Thank you NOPkins for your very clear and concise advice. I know it will help me later tonight when THE conversation begins.
This afternoon I am feeling more willing to try to work on forgiveness, but a lot will depend on how she handles her side of the situation. I will do my best to listen without getting too angry or demanding.
I just got a copy of "Not Just Friends". I will begin reading it momentarily, and it will also be placed in a visible location in our small living space.
I look forward to your incremental posts.
Grazie,
Marc
Me 46 WAW 45 M 21 yrs
WAW: "I need to be alone" 12/06 W moves out 3/07 Mediation finalized 08/08
Don't move toward forgiveness for a while yet. The results of her actions will not be fully known for some time. Quick forgiveness at this stage will likely serve more as an enabling behavior than a healing one.
She has betrayed your trust and your marriage. It is very unlikely that she has any idea of the full ramifications of her actions.
Don't be surprised if she makes up an excuse not to come home tonight, or if she states that she wants an immediate separation.
She will most likely attempt to pick a fight with you. Don't do it.
If she tells you that she wants a divorce, and for the two of you to just be friends, tell her that you have no intention of divorcing her, nor do you have any intention of being her friend after a divorce. If she wants a divorce, then she will have to do the work.
Don't tell her that anyone is coaching you. Don't reveal to her the source of any knowledge that you gain regarding the affair. You are now in a battle to recover your marriage. A general never reveals the source of his intelligence. I assume that you will continue to snoop until the affair is obviously over after she has made such a claim, or until such time as the relationship is no longer of importance to you.
Once you have hard evidence of the affair, should she remain unrepentant, then there is no longer any reason to snoop.
If your wife should turn out to be in the small percentage of spouses that stop their behavior immediately upon discovery, then you will need a different plan of action, a plan for recovery. We can discuss that at the appropriate time.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
Don't be disrespectful to your wife and/or the other man. Resist the temptation to call him names. Treat your wife with respect regardless of how you feel.
Expect your wife to be venomous toward you.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
There are lots of invisible friends here pulling for you, LG. Many prayers and good wishes are coming your way tonight and through the next few days and weeks.
Hi visible friends, I really appreciate your support, kind words, and especially good advice! I say "visible" because it is so clear that you bring all the best qualities one can hope for in a friendship.
I have never felt such a wide expanse and swinging of emotions before in my entire life.
My wife took am Amtak train to Boston and a bus to Newburport where I picked her up last night. We made small talk in the car because I wanted to wait until we were home and I could make eye contact with her. She made small talk most likely because she was hoping "my irrational fears" from the day before could blow over. She continued to talk cheerfully over her trip, not even making any references to our phone conversations while she was in the hotel room, most likely with the OM.
It was getting late, but I said there were a few things we needed to talk about. Her expression changed to one of dread. I said, "I want to tell you what I know at this point, and I hope you will be honest with me and fill in any gaps that may not be correct."
M:"I know about B.R. (I won't use the OM full name here)and I know you both were together on December 18th, when you went to the conference at Concordia College. I also know that he lives only 6 miles from the campus and I imagine that this was an emotional affair that has most likely turned into a physical affair in recent days."
My wife was stunned. Her first reaction was not to deny it, but to instead ask: "where did you get this information". I did not indicate how I got the information.
She then said what everyone here and I expected: "We're only friends." At that point I was getting really emotional. My whole body was trembling and I reached over and placed right in front of her, so she could read the cover to the book: "NOT JUST FRIENDS, Rebuilding Trust and Recovering Your Sanity After Infidelity".
I told her that I had been reading this book which describes how friendships quickly turn into emotional affairs, and then often progress to physical affairs.
She then asked again: "Where are you getting this information".
I said: "When you went down to the conference on December 18, you knew that we had already scheduled our first marriage counseling session for Dec 19. The very next night when we began to talk to Sherry (our counselor) you said "I need to be honest with you" and that "you needed to have some time alone".
W: "I did say that, because I do need time alone.
