I AM the OW....He won't stop lying to his wife

[runningoutoftime]

And SHE does look like the fool because EVERYONE but her knows we are still together, she may even know, and just be in denial.

Unless he's actually divorced or has served her papers and begun divorce proceedings she does not "look foolish" because he really is (legally) with her and not with you. He may currently spend more time with you and have sex with you, but legally he's married to her so he's more "with her" (legally committed, had more years, more sex with her, etc...) than "with you." At this point he has no committment to you and because of this there is more of a chance that you are temporary.

If a man really wants to leave his marriage he will do it regardless of his wife's pleadings and concerns with the children. If your boyfriend is serious about ending his marriage and being with you he will go to an attorney and have her served with papers this week. Anything less is an excuse.

Also, you mention him having had other affairs prior to you. It may be that his wife is used to him having serial affairs and she sees you as just one more in the series.

You mentioned on one post something about everyone over 40 having had an affair. Logically that doesn't hold even though I do think there are a lot who have, or have even had "near affairs."

[wildwoman]

You have every right to post here but most of us are trying to put the OP out of our minds and FIX our Ms.

My H's OW claimed that she was 'helping' us stay together by providing the 'physical release' that my husband needed. According to him that was all she wanted out of their relationship too - a selfless and generous lover who made her feel things her H did not.

Why then all the theatrics when he tried to break it off with her? Why then the emotional breakdowns when he said he couldn't see her anymore? Why did she threaten him with exposing their A to me?

I called the OW who told me that she was so attracted to my H because he loved me so much and was so deovted to me and our M. I told her it was a pretty disgusting way to show it. She also told me that she 'admired' me so much for my talents and personal strength. Sure. It's easy for the OW to admire the W when the W is at home in the dark and waiting while the OW is in the dark with the H. She was what? providing a service? Please?!?!?

She told my H that being physical with her would provide him with the energy he needed to work on our M. What a load of you-know-what. She also told me that she 'begged him' to tell me about their A. She said that I should know that he'd never leave me. That might be true, but truth be told she thought that I would leave him and she would be there to pick up the pieces.

I suggest that you end the A with your MM and get into a healthy relationship - not involve yourself with a MM who is already in an unhealthy one and now, with you, involved in TWO unhealthy relationships. She probably knows the truth anyway - just as I did. Back out and let them fix it or tell him to be a man, confess to her and put the W out of her misery. It sounds like you MM wants his cake and eat it too. Which are you? Neither you nor his W are getting all of him. Neither you nor his wife is experiencing a truthful relationship. Neither one of you is dealing with a mature MM who can control his impulses and not just satisfy his own selfishness. If he is still lying to her what makes you think he isn't lying to you too?

My husband lied to his OW about our marriage - saying it had no physical connection and that he needed someone to talk to that would 'understand' him and his needs/problems/fears etc. She believed him too. Most WSs are master manipulators, storytellers, and justifiers. My H was/is.

I believed my husband as long as I could. I believed his deceptions and his excuses. Why? Because I wanted the fairy tale. I was/still am deeply in love with the man I married 21 years ago. Yes, I was naive. I admit that. I didn't want to believe that another woman could replace me in any way.

My H claims that he was doing what he thought was the 'best thing' for our relationship and said he thought sleeping with her would 'relieve me of the burden' of sleeping with him. Justification for his selfishness.

He admits that he wanted a woman who thought he could 'do no wrong;' a woman who 'treated him like he was a God' and that anything he did or said was gospel. I couldn't provide that. He is a 'rescuer' by nature. The definitive knight in shining armor. He rescued me wahen I was 17 years old. That's what I needed then, that's what he provided me - safety and security. Unconditional love. I admit he didn't get much from me during the earlier years of our marriage - he only got the satisfaction of being the knight.

