h and I had a very bad weekend after not speaking for 3 weeks. I found out he was seeing ow after h saying h never was. Now we talked and H said it was nonoe of my business ..his personal life. Which , I find strange because during the no contact he attempted several times to speak to me. What have I done wrong? He sounded angry yesterday when I confronted him about it and still denied it. He is coming here at 300 to talk. I'm not even sure what to say. I thought things were going better with no contact but now H is being cold and incaring. We are not even divorced yet. He has always come around and thgroughout this year of seperation. My family and friends just tell me to accept it is over but I find it hard to believe H would have changed that much after 15 yrs and not care whathappens? Some say this ow is something new and refreshing. What can I do to win H back. I love him and forgive him even though he has played on my emotions. Before no contact H tried kissing me and hugging me but I didnt let him..was I wrong. i dont know what to do ????We have been seperated for a year and we always had a relationship until i stopped it..now did i mess up???and why does he have to lie? please help i do not know what to say today..should i just keep it about my d6 be happy..smile?
First of all, stick with this thread and keep posting to it. It helps us keep up with you. Don't worry if you don't get a lot of response early on. Just keep posting. People WILL help.
Disclaimer: I have not read your entire sitch so...
Quote: Now we talked and H said it was no one of my business ..his personal life.
After a year of separation I assume he feels pretty much like a single guy with a right to privacy. I can understand why he feels that way, and to a certain extent, he's right. I know it sucks, but to him, the D may be just a formality, especially when it concerns HIM dating, etc. You on the other hand, well of course, that's different...as in...
Quote: Which , I find strange because during the no contact he attempted several times to speak to me.
It's the old double standard. It's ok for him to do whatever but for you, well, not. It's his problem, not yours.
Quote: What have I done wrong? He sounded angry yesterday when I confronted him about it and still denied it.
You just answered your own question. He's angry over being caught, or maybe his own guilt, or you snooping, or whatever. In any case, stop worrying so much about how he feels and worry more about what you do and how YOU feel.
Quote: He is coming here at 300 to talk. I'm not even sure what to say.
To talk about what? If you don't know what to say, or don't want to talk, then don't. Just listen, validate him and then end the conversation. You don't really have to SAY anything. Gather information, don't get emotional and see what happens.
Quote: I thought things were going better with no contact but now H is being cold and uncaring.
There are no guarantees when you "go dark". That's why it's somewhat risky, but the main reason you do it is so you can concentrate on the personal business you need to take care of, i.e. GAL and such.
He SEEMS to be cold and uncaring. If he is still getting angry at you, calling you, meeting with you, etc, he still cares and is closer to hot than cold. It's just not the kind of heat you want.
Quote: My family and friends just tell me to accept it is over but I find it hard to believe H would have changed that much after 15 yrs and not care whathappens?
It is VERY important to understand that these are two very different things...and the same too (sorry, cryptic). Your friends and family (who you probably need to involve less, not more in your sitch) are probably telling you something like "He's the biggest a-hole to ever walk the Earth and you need to dump his loser a$$. You're better than him." if they could just say it the way they see it in their mind/hearts.
That is different than you accepting that he HAS changed and is not the same man that wanted the same things you wanted all those years. He is going through a time where he is intensely aware of what he wants and it's not about you. What he wants has nothing to do with you, hurting you, helping you, staying married to you, etc. It's all about him and what makes him happy.
It IS that he doesn't care what happens, one way or another with the current marriage you two have. He cares deeply what happens to HIM and in that respect, if he were to decide that his marriage to you and life with the family was more appealing, or somehow held more for him in the future, then he would probably begin to think more about it, i.e. care more about it. Right now, you have your perception of him as an uncaring, cold a-hole, just like he maybe thinks of you as a clingy, desperate woman without a life. Neither perceptions are likely reality much beyond how each of your actions make the other feel.
That brings to mind a quote that applies...substitute any emotional word you want for anger... "Your anger is not about what someone else is doing but how you FEEL about it." In other words, nobody else can MAKE you angry if you choose not to feel that way. Same goes for many other emotional reactions.
Quote: Some say this ow is something new and refreshing.
To him it is, but he is likely running from his own problems and thinking that this "new and refreshing" thing will cure all his issues and give him the happiness he wants so much. He still hasn't discovered that until he looks inside, he is not really going to find true, lasting happiness.
Quote: What can I do to win H back.
DB, DR, PM, 5 Love Languages, 4 Agreements, Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus...etc.
Quote: I love him and forgive him even though he has played on my emotions.
Is that true. Have you REALLY forgiven him? If so, why all the anxiety? Isn't it closer to the truth to say that you WOULD forgive him if he'd only come back and stop all this?
Quote: Before no contact H tried kissing me and hugging me but I didn't let him..was I wrong.
That depends. The obvious answer is no, you were not wrong because that was obviously a boundary for you. The less clear thing is if in the abstract you are asking if you may have worsened your sitch. That is not something you can know so forget about it. Instead, focus on the boundary that you had preventing that and decide if it still works for you. If he tried again, what would you do? Why?
