How long to wait?

[Lillieperl]

A while back she had said something about being "officially" separated while she was gone on this upcoming trip. I am not sure what "officially" means

To me, to be "officially" separated, especially on a trip, would mean to be able to flirt with/date/etc. others. Could she mean this?

I don't see where the question of assets would be relevant if one person is on a trip.

[konfused]

Yeah, I dont like the Officially seperated comment either. In what context did she say that?
Was it, "when I am away we are officially seperated..."

I believe if my wife said that to me, she better have a good reason.

Its hard to keep the sex thing out of my head, since that is largely what sparked both our problems it sounds like. In my case, my wife could not care whether I was home or not after her last trip and proved it after ML. She did however ML 2x within a few days of returning, and at the time it seemed normal, but since I found out she was missing her obsession, anything has been forced.

My wife has been pretending ever since with all aspects of our relationship. Pretending to care, pretending she wants to hold my hand, pretending to want to eat dinner with the family, pretending to care that I am home, pretending to care about my daughters accomplishments...but as soon as she talks to a net friend of hers, its all gone and the obsession is back. The only consistancy in the last few weeks is no interest in Sex or genuine physical contact with me.
She has called me several times on her trip acting like nothing has ever been wrong, but the minute she gets home the tension will come back I am sure.

So the point is, I miss my wife too when she is home, same as you. She is not the same person I married 10 years ago, as a matter of fact, she is not the same person she was in September when this obsession started with the celebrity.

Is there something like this distracting your wife?

thanks

[Truman]

A friend told me "officially" separated means that you physically are living apart AND have an agreement on division of assets.

She could mean dating, but I somehow doubt that and I would not agree to it...not that she needs my permission. She pretty much does whatever. If I disagree, then I am "controlling".

Frankly, as if anyone has not noticed, I am frustated, hurt and annoyed by this whole issue. It seems so one sided. Yes, she has gone to MC, Doctors, etc - but seems to only follow through with their directions if she wants to. She stops the change in medicine or the MC and goes back to whatever suits her.

She has never stopped and said that she knows this is hurting me, said she is sorry, or given me much of any sympathy/empathy or indication that she is dedicated to working this out.

I continue to run around seeking ways to fix things, give in to her wishes, do what's right for the family or the marriage. I really do not think that she recognizes all the things I do. When she gets something, she just pushes for more all the while leaving my wishes behind.

[Truman]

She made the "offically separated" comment because I asked about our sex life and it was not a "good time". There is never a "good time" to discuss it or actually have it. So because I pushed to discuss it, she replied with the official separation comments. Granted, it was late at night after I realized that again she brought up sex, but nothing would occur.

You touched on the "pretending" your wife does. I wonder if that is what is going on with my situation. She says things (that seem a positive step to R or sex), but does the opposite. It's like she is faking the comments and the behavior is the real story. As for something distracting her, it seems just about anything will distract her from discussing or acting on our sex life. I will say that she is a generally distracted person. She often gets distracted by the environment or people around her.

The MC told her that it was perfectly reasonable for me to want to discuss it and there was also a physiological reason behind it. That men that go without sex are by nature more agressive. If she with holds sex, I am more prone to show the agressiveness by wanting to discuss it. Some men show agreesiveness through actions, apparently I show mine with words (asking to discuss).

[konfused]

yep;
Same here. I have been reading, changing things, trying to change myself, spending more time with my D to make up for her lack of interest. All the while she says I did not mention any changes she had made (not being on the phone ALL night), however, the last confrontation, she told me I needed help. I caved and apologized for my insecurites to which she I was acting weak and like a typical guy. I did not walk away from the confrontation as I should have and it lead to nothing. The next day I came across this web site, and I have backed off and felt better. I know if I had never said a word, that we would be coasting now and happier, but better to try to fix it I think. I just did not approach it very well, and used a lot of I and you act likes. I also tried to tell her how she felt by pointing out her actions. So in a nut shell, the S part would probably be okay if I had never said anything and who knows if I would be happy in a few hours.

I feel your frustration Truman. I dont know every detail, but dont give up. I would think that pulling back a little, giving her some space, and focusing on your interests rather than her and her actions might make you feel better and give you guys some time to let things work themselves out a little. I dont think scheduled S sounds like a good idea, but who knows, but living for yourself for a while and excluding her may be helpful.
Whatever you do, dont throw it out yet.

What does "officially" seperated mean to HER?
You cant really know can you?

[konfused]

She made the "offically separated" comment because I asked about our sex life and it was not a "good time". There is never a "good time" to discuss it or actually have it. So because I pushed to discuss it, she replied with the official separation comments. Granted, it was late at night after I realized that again she brought up sex, but nothing would occur.

You touched on the "pretending" your wife does. I wonder if that is what is going on with my situation. She says things (that seem a positive step to R or sex), but does the opposite. It's like she is faking the comments and the behavior is the real story. As for something distracting her, it seems just about anything will distract her from discussing or acting on our sex life. I will say that she is a generally distracted person. She often gets distracted by the environment or people around her.

The MC told her that it was perfectly reasonable for me to want to discuss it and there was also a physiological reason behind it. That men that go without sex are by nature more agressive. If she with holds sex, I am more prone to show the agressiveness by wanting to discuss it. Some men show agreesiveness through actions, apparently I show mine with words (asking to discuss).

One of the other things I read on this board was NOT to discuss the relationship unless she brings it up. Certainly not the S part.
I have brought it up 5 times in the last month, and she did once, and each turned into an emotionally draining, long, drawn out converstaion that ended in her saying I am not hurting anyone or having an affair, and I am going to continue to have fun with my friends.
okay, but she is hurting me and does not NOTICE. So in my case, and maybe some of yours if she has a limited attention span, she may notice, but forget. I know my wife does not even remember some of the points she made, and the things she told me in our conversations. Where I remember almost every word.
The reason I say that is one thing I am implementing as of finding this board is, I am NOT bringing up dirty laundry anymore. It has been beat to death and not worthy of discussing. As a result I dont think about it much anymore.

