Yeah my H has said things about be glad I have a yard and how it sucks living in an apartment.... When this was HIS choice.
I don't know why they leave their stuff behind. I hope it's because whether he KNOWS it or not this isn't what he wants. And it could be they just want to get out and don't care what is left behind. Whatever the thinking is when they walk out they are now sitting somewhere else without their stuff and are now thinking. Who knows what they're thinking but they are thinking. Time and patience as I keep reminding myself.
W: 33 H: 37 SS: 14 S: 7 S: 3 married 08/09/97 Seperated 11/02 05/07 H moved back 8/26/07
Well, no one can know what is in another's mind (although I wish I could), but I agree with your point about blocking out the good times. My husband seems to have forgotten all of them! I am not at the point where I think he will "remember" them with my reminders, so I am not doing that right now. He is in denial about it, and nothing is going to change that right now. Maybe she is unhappy with herself and putting it all on you. That is what I think my husband is doing. I am the reason for his unhappiness in his mind. So now I have to find a new approach. If your wife didn't stay at her own apartment when she could have, I would guess she is playing martyr and looking for people to feel sorry for her. From what I have seen in other people's situations,it is a very common thing to do. I say let her stew in her own juices. She should get sick of hopping from couch to couch soon!
There is always hope if I'm responsible for my own behavior.
OK, so the past few days I have been really busy with my job, and just minding my own business. Haven't spoke to her since last week's incident (see previous post in this thread). So, there is a business associate of mine who gave me some advice, along the lines of an extreme 180. He said to just stop showing any emotion, don't let her know I want her back, and from now on just act like I don't care either way what she does, as if I'm just totally indifferent to her. He knows my W, and told me she is a serious taker, a master manipulator, very selfish, and that I have been too generous and reliable for her over the years and that she has taken advantage of me to the point where she no longer feels I am a challenge, and that she doesn't respect me because I let her either get away with taking advantage of me, or blow my top when I've had enough. His advice is that I should have been calmly standing up to her all along and letting her chase me a bit (even within our marriage) because she is this way. He also described her as an "emotional predator", meaning she looks for those she can take advantage of. She is very intelligent and calculating when she wants something, and he says the only way to earn respect back from her is to just basically ignore her, and to take the ball back into my court by taking steps to get a place of my own, then just tell her what I am doing once it's in motion. We need to be out of our place within a week or two and I went apartment shopping this afternoon for myself, and called on a few promising options, though I haven't told her yet. So the clincher is that she left me a message yesterday which said she was bringing over some boxes to get her things soon, most likely within the next few days by my estimates, though she wasn't specific. I still am thinking I can turn this around, and though I am really p*&sed at her for the way she has handled of of this and ducking out on our marriage so fast, I still want to make it work, though I am starting to feel like maybe she is too selfish and disrespectful all around for me, and will never change. The other part of me still loves her and wants to give her and our M a chance, but I am running out of hope, as I know I won't even be able to agree to working things out less she has a very sincere moment of openess and humbled accountability for her part in our problems, which I am doubting she is capable of. Any takes?
I think it is wrong to get others involved. Even if they mean well, they usually create problems. However, it seems like you are happy with what your colleague had to say about your wife. Is it because you are hurt? I understand that need to talk bad about her if you are hurting, but from DB standpoint, it is not productive. You could call your wife and say you have been looking at rentals and then remind her the lease is up soon and everything has to be out. See what she says. You might be able to get a read on her plans that way.
There is always hope if I'm responsible for my own behavior.
OK, so the past few days I have been really busy with my job, and just minding my own business. Haven't spoke to her since last week's incident (see previous post in this thread). So, there is a business associate of mine who gave me some advice, along the lines of an extreme 180. He said to just stop showing any emotion, don't let her know I want her back, and from now on just act like I don't care either way what she does, as if I'm just totally indifferent to her. He knows my W, and told me she is a serious taker, a master manipulator, very selfish, and that I have been too generous and reliable for her over the years and that she has taken advantage of me to the point where she no longer feels I am a challenge, and that she doesn't respect me because I let her either get away with taking advantage of me, or blow my top when I've had enough. His advice is that I should have been calmly standing up to her all along and letting her chase me a bit (even within our marriage) because she is this way. He also described her as an "emotional predator", meaning she looks for those she can take advantage of. She is very intelligent and calculating when she wants something, and he says the only way to earn respect back from her is to just basically ignore her, and to take the ball back into my court by taking steps to get a place of my own, then just tell her what I am doing once it's in motion.
Are we married? Yeah, that might work but at what cost? It certainly worked with me. Maybe it is all a big misunderstanding or a strange kind of stand off but I am the one doing the DBing now but I am ready to throw in the towel soon. My H also accused me of the same things you mention about your W.
Me:38 H:39 MLC M:10 R:23 years D6 S3 Bomb: Easter, 2007 "Every day may not be good, but there's something good in every day."
Yea, I know-just grasping at straws here, and the fact is that she has already begun to move the rest of her stuff out. Fact is, I just can't seem to let myself believe the advice of that guy nor accept those things about my W, so don't think I am perpetuating these feelings! I am just so lost as she seems so intent to end this, and I don't know what to say to her to reach her. It has become such a big drama in our circle of friends and with her family. Everyone is choosing sides, and yet it would be so nice if they could just support us and encourage us to work it out. I want to work it out, and even though I came home to the aftermath of her beginning the moving out process, and even though she has been very cold and calculating, I still want our M to work, and I still am in love with her and keep on forgiving her as friends and family tell me to move on and walk away.