Quote: We have been separated for a year and we always had a relationship until i stopped it..now did i mess up?
If you stopped the relationship because you didn't accept it the way it was and would not pursue it until things changed, then no, you didn't make a mistake. If you stopped it because you thought that somehow ending things would bring him back because he missed you so much, then yes, you may have made a mistake. That's why ultimatums are dangerous. We are often not willing to accept them choosing option B.
Again, don't dwell on it. Move forward. Commit to being positive in this convo. Don't react if he tells you things about the A or OW. Just validate and move on. If you don't want to fight, then don't.
Keep it about D6. Keep it about something light and upbeat and if he insists on R talking, listen a lot and talk very little.
Some really fantastic things from GH here. Listen to EVERYTHING he says.
First thing, you need to detach. Seems that you and I are in similar situations....and what GH described is partial or whole MLC, which I am just getting familiar with, and might help you to read articles from that forum too, just to help you not feel crazy.
Start focusing on yourself, your issues and what you want in life. This is SUCH A HARD stage, this limbo, But, we have to make the best of it. Life gives us so many opportunities, we cannot squander them. If you can't learn the real lessons from this horrible mess, who is to guarantee this won't happen again in this M or another one.
You're lucky that H is feeling emotions, anger or whatever. He still feels something. Good. Good that he wants to talk. Like GH said, this is your chance to listen, be gentle and loving, and whatever 180 you want. Stop the anxiety..it pressures him, and unattractive. Yes, we think that they're our partners and we should share ourselves, but they are not thinking as a partner right now. So you act accordingly.
Think of how you would react in R talks before. Lots of questions? Anxiety? Tears? Why can't you XXX? Well, do the opposite of that. I did several times and it worked with H. He actually said he felt safer around me. That's BIG.
Time to start with 180's, look deep within yourself, not just the superficial changes, but deep. This will take time...it's not instant ,and a good thing, b/c you realize that it takes you just as long to truly change and work on your issues. After 8 months, I'm just now looking a the grand picture of my life to change....so how could I have wanted to jump into making a great M months ago?
Come here, read posts and threads, keep thinking, keep digging, and keep the goal of making each interaction with H pleasant, regardless of how he reacts. That will make a statement...that you can take the anger, let him be himself and express himself and not react.
Remember, he IS thinking of you, he IS watching, he IS testing. So, pass the test.
ok we talked ..It was a litle weird at first because we haven't actually spoken face to face in 4 weeks. We talked about everything except our relationship. When H first got here he brought a phone for D6 to call him or me a(one of those kids phone) which is fine. I said that is good now he doesn't have to call me to reach d6..he repiled if you don't want me to call you ..I said no that is ot what I meant. He said he was a little nervous coming because he though I was angry. But I wasn't and that was a 180 for me. We started talking about our lives (seperate lives) . I told H if if really wanted us to be friends he had to be honest with me as I am with him. Before we started talking H asked me to come here..and grabbed me and hugged me so tightly. Yes, I did hug him back. It felt like the right thing to do. I told him the reason why I haven't spoken to him was so I could move past this and go on with my life. We then talked about what was going on in our lives. H did say he was seeing someone and was just having fun. He said he goes out wih her every so often and they just have a good time. She's a 23 yr old college student he is 32. I just listened and listened. No. I did not show at least one bit of anger or concern. Well , as we continued to talk I asked H if he was happy his reply was"at times". H then asked me if I was and I said yes. We are just enjoying our lives I guess. H repiled I am single and just trying to have fun. i said maybe this divorce could be good for us then..He said sure maybe(not too positive about it) H would look down alot during our conversations. We continued to talk and he reached over and grabbed my hand and held it for awhile. It was so strange because we hadn't been that way in awhile. H then asked if he could make me and d6 something to eat.I said sure .
I tried making it light and comfortable because I know h expected me to be upset. Well , then he pulled me to sit with him(all unexpected). I did and told him how comfortable that felt. We continued to talk and he once again pulled me toward him. I just sat with him not knowing if it was right or wrong. H was getting ready to leave and thanked me for having this talk. Overall it was a good conversation. Was I a little upset about seeing that he was seeing someone..yes. But she is 23v and probably just a way to have fun. I do want my H to see me differently and want me back. I just don't know what to do to reach that point. I didn't speak of us ..I just spoke as if he was a friend and that's it.
Well, what do you think. Thanks so much for all your advice
Sounds to me like you did a FANTASTIC job of detaching and validating him. Damn, that sounded near textbook, and so did his positive reaction to it.
GREAT FOR YOU! It is SO hard to actually DO these things we all talk about and I think you finally did it. I am really happy for you and hope you see your own power in all this.
Thank you GH. I feel really good about your post. My question is .. What do I do know??? I do want to , I guess you can say, win my H back, I just don't know what my next step should be. I had both DB and DR books and gave them to a friend in need. Is there hope? I know there is always hope but sometimes I wish I could see past all this..but I am not God. I'm just keeping a positive attitude from now on no matter what. I do love your advice and input. It helps me alot. Thank you very much. And I will not share anymore of this info with my family and friends..I have BB now
