My husband has essentially "checked out" - is this now pointless?
I am 39, H is 38, we have a D6, married 12 years, together 18. All this has come about in last 6 to 9 months (his realization of problems and request for divorce ... see my earlier threads).
Now, he refused to commit to a minimum # of marriage counseling sessions, so we've agreed that the only logical step is to divorce. He doesn't even see the wisdom in separating. So, I have done a few things in the interest of self-protection (opened an individual checking account, to which my paychecks will go, etc.), and have told him it is only fair that from this point forward we divide our common bills equally, until we have legally split. For this last year, I have paid bulk of bills, while he has attempted to start a business. Now that he has asked for a divorce, I don't see how I could reasonably be expected to support him while he's divorcing me.
We've also had preliminary discussions about custody. I have an appointment with a lawyer for next week, but we still would like to try to move our divorce through mediation, if we can.
I guess my question is, my husband seems to be operating out of a place of unrealistic perceptions and expectations (like thinking we're going to still be together at various family functions; requesting to come over a few times a week to help with our daughter's bedtime routine; and assuming he'll be dropping by to fix things around the house). Is there any point to employing DB/DM suggestions now, especially that he is so very "gone" from the relationship? I have been very kind, but told him that those things (suggested above) are a possibility right now, just in terms of my need to move on with my life, because of his decision.
I still love him and believe good, intensive counseling could help us, but he is 100 percent opposed. I know I should be focusing on my own life, which I am for the most part, and am doing a number of things to make me happy and put my energy into my daughter's needs too ... but in a situation like this, is there any point? There are so many other issues at stake, but he doesn't see that.
Thanks for any advice folks have. I hate this situation and I hate the ups and downs and heartbreak, but I don't know how else to handle things. Thank you!
I don't know your story, so I don't have any great advice for you, but I just had to comment on something you said.
You wrote: <<<I guess my question is, my husband seems to be operating out of a place of unrealistic perceptions and expectations (like thinking we're going to still be together at various family functions; requesting to come over a few times a week to help with our daughter's bedtime routine; and assuming he'll be dropping by to fix things around the house).>>>
My WAH was under the same impression as well. He wanted out of the marriage but he still wanted to come around and do stuff for me. My C said that was his way of still controlling some part of me.
I'm sure DB works when you're living together as a couple, but after my WAH and I split, it was hard trying to apply the techniques when he was no longer living with me. I do have to say that DB helped me prepare to live by myself, but as far as helping with my situation, it didn't. Of course, each situation is different. It may help you.
Take care. All my best, alamogirl
Me - 48 (at time of 1st bomb) H - 43 married - 16 Jul 94 no children 1st bomb - (said he was leaving) - 3 Jun 06 2nd bomb (said he was ready to file) - 10 Nov 06 H filed divorce - 17 Nov 06 Divorce finalized - 20 Jul 07
These are exactly the things that my STBXW said and the way she behaved when she told me she wanted a divorce over a year ago. The final decree is due any day now. She said that she wanted us to have dinner most nights of the week as a family (what???). That we should continue to do things together as a family (what???). She said that all of these thing were for for the benefit of D5. Now that the finances are all split she is saying that I owe her more money (she just got back from a trip to Europe with OM). Since the separation she has asked me to fix her toilet (I did), to take care of her pets while she was away (I did). She occasionally brings leftovers to me during child swap for which I say thanks and then throw away (I can't bring myself to eat food that was prepared by hands that have been on OM).
So, yes, I think that people who have talked themselves into divorce and don't or can't see the repercussions of D do have unrealistic expectations of "family life" after D.
Me - 47
W - 35
D - 5
Bomb - 03/10/2006
(You're a great husband and father. I love you and always will, but I'm not in love with you.)
Separated - 12/07/2006
EA - Began at least as early as 12/2005
PA - Began over New Year's Holiday
Yes, I agree it sounds so familiar. They have no conception of what D is all about. They feel *trapped* and *controlled* and they just want OUT.
I hate to say it but it sounds like he will push the D through. He somehow *needs* to. I don't fully understand that but my stbxW is the same way. Their thinking is that if we would just go away everything will be fine. They really do not think anything bad is happening - this is best for everyone. That is also why they try to be friendly towards us and treat the family and kids as though nothing is happening.
