I do. Sweetie, that entire post described him projecting at you. He got caught and knows it...so he gets mad and accuses you. He's also blaming yo for his bad behaviour...because why be good since you won't trust him anyway...thus you are making him waht he is.
I don't want to buy that car and you don't have to either.
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I tell him that I don't know if I can trust him and he gets mad at me.
You doto know...you know that right now you cannot or perhaps you will not trust him.
Be firm about this...say you don't know if you can is showing him wishy-wash. If he wantst o be trusted, he MUST be trustworthy.
I think that calling him on his sh*t can sometimes be good....but not always. Caught red-handed passing you in town...tell him he was caught...without accusing him of lying. If it happens again, try not to trap him in a lie--or give hima chance tot ell the truth. You witheld information. Let him know you saw him...not in an accusing way...but hey, I just passed you, whatcha doin?
Although even better would be not to call him at all.
Do I trust Sweetheart...yes and no. More now than before. How yes and no...I believe that he will become trustworthy through being trusted. But that means my trust is not complete...thus I will not have the same let-down if it is broken.
So when he was home March-June 2006 and coming home from work late--due to a detour to visit OW at work...and things like that... I didn't say much. I didn't pretend it was or wasn't happening--and I asked my counselor whether I should bring these things up...she said no. I gave him enough rope to hang himself...but didn't use it to hang him myself.
I let him know that I knew he saw her...sometimtes he really did work late, sometimes not...and I sometimes knew which, sometimes not. I wasn't going to fret over it though...I knew it was a doomed relationship and my help would just help it last longer.
No asking about the OW. No insisting he talk to her...or not.
Insisting he not talk to her is acceptable when he comes home...but even then, he may still do it...that's how it works.
He is so VERY upset with himself right now...the projection makes that obvious. When you bring his indiscretions, it is merely adding to his guilt...making him feel even worse...no one like feeling bad, much less worse than bad...so he will lash out at you.
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I just don't get it- He doesn't see how hard this is for me? He thinks that everything can just go away , I don't get it- I am so hurt.
You are hurt because you think this is about you and are thus taking it personally. It is about him. He is stuck in his own pain...and yes, he probaboly does see how hard this is for you...but it's not about you. Do you not see how hard this is for him?
He wants the drama gone...and probably is unaware that he is the drama. But he is projecting it to you and the OW. So step out for awhile. There is no competing with the OW...she's obviously a loser...so step out and let her lose on her own. If you stay in it, you both may end up losers.
Your husband needs time and lots of space. He feels overwhelmed. HE feels he is being forced to make a choice...and right now he is unable to do that...yet he is still being pressured.
If a person is FORCED to choose...they aren't really choosing then, are they?
So step aside an watch the OW keep forcing. She won't calm down and be nice once she thinks you're out of the picture and she's won. She will get more demanding, more bitchy, more controlling.
And while you give him space...start living your life for YOU.
I want to add that no, he CAN'T see how much it hurts you. Lisa, all he can think about right now is his anger with himself, his fear that this is who he is, and his shame over it all.
Sugar, try to put yourself in his shoes: he shared something very personal and humiliating with you, and now you are angry and hurt. Of course you are! But he CANNOT deal with it right now. He probably feels like you are punishing him, and he's punishing himself enough, his anger shows that. Lisa, if you want to save your M, I think that you need to put your own feelings aside on this issue. I'm not saying to forget about yourself - taking care of you and your kids remains #1 - but do not talk to him about how bad you feel about this issue. I really think it will just push him away further.
Have you thanked him for being honest with you? That was actually a huge step for him, as it is for any addict. If you want him to keep telling you what's going on, you'll have to be supportive of him.
You've been through the wringer with this guy, Lisa, and I would totally understand if you've had it. At the same time, if you decidet to recommit to saving your M, then I do think it can be done - but it will be tough. Even so, I think you have a better chance now than ever before b/c he's admitted to this problem.
Love, Nicola
Life isn't about finding yourself; it's about creating yourself My thread: Trusting God's Plan
Thanks all, I totally agree with what you guys are saying. I am fighting a battle inside myself to make the right choice here. I want to help him see this through and help him to get help and heal from whatever issues he has, I understand this b/c I deal everyday with my own issues that I didn't even recognize until he left before. I want to be there for him but I can't help but to feel like he may take it as he is able to do whatever he wants and I am just going to endure it b/c of our kids. He is taking steps and I do tell him that I see it.
Nicola,
I have indeed told him that I appreciate his honesty with me on this. He had to have am enormous amount of trust in me to let me in on this info b/c I could embarrass him very much. The town I live in and the one he works in are pretty small and he has a reputation in both towns for his business mindedness- Alot of people know who he is and I could just put out the news and hurt him very badly. I could call his boss- the owner of the dealership and let him know what happened between my H (who is the general manager) and the salesgirl. My H would be fired and word spreads fast in the car biz. Yes this type of thing happens alot but his bosses wouldn't want legal issues out of this. I know it really took alot of courage for him. I appreciate your support in this Nic, you have always been a source of sound advice and a great friend.