That also leads me to the point of if you act like nothing is wrong, eventually you wont be acting anymore. (another little tip from the forum here)

So she may notice, but quickly forget because its more important to YOU that you guys work it than it is to her I hate to say. I am in the same boat, she really just wants to haver her fun and thinks I will be here to pay for it all, keep the house clean, and raise our child.

How long have you been having problems?

[goodguy59]

Truman and Konfused,

I am just about finished with the Schnarch book, Passionate Marriage . I must say, it is a book that will change your perspective on your marriage. I highly recommend it to both of you if you have not already read it. With this in mind, I offer these comments.

Both of you are too strongly fused with your wives. Both of you appear to be wrapped around your wive's finger. Stop acting like puppies begging for affection. I feel that I can say this because I am attempting to move out of this phase myself. Both of you sound like me during my most down times.

If your wife does not respond to your advances, realize that she has a problem, but don't try to change her, she has no reason to change anyway. It appears that she is in control of the marriage and probably likes the way things as they are. Instead, change your response to her. Let her know that she is entitled to her feelings about sex in the relationship and that you will no longer beg for it or pressure her to change (that is what begging is.) Do not get angry or try to make her feel guilty. Let her know what you want in the marriage but don't demand that she change. Hopefully, she will see that you are changing and therefore the relationship will change. She can choose to change with it or not.

This is really an attempt to get you "Schnarchy" as the folks on the BB call it, from one who is trying to get there himself. (I am not sure if this can be done without a MC to lead us through it.)

Others can do a much better job of explaining this than I can. There are many threads on the BB that address these issues. I am still attempting to grasp the concepts myself. But this is what came to mind as I have been following this thread.

[Truman]

Points well taken.
I am glad you brought this up as I want to just do my own thing w/ friends, etc and stop dealing with this as nothing good is happening. This issue with me has been I feel guilty if I am not working toward a solution as I cannot stay indefinitely with status quo. Meaning, when it comes to brass tax, I love my wife - but am not about to agree to a no sex marriage.

[konfused]

Odd, I went to the book store tonight and got both of Micheles books. I had that one in my hand as well and put it down.

While I can agree that I am in need of pulling back, (I am trying to) she is the one who has changed recently and I was hoping to reduce the change a little.
Our marrage has never led me to believe she was in control of it in the past as I would always do what I want and include her as well as try to do things with her. But since she has changed and in particular in the last month, you are correct, she has been more in control than I. The last week or so has seen changes in myself. She called me tonight and I did not answer the phone as I was driving and did not return her call until much later.

The changes in the bedroom have been probably the biggest swing in the control around here, and as I said, if I kept my mouth shut, none of the other problems would have come out and we probably would have had sex the day she gets back. As it is, who knows when.
I am not concerned about that, but the closing the bathroom door while naked is offensive to me since she has NEVER done that before the last fight, in 10 years.

Thanks for the points...I am listening and will check out that book.

[alamogirl]

Hi guys,

I just feel horrible reading your posts. My H and I have been married 12 years in July. For some reason, my libido took a nose dive about 5 years ago, and about 2.5 years ago, we stopped having sex altogether. This past weekend, my wonderful H left. He's now living in an apartment several miles away. I FEEL HORRIBLE! From a woman's perspective, I wish my H would have given me an ultimatum. I wish he would have said, "I cannot live in a sexless marriage. If we don't have sex, then we need to split up." When I asked him why he didn't do that, he felt that he shouldn't have had to. I agree with him, BUT, in my defense, we were going through so much stress. I realize that men can have sex even through stress, but women are different. Five years ago, we went through everything from buying a house, firing contractors, bankruptcy, husband quitting job, to both of us attending college.

I'm not excusing myself, but you can see why I was under so much stress. We always had a wonderful sex life up until 5 years ago. I don't know what happened. I visiting my GYN, and she put me on a certain brand of BC, which were supposed to have increased my libido. It didn't work, and I never went back for a change. Also, I had my thyroid and testosterone checked and both came back normal. I blamed everything on stress, but I didn't do a damn thing about it. Now, I'm very sad that the best thing that ever happened to me is gone.

He did indicate that he was not going to close the door on us, and that we could date. I don't know if dating includes sex. But he needs a break, and in a way, so do I. Living with him was pure hell, but now, I understand why. He was never abusive in any way, but he was always pissed off .

I've been on other marital websites. I got on "Dr. Ellen" website, and she talks about how sex governs a man's well being from how he treats his family to working relationships. Just reading your posts, I understand how frustrated you all are. Now, I understand, but I'm a little late.

I just read somewhere about Viagra for women...never knew that, but I am willing to try it. I am so sorry you all are going through this. This is exactly what I put my H through. There was no reasoning with him the day he left. He's afraid to trust me, and thinks that if we go back, I'll be back to my old self again. At this point, I don't see how I could ever refuse him again. I feel like crap and want him back in my daily life. He calls and comes around, but then he leaves. You all are amazing men to put up with women like me. And like your wives, I didn't think anything of it. I had your wives' attitude about sex. I just wish my H would have given me an ultimatum to show that he was not going to put up with a roommate marriage. My H doesn't think counseling will work because I'm the one with sex issues. I'm so glad I found this site. It's helped me tremendously. I hope my H will someday give me the chance to prove that our marriage can and will work.

I'm not going to say "hang in there" because you shouldn't.