Do grill your lawyer and understand your position. Mediation is fine but the *legal* D is cold business now. Protect yourself and D6. If he pushes through then work with him best you can but don't give up anything that you are entitled to. Much of D is cruel but you must be strong. Do develop a comprehensive parenting plan in addition to the settlement division.
As for the *emotional* D, it does not hurt to use DB, especially showing him what life will be like without you. From your writeup it sounds like he is no longer living with you. If that is so, make it clear he is no longer welcome (although legally you may not be able to keep him from the home). Have little contact. It most likely will not wake him up, but it will benefit you - to work on your life and emotional state.
Thanks to everyone for the perspective (especially from the men out there), it helps to hear it from someone else. It's just so frustrating because things don't have to be this way. He's just on a mission to "make his own decisions" and has become convinced that we are just wrong for each other. It would be easier in some ways if there were another woman involved, or some reason I could get my brain around. But, if just seems that - while we do have issues to tackle - he's rewriting history in his own way, not seeing the things that he did or didn't do that could have helped us.
This just isn't the person I knew. And one of the "telling" things to me is that he hasn't told hardly anyone about our situation, hardly any friends or family. He says this is because he doesn't want outside input into his thought process, which to me waves a big red flag. I believe on some level he knows that much of what he's doing is not logical, and he doesn't want to hear about it. I wish - when they do find out - one of his older male relatives will shake him by the shoulders and say "grow up! be a man, and figure this out with your family." But sadly, it likely wouldn't do any good. I remain convinced that when he's out on his own, he'll begin to regret his decision. I just don't know if I'll be in a place to forgive and forget then ...
Anyway, I truly appreciate your taking the time to write back. I will continue to do what I need to do to preserve my sanity and livelihood.
Good luck to you all, and we have to believe that there is something better out there for all of us! Take care.
It may sound like I'm jumping to conclusions, but your situation sounded a lot like mine. I belive your spouse is involved with another person.
* That explains his coldness and unwillingness to work on marriage. (My ex did same). * Delusions that post D we would be "friends" and still have "dates" and she would come over and "help" with the kids. (At the time she dropped the bomb and was moving out, the last thing I wanted to see was my ex coming over and helping out). * Disbelief when you cut him off financially. Again, living in a delusional world that defies the laws of simple economics. (Self centered).
I could go on. You may want to read about midlife crisis, too. It may help you in devising a strategy to detatch, and protect your heart and finances while he goes through this transformation. You sound like you are doing all the right things to protect yourself. From what I've read about midlife transformation, those who handle it well using it as a growing experience. Others destroy everything they've built.
Lastly, the one of your e-mail is thoughtful and strong. Emotionally, my D was by far the emotionally difficult time in my life.
sorry you are here, and yet you are in the right place. IF you wish, you can Keep Road Home Paved and Smooth for your h, and not make him returning any harder than it already would be. I THINK that means not criticising his choices b/c then he defends them, instead of looking at them with a good eye. And that's also why he isn't telling others. Can't really stare at the choices...but he'll have to eventually, Also, if you use a parental voice, "How could you do this?" and pretty much ALL questions starting with the word "Why"...then you shut out their inner voice. So, in front of him, Lose the anger. I KNOW it's hard, OMG ALL of us here get that.
But getting angry at him to his face simply makes things worse. Get angry HERE and vent HERE... Most of us do not know what exactly to do or say to make things better. But most of us Do know what to say or do to make things worse...spewing venom at the WAS is one of the big ones...b/c it just validates their leaving choice...if he feels "safe" in discussing things with you, like a friend, that's a start. Listen like a lover, is what my DB coach said and boy was that hard....but it helped my h to start opening up more, share concerns, and he had a friend in me. I THINK that is why there was no OW as far as I know and why we are in piecing. A year ago, I'd have said, No way. But we may make it after all. Go figure. DBing does help either way your sitch goes. But I strongly believe your best chance of making it is with the DB approach, and or a religious epiphany for your H. Or both. Just figure out what you've done that did NOT work, do less of it or eliminate it. See if there is anything that helped, do more of it. Monitor results, give it time and well, I guess I'm reciting the book for you. Did you get the DB books yet? They're helpful big time.
hang in there, j-
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Thank you for responding. I hear what you're saying, but I honestly don't believe he is involved with anyone else, and that's only because I know pretty much where he is at all times in terms of work (since he's been doing remodeling work at various friends' and neighbors' houses, all of whom are people I trust implicitly). He doesn't seem to be in that mindset right now, but I realize I could be wrong.