RCR,
Thanks so much for the thoughtful post. You make alot of great points. I guess I did withhold info as far as not telling him upfront I saw him- I guess in a way teasting him- I didn't expect him to lie though. You are alos spot on when you say that I am taking this too personally, thanks for making me see that point. I see all of this as an attack on me. That I wasn't good enough or I need to change ceratin things about me when really it is about him right now. i am just basically a bystander in his life. He has to get through this in his own mind and in his own way - This is his "demon" to deal with I can't fix it. The ow has said she is going to back off but that he will come back to her- so I will let her believe she is an inmportant part of my H's life and I wil focus on what I can do not what she is doing. Like you said she is a loser so I will let her be one on her own. I really need to focus on My life and not get dragged into her drama.
Steve,
Always helping me see the real isssues and the reason behind his actions and my reactions. I do think he is projecting his true feeling about himself onto me. He has since called me back upset about what he has said and wants to show me that he can "be a man" and "be a grown-up". I validated him and gave him my support as a friend right now. He said he would take what he could get from me support-wise and he would build on it. Time will tell whether this will work out but I don't have anything to lose. I have found so much of myself during this process, I know I can make it through no matter what but as everyone here knows the ride sux.
I truly appreciate everyones input here, I can't say it enough
Love,Lisa
Me:37 H:38 6 kids first bomb 8/05 (ow involved) piecing 7/06 second bomb 3/07 ow involved wash rinse repeat.... huge move to start over 2/11 more affairs H left for good 8/12
First of all let me say you are very brave for dealing with this.
Perhaps the others are right in their "validate him" "thank him for his honesty" and "cut him some slack advice." I have no idea, this is way beyond my experience or expertise. My initial feeling is that that kind of advice implicates that you can help him--I don't think you can. It seems to me he expects you to just accept his apology and despite the fact he's a repeat offender, not have any trust issues. The only way he is going to "get better" is if he makes a huge effort to get help and it will take time. In that time, I think you need to get on with your life.
My gut feeling is that is very screwed up, more than the average DBer can know how to handle. He is a liar, that you know. He is a probably a sex addict and God knows what other kind of addict. He has cheated not once, not twice, but how many times? That you know of? He is humble and crying one day, abusive and brash the next. He's not right in the head and you cannot help him with that.
I'm so sorry that you have to deal with this. I will not give any advice other than to say both of you need to be in therapy--individually and perhaps even together. Like cancer or diabetes this will not cure itself--you both need to get help.
Lisa, Just catching up on you again. Seems like things have taken a very different turn to what any of us could've imagined. I hope you are keeping safe.
Me 43 XH 45 M 2.7.88 Divorce 7.10.09 Kids D20,S17 & D15
I've never chimed in here before, and I'm so sorry to see that you are going through this, it's not easy, but I do have something to say about sex addiction. I'm married to a sex addict. We've been in personal counseling and marriage counseling for seven years. My husband goes to SAA (Sex Addicts Annoymous), has a sponsor, works the 12 Steps and sees his therapist on a regular basis. I attend SA-ANON, just like ALANON, and see my therapist on a regular basis also. Not as frequently as I used to, but at least once or twice every few months. I have a sponsor I talk to daily, work the 12 Steps and live a really good life now. I am responsible for me. He is responsible for him. Recovery can happen, it's hard and full of strife, but to me the journey has been better than the craziness of my H acting out and my reacting to it. Vicious cycle. One you're smack dab in the middle of.
The crazy life you have described with your H is all too familiar to me and makes much more sense now. Sex Addiction, or SA if you will, is a complicated addiction to understand. It's different from alcohol or drugs in that we as humans are sexual beings. It's part of our make-up. Think of it more along the lines of a food addiction.
It also explains why you've been DBing your heart out with no results or what you think are results to only have them blow up in your face again. You're H is in an acting out cycle. Some of the suggestions that you can find in the DB series is counter prouductive to living in recovery with an SA. Honesty and knowing where and who your partner has been with becomes more of a life saving importance. Unprotected sex can kill. But that's neither here or there just yet, y'all are miles from recovery.
One of the first things you can do for yourself is breathe. In our 12 Step program we have the three Cs. You didn't CAUSE it, you can't CONTROL it and you can't CURE it. You have to cut yourself a break immediately. He's not going outside of the marriage because of anything you did. He's helpless to his addiction, right now. He won't always be helpless to it with the right kind of help, but right now he is. He's also in a really scary place. Admitting that we have an addiction is so scary.
Reading might be a good thing for you. Online there are a few really great places to start. SA-ANON: http://www.sa.org/ SexHelp.com is the site for Dr. Patrick Carnes, he's a leader in the Sex Addiction field: http://www.sexhelp.com/ a listing of his publications: http://www.sexhelp.com/publications.cfm , "Out of the Shadows" is an excellent book to start with, it has sections for both the sex addict and their partner/family.
Lisa, this time is scary, but you can get through this. If you can go through the ugly craziness of undiagnosed SA acting out, you can get through discovery and work toward recovery. It's hard as hell and takes a really long time, but you've got friends on here who understand.
I'm not really comfortable giving advice, but I will on this one, do yourself an IMMEDIATE favor - do not tell friends and families about your husband being a sex addict right away. Talk with a therapist who specializes in SA and ask him/her about how and when other people should be told. This is for YOUR peace of mind and your childrens, not about sheltering the addict. Because not all people will understand and you will find yourself and your family under heavy scrutiny. It happens to all of us. Talk to the people here. Email me and vent, ask questions, scream if you need to.
My name is Steph and my email is conjured_1@yahoo.com. You can contact me anytime, and I will keep an eye on your thread and be available for any questions.