So, as I matured and didn't need him to 'rescue' me as often, I became less desireable in his eyes - not physically, he just felt like I didn't really need him. He no longer knew what he could offer me - what his role was. He thought I only wanted a 'father figure' who would pay the bills and fix my problems. I failed to tell him when I moved beyond that point - when I became mature enough to do some things on my own - when I wanted/needed him to be a husband, not just a safety net.

I no longer believed he could 'do no wrong' and evidently he couldn't handle it. After 26 years together though, the blind eye of first love opened and could SEE. He also knows that I have faults, that I am insecure, that I have battled self-esteem issues and eating disorders and a chronic non-curable disease. I am sure he felt/feels helpless to 'rescue me' anymore. That's fine - I want a partner to support my efforts to rescue myself. I want to become a whole person who can be 1 of 2 COMPLETE people in a relationship. In the end that is what makes a happy, healthy relationship anyway.

Get some C yourself. Get on with your life and find a partner who can commit to you 100%.

[verycrazy]

Lily, when I read your post, I almost threw up. I can just imagine what my H's whore would say. I know she told him she "admired him" for sticking it out for our S, and that she had a date circled on a calendar which she made a copy of for him for their "special" date. Don't know the significance of that date, but I really hope the ow is long gone by then. And she is trying to make herself seem so honorable by not believing in premarital sex!! Ha Ha Ha!!!


You adulterers all seem to have some kind of "hook" to draw in our Hs. Why not let him be a real man and you leave him alone?

I didn't think after I read all these other posts that you would be back. I am sure you have crawled like the slime you are over to a forum that will validate what you believe to be a good thing, and they will tell you that all of us W's are just jealous of how young or pretty or sexy or different you are, and how we just need to face the fact that they want something new, and you provide that. Never mind the families they leave crying at home.

My H , too wants to be able to be a knight in shining armor, but I told him that was for when we were young men and women, now he was a king and should be the king of his family. I believe she feeds all this with her stupid bull, after all she is divorced, so she isn't exactly the perfect damsel in distress, but perhaps a 50 year old whore trying to land a man, any man, even a man with a family who is married. What difference does it make to her as long as she gets someone? Well, hon, I am fighting a battle I intend to win and my S and I will have him where he belongs--with us.

[BluePoet]

you'd be surprised some of the crazy things H's have said to get OWs into bed with them (like saying they haven't has sex with their wife in years, when actually they've been going at it like rabbits for years)

Oh yeah - I'm absolutely certain my STBX didn't tell OW we were having sex almost *every single night* in the last six months especially and twice nightly during the four day weekend after he dropped the bomb and I suggested we spend the weekend together. He's admitted that...

That said - in retrospect, if he does ever get his dream of getting with her, I feel sorry for them both... He manipulates by kindness and playing the martyr.

(And if obviously not *this* OW's swain.)

BluePoet

[BluePoet]

But I don't agree with the 180, the in dark, or whatever that is, it's not genuine. As a psychology major, you might agree that people are what they are, they are years of their environment and history. You can't change that, and if that's what affects their behavior, you can't change what you are. the attept to "act" different, is just that, an act.

I'm not a psychology major, but I don't agree with you about that at all. People are different in different relationships and sometimes it is the relationship that is ill, causing the people in it to become stuck. Definitely the case in my M - he was "killing me softly" to the point I almost became completely inept. During the last year, I found several ways of healing myself (including an emotional affair) and getting into doing work that I loved -- even though I still stayed home, didn't drive or shop alone, etc.

When he left, I was devastated. But ready - emotionally it hurt like hell, but I found I'd become strong. So I started driving, shopping, flying in planes (I'd been too fearful before), traveling alone and driving across country in a rental car by myself. All these new things, and I found I was getting a "high" from the achievements. I am learning to cook, which I never did for him. So now I am seeking "new worlds to conquer" as it were -- I've gone caving underground and plan to learn to ride a motorcycle this spring. All because I'm hooked on the high, and nothing to do with STBX -- except he was HOLDING ME BACK with his subservience. But he was doing that (counselor says) because he was trying to keep me home so that 1) I wouldn't leave and 2) So he had all the power in the relationship.