She has been perpetuating some lies about me to those people on her side who we need support from, and now many are believing it as true, and are rallying around her and treating me differently. I have never struck her or threatened her with violence, and still she has been telling her family and our mutual friends that I have been abusing her. She is not talking to me about what she really feels (as she has done our whole R), so I don't know where she is at. She also still doesn't take responsibility for her half of our problems. Part of me just thinks she is scared to try and fail and it's easier to convince herself she doesn't need/want it, but her wall is so thick, and her denial so strong not even I can penetrate it...cards. flowers,letters-no matter, she won't let me back in. Plus this mess has grown into a full-blown drama, and I think she knows that it would be very hard to earn that support back if she were to come back. I do and have always believed in the best in her, no matter what her behavior, and I always will, but the problem is that she hasn't let her guard down with me in any way so that we can either work on our problems or part as friends. Her actions and words have been vicious and vindictive, and still I am here crying in the remnants of our life, hoping something will give. She is leaving behind anything to do with good memories of us, which makes me think she is just trying not to feel anything at all. I left the DR book on the couch when I left today, knowing she would be coming by when I left for the afternoon, and hoping she would see it and thumb through it and see the hope I have found for our problems, but by the looks of things, she was more intent on packing her things. What to do next-she is half out the door and has become even more bitter and vindictive lately....still I want to DB this M and get through it! Feeling lost again and wondering if I should just accept that she wants out. I am mad, hurt, confused and terrified that our sitch has got so our of hand that there is no way back! She also said she would rather leave all of her stuff and not have to get it, even though she has been back for a couple of loads. What's up with that? Help!
Yes, you should accept that she wants out. She wants out. It is a fact. Why should you deny it?
Your pursuing her and chasing her is not going to change that. Leaving DR around is really not going to help, hopefully she did not thumb through it.
Rather than being in denial about what she wants, or trying to psychoanalyze her to figure out why she doesn't want what you want, or applying pressure to try to shape her wants into yours, yes, simply accept that she wants out.
It doesn't matter why. You can't fix it. Accept it.
Instead, work on yourself so that at some point she might want back in.
Thanks OT. I think though I accept my responsibility for where we have ended up together, I also have an amazing amount of forgiveness for her present and recent actions in this mess, which for good or bad, allows me to see the light through the clouds. I know I can't force that to her, but I am also very worried about her as she does not have a very positive support system, and is alone and scared too. Her vindictiveness, as I see it, is a just a result of her not really wanting this, but believing the bad advice of her biased friends and family. Her denial is so strong it is very self-destructive. I feel so cruel by walking away and GAL, even though she is acting in the extreme negative right now. Everyone tells me to protect myself, and yet I am a fool for thinking it's not too late to save our M, even as the boxes of her half-packed items are littering our place.
Posted this earlier under a new topic, "The Aftermath"
My W moved out over the last two days. Took her clothes, furniture and kitchenware...left behind every single little thing that reminded her of me including rugs, towels, momentos, desk, wedding album, wedding dress and clothes I recently bought for her. Any and every reminder of our life together has been left with me, even her alarm clock! She says they are just material things, but the weird thing is that she used to be so consumed by our knick knacks and these "things" we were accumalting as we saved to buy our first house. I have been bawling my eyes out for over 4 weeks now, and nothing has hurt this bad until the past few days. I've lost almost 20 lbs in two weeks. She called this morning to say that she was sorry she has been so mean the past few weeks and that she truly hopes we can have a real friendship. From what she says she simply lost the motivation to keep working through our problems-which in her mind is that we are just two different people who can't work together, though I see it more as a communication during conflict issue that can be worked through, though we haven't had the tools to do it (until I found DR anyways...:)). Otherwise our R/M is filled with so many common interests, friends and passions (art, music, literature)and our support of each other has been the best in both of our lives. I think she is just blinded by the communication issue and always has been-so do many of our friends, and even strangers who have offered counsel) She didn't mention filing or anything, so I didn't either. It felt good to speak with her on a calmer basis and she did at least apologize for taking this route although she says she still believes it was the right choice (for her). When I asked her if she thought she might be able to find her way back to me at some point, she said "maybe, though so much trust would have to be rebuilt".She said she will always love me and I told her the same, so....
Is this progress that could lead to an opportunity to suggest counseling or Retrouvaille? Is she letting me down easy or perhaps admitting she wishes there was a way to work through this? She had to let me go at this point in our conversation as she was at work, though I think she may have just been growing uncomfortable with the topic. My body is a wreck. My friends are sick of me talking about our probs. Our one year anniversary is coming up in two months and dangit, I can't accept that we couldn't even make it a year (neither di her last M).
Been looking for apts this week. I really can't afford to stay here in the remnants of our M-emotionally nor financially. Most of our friends are plain shocked at the way she handled this and that she bailed so soon on our M. The thought of living alone again is not something I look forward to in the least. So anyone read the previous posts, and have any advice on whether to move to a nearby town or to stick closer to our mutual friends and where she is likely to be? How will she know I am doing a 180 if she isn't bumping into me or hearing things through the grapevine?