You are right, too, about this being the most emotionally trying time I've ever faced. I just never thought we'd be here, in this position, and I never thought that I would feel that I just don't know who this person is anymore. I am trying to do the best I can, and trying to remain positive, but it is so difficult on so many days. My daughter keeps me going, absolutely; I know her needs have to come first, and that she's going to need me to be stronger than ever, once she understands what's happening.
Yesterday the new checks for my individual checking account arrived,and my H seemed so shocked that I had actually opened the account. (???) I don't know what he was thinking, that I'm going to continue to subsidize his existence while he's divorcing me? Get with the program, please. I just truly wish I didn't love him anymore. I have to get to the point where I know that what I am mourning is what he used to be, not who he is now. Maybe when he gets out on his own, he will understand what it is he's doing, and what he is throwing away. But I won't put my life on hold, waiting for him to get it. I deserve better and so does my daughter.
I don't wish him any ill things, I truly don't. I hope he finds whatever it is he's looking for, but I fear he won't because he's not truly dealing with the individual things that have gotten him to this point, he's just chalking it all up to our marriage and what he feels is lacking from it. I viewed this as such an opportunity to really strengthen our relationship, and a wonderful chance to get to know each other again and build on some new things, but he seems to have had his mind made up for awhile now. So now he's got to deal with the consequences of his choices.
I just can't til the day when we're past this, whatever that turns out to be: a meaningful reconciliation or me in a brand new life with potential for a healthy relationship. I love(d) being married and having a family, and not because I don't want to be alone, but because that's how I'm wired. I love taking care of people and having that family unit in tact. It breaks my heart to see it shattering. Sorry, I'm getting off on a rant.
Thank you again for your insight. I truly do appreciate it. Where are you at in your process? Is your D final? I wish you well.
Thank you for writing, too. I hear what you're saying but it's so hard to put into practice. I am trying so hard to put my pride and hurt aside and act in new ways that can soften things, but he's really putting up walls. He's rewriting history.
I don't have a DB coach, but am thinking about it, although I wonder what good it could possibly do when he has said he wants a D, and we're in process of doing the things we have to do to move that along (getting the equity of the house determined, paying off some joint accounts, etc.). He seems so focused on getting out, even though I don't think he really understands what he is in for. Just talking to him about simple things is so difficult, he's so accusatory and has so many preconceived ideas about what I'm thinking, what I'll say, what my motives are ... and I just keep wondering where the hell did this come from?
I have truthfully tried to objectively look at my role in how we got here, and I see mistakes I have made. But he is so unwilling to acknowledge his contributions. I have to look past that, I guess, according to the things I've read in DB/DR. I like what I read in DB/Dr, I really do, but I am having a hard time thinking this will have any impact when he appears to incredibly focused on getting out of the house and away from me.
I talked to one of the DB coaches for an initial consult (I found her separately through the Association of Marriage/Family Therapists and she happens to have an office about a half-hour from my home, then I found out she was affiliated with DB), and I do like her, I'm just so doubtful about what it will do. I know, what is there to lose? I really think the only thing that could possibly help is him getting out of here and us having time away from each other. And I'll keep doing the positive things for my life and my daughter, and be as kind as I can to him (while protecting myself financially and emotionally), and perhaps that will have an impact on him. Who knows.
You said you are in "piecing" stage, can I ask what that really means in terms of your relationship? Thanks! Just curious.
Again, thanks for responding. I think this board is providing great help and insight for me, at a time when I feel like I don't know which way is up. :o) Take care - Sam
Glad to hear that you are wired for family. I think a lot of us that struggle with our failed M's are like that. That is not to say that your M has failed. Talking about D, and actually filing, meeting with the lawyers (paying for the lawyers), going through the hard cold business like facts of the D, separating, moving out, etc. are a lot different.
You are right that your H is completely dreaming if he thinks the "family" will continue as it exists. D changes everything.
If I were you, I would use some tough love on your H. Being needy and loving and caring is obviously not working and will only keep him on the same path. Force him to move out, or you move out if he won't. Split up the finances, make him live with half the money (or less). Serve him with D or separation papers. Let him see you going out or dating while he babysits. It might scare him straight.