I have truly been set free. Is a healthy relationship with my STBX ever possible? Possibly in the distant future if *he* decides he doesn't need control. I have myself, already changed and there is nothing fake about it. I am living my dream life of adventure....

BluePoet

[verycrazy]

And another thing you homewrecker: We know all about things he didn't tell you, his fairy tale fantasy, that he could be going deaf, has ED, needs work done on several places that his insurance won't pay for, you get to pay for that, I guess. But of course, all those problems disappear when he is with you, ha ha ha!! NOT!! He'll just be getting older with you watching it happen. See, our H's don't bring perfection to the table like you think. all you think they have is an unhappy M, and maybe a few brats you will have as little to do with as possible, or you may try to buy their affection for awhile, but then when you get tired of the way kids just drain you dry, and the way my H's passing gas can stop a tank, or having to pay a fortune for the different doctor bills, or pills, you will find that your knight in shining armor has only a little shine left, but a heck of a lot of tarnish. That's when you will really begin to show your true colors, and so will he, so he will move on to start lying to the next one and you will be crying and saying how could he do this to me?

Well, you reaps what you sows, as a little old lady I once knew said. So, think now and drop him, that way you don't have to any longer worry if he is lying to his wife, because you won't be in the picture to know or care, anyway.

We have had years to learn his ways and how to either overlook his faults or deal with them, you don't know the half of them , because he hides them from you, in his tarnished suit of armor.

And I am glad you started this in a way, because if you ever skulk about to see what we are saying so you can have your laugh of the day, maybe something one of us says will finally hit home with you and any other ow out there. And I kind of believe you didn't just start this and run, I think you are still reading this.

[BluePoet]

Uh, verycrazy - you replied to me and not to OW...

you will find that your knight in shining armor has only a little shine left, but a heck of a lot of tarnish.

That's why my nickname for my STBX is "rusted knight". He's more than tarnished his image - with all our friends and family too... Plus he looks strained to me. Worse - he is trying to LOSE weight when he was actually in good shape anyway. Now he looks thin and unattractive to me. And he's so constantly worried about money; not much fun to be around either. Nothing in his life but work.

OW can have STBX. I'll take NG who knows how to enjoy life and I'm not breaking up someone else's R.

BluePoet

[runningoutoftime]

Oh yeah - I'm absolutely certain my STBX didn't tell OW we were having sex almost *every single night* in the last six months especially and twice nightly during the four day weekend after he dropped the bomb and I suggested we spend the weekend together.

Isn't that the IRONY!!!!! My husband lied about this too. I remember him even feeling a little guilty in the beginning and saying he "shouldn't be doing this" (cheating on the OW!), but he did (and it continued throughout the A!!!). I think he even probably thought he was "in love" with her, but the reality is... unless he's there every second with the OW chances are he's cheating on her too!!!! I actually know of A LOT of men who cheat on OW with the wife. I've even heard of some who marry the OW and then cheat on them with the XW!!!

If your guy is resistent to leaving his marriage and using the kids as an excuse (and that IS an excuse!!!) chances are he's having a lot more sex with his wife than you realize.

OW, if he hasn't filed for divorce yet, you are being used.

[25yearsmlc]

Dear BND and OW,

thanks for putting in the part about long term marriages not all containing cheaters. That was a rationalization of yours, OW, and it reeks of you being in denial about marriages. Why would that be? Let me make some generalizations far more objective than the ones you made about husbands and wives and marriages today. Ms. OW, you are in a very scary world. In your world no vows are kept except by accident. You know, cheating, or "IT" " happens". In your world, people have NO choices. They "FALL" in love the way they trip on a rock and no one can make a life with that much chance in a marriage. How do you even pick a career or take a job? Don't join the military b/c you might change your mind about what side to be on.....I am totally serious. What about the marriage vows? Meaning them at the moment is not good enough. People who live good lives do so out of consciously making good choices. Good choices are NEVER based just on what we want and guess what else? Good choices are never primarily based on what we want. They are always based on what is best for all concerned. That is where happiness lies for most people b/c most of us would not be happy knowing the path or ruin we created with selfish "me first" choices the way your boyfriend and you are. So, for you, the vows have to be meaningless since your dad did this to your mother, and it happened in your own (first) marriage too. Maybe to you it is more terrifying to believe that choice existed, b/c if it does, then you will feel more rejected than someone in your shoes must already feel like....I mean if your dad had a choice and did not HAVE to act on his attractions, then maybe he could and should have chosen to stay with your mom? I don't know their story but I know it doesn't apply to most of us.