M: "Seeking out an affair is not creating time alone. I cannot believe you said you needed to be honest with me, and then continued to lie and decieve me over the past weeks."
I then begin to ask questions about OM, and she began to get angry. She said: "I don't like the way you are interrogating me"
I was not yelling or being domineering - I was just asking questions that she did not feel she was preparded to answer.
She said: "I do not feel I can answer any more questions until we are talking with sherry together on Tuesday."
I told her: "Last night I was thinking of just going straight to divorce court because I cannot accept this kind of betrayal. And If we do divorce, that will end everything. I will not continue to be in your life at all."
She looked really shocked at that statement and began crying.
I said I know it is late, and we are both very tired. We can talk more in the morning.
We hugged and I asked her if she felt o.k. about sleeping in our murphy bed together if I kept to my half of the bed. She asked if I would prefer her to sleep on the sofa, but I told her I would rather sleep next to her.
I think it was quite awhile until we could fall asleep, but I had turned the very loud HVAC system fan on to manual setting to give us some white noise to blanket our thoughts and restlessness through the night.
The Morning....
I suggested that she might want to start organinzing her personal belongings today, because if she does not open up honestly in our counseling session, or agree to end the affair, then I would like her to move out in two days.
She looked shocked to be finding herself in this situation, where she might lose everything that she was only days ago, fantasizing about maybe moving on from in the future.
She decided she would take the train down to Tufts University to work on class preparations for tomorrow. I suggested that she call her brother and see if she could stay there tonight, and then we will see each other for counseling on Tuesday night.
At the Commuter train station, I told her: "I love you, and I really hope you will decide to be honest when we talk with Sherry tomorrow night."
So that is where we are right now.
My intuition is telling me that if she verbally agrees to end the relationship with OM, that I would ask to participate in composing an e-mail with her to OM ending the relationship, or listening in on a phone call to her OM ending the affair.
Then of course is the huge problem of the broken bond of TRUST. I would need someway to confirm that she is not continuing contact with OM through e-mail, phone calls. etc. Even if she was willing to give me the password to her G-mail and work e-mail accounts, she could easily set up a new account with another provider, so I don't think it is worth asking for her passwords.
Do you think I should push for an immediate separation if she is not clearly ending the affair? I would like her to know that she is risking losing me from her life. But the truth is I would like to be able to apply DB principles in my life, and let the OM get jealous and controlling.
Any advice on these topics would be welcomed.
Thanks,
Marc
Me 46 WAW 45 M 21 yrs
WAW: "I need to be alone" 12/06 W moves out 3/07 Mediation finalized 08/08
But the truth is I would like to be able to apply DB principles in my life, and let the OM get jealous and controlling.
I'd say be careful with such thoughts. We saw recently a jealous and controlling former astronaut go absolutely bonkers. I'm not saying OM is necessarily the kind of person who go crazy on you, but I think pushing his buttons unnecessarily would be a mistake. I think sending a very clear "get the hell out of my life forever" is the best thing to do. I think even if you do listen into a phone call ending the affair, you should follow up by calling OM yourself and reinforcing the idea that the affair is over. Don't be mean or condescending (no matter how hard that might be), just be very strong and direct.
Quote:
Do you think I should push for an immediate separation if she is not clearly ending the affair?
That decision is up to you, but just know that most people involved in affairs do have a hard time ending it on their own. You may have to push and push hard. I wouldn't assume that just because she is having a hard time stopping means that she doesn't want to try to fix the marriage. A poster name Greeneyedlass I think really personfies this. We she discovered her H's infidelity, she pushed really hard on him to stop, and I think it was mostly due to her strength and conviction at that time that allowed them to move through the difficulty and get their R back on track. I guess what I'm trying to say is that even if your W wants to make things right, she is likely to flounder for awhile. You are probably going to have to be the strong one for awhile. It isn't fair, I know. But I think you have already displayed an uncommon strength.
JMHO
Chrome
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
