how they had a revenge affair.
Not one of them ever said "it was worth it".
Not one of them said "it really helped my understanding/...."

Without exception, they said that it was a horrible thing that majorly screwed things up and made things worse for both of them.

What you're feeling is perfectly normal, human feelings.
But then again, there are plenty of other "normal, human feelings", that arent helpful, productive, or positive in the long run, too.