You believe if you feel something it should be acted on, correct? What about anger? Sadness? What role does maturity have on this belief? Do you see how dangerous, selfish and juvenile it is?

This is sociopathic behavior that reflects a deep inner void. Note the marked lack of self awareness as if the actions or behaviors of yours have no affect on others. To you There is no such thing as a victim, except for people who want to be victims and or are weak and you call them "fools". You see nothing at all wrong in your behavior.

The irony, and this is a symptom, is that in your mind other people see the WIFE as the fool or the "Wrong" one, and not you or the husband.
As a lawyer, I see this characteristic in many defendants. They will start by denying they did the crime and then the rest is probably something very familiar to you, if you are honest with yourself...and I don't think you are....but there's always a first time, maybe you'll feel brave...see if this sounds at all like what you do when you do something that "might not make you popular..." (that is your euphemism for when others call you on it)...

To Do List for sociopaths when caught: (Note: can apply to MLCers and OW)

1) deny you did it.
2) you had to do it, it was too tempting,
3) victim/owner deserved/caused it and thefore not wrong in your sitch.
3) what you did was not very significant, costly or that harmful.
4) others do it but don't admit it or get caught.
5) you were raised this way.
6) you say you are sorry. Isn't that enough?

Sleeping with a serial cheater who's wife still cares for him, when you know there are innocent children in the lurch, is simply wrong. Doesn't matter if your dad did it too. I am sorry your father was not faithful. My dad was faithful to my mom and he was brilliant and educated, but he was also a drunk. We are all flawed. But we break the cycles instead of saying that "it happens" and doing it too. My father's drinking hurt our family a lot. I love my dad but I'm not joining him in his drunkeness and alcoholism. Nor am I defending his drinking or claiming it's done all the time, with a flippant "it happens." Who are you kidding? Adultery and alcoholism hurt the crap out of families....Who better than you knows the damage your father's adultery did to your family?

Ms. OW, it has been awhile since I've been exposed to someone who thinks like this but still has her freedom. Please consider the distinct possibility that everyone here is not wrong about you. Entertain the concept of wrongdoing and apply it to you. Maybe deep down you know you are hurting others and your self esteem, your soul if you will, is nagging you with moral doubts....you can do better. And you can do much less harm.
You can break the cycle and refuse to inflict on others any more pain. It isn't much to ask of yourself, not to hurt others. IF it seems like a lot to ask of yourself, then get help. And For the record OW, I work in a man's profession. I am not an ugly woman and although I have been tempted on occasion, to think about a good looking man who pays attention to me when my H was in a goofy period or absent...but I kept my vows and I would bet a lot that my H has kept his vows. 25 years of it. Oh wait, I MUST BE IN DENIAL like all the stupid wives and husbands here....did you even read what MEN say here? The good men here who are loyal and have not cheated and want their marriages to work...they exist. Your boyfriend is NOT the best apple in the barrel.

What does your mom say and how did it affect her? if she says it was no big deal, then look in her face and your own to talk of denial.

I think you need our prayers, but I am sorely tempted to just tell you that your behavior is evil. Wow, I am wordless now.

j-

[verycrazy]

Well, sorry BluePoet, I was just in a hurry and clicked on your reply. Will you forgive me?

I like the "rusted knight" nickname. It suits doesn't it?
L