Quote: That's why I stay here-- this is where my work is.
I agree but only because here is where YOU are. There's no need to leave in order to do this work but no need to stay either, so you are choosing to stay for other more positive reasons.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Quote: I think my point is that, for some of us, the idea of "I'd be happy if I was single and not having sex, so why does it bug me so bad now?" is simply not true. I'd be climbing the walls and VERY eager to get back into a relationship so I could resume that part of my life again. For me, it's the same whether I'm in an R or not--lack of sex makes my life incomplete.
Okay, so you've determined that sex is absolutely necessary to your happiness, like food or shelter. Therefore, you should be willing to make great efforts in order to have it in your life. But then you are left with the dilemna of how much is enough. Could you be happy eating beans in a hut with sex every day? Could you get by with less sex if you lived in a palace with a personal chef? If I believe that I can only be happy if I get all the sex that I want, then I am saying that I can only be happy when I no longer have a sex drive. So if I need to have/feel a sex drive in order to be happy then I have to get less sex than I want. At first this seems like a paradox, I can't eat all the cake I want and still want to eat cake, but then I remember that cake is never really free. Therefore, you have to work for cake and working for the cake works up your appetite for the cake.... but then I remember this is also true for my H. It's hard to have much appetite for cake if you don't have to work for it.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Jenny wrote on her thread Quote: So, I asked myself why it was the case that I could contemplate maybe doing without sex for a year or two if I divorced my husband but I couldn't contemplate going for a week or two without sex while I was married to him.
Lil said I'd love to hear people's thoughts on this, male and female.
Here is MPOV or how my situation feels to me. (Not totally organized, sifted through and condensed)
BB is near me most of the day so my expectations are higher that “just maybe,” something sexual/romantic will happen. I think about her more when we are together than when apart.
When I was on vacation I had fewer sexual thoughts. No proximity to BB lowered expetations???? Myabe, just my thoughts.
Also had a lot of outside stimuli happening (JJ’s day-trading) that was not related to BB or sexual in any way.
I guess a similar situation would be for an alcoholic, not going to a bar helps reduce desire for drinking.
I can’t totally ignore BB in this case. If I did ignore BB and know I would not see her but a few times a year, I am certain my sexual desires would decrease.
I suspect, in JJ’s pre-Alaska mental state/process, being near the reward causes an expectation. Knowing you might not be in proximity to a reward for a while diminishes the expectation and lowers the frustrating feelings one might experience.
Academically you know you will have more sex (and other things too) staying with a spouse than being on your own for a while.
The rub is you know the reward ratio could be much higher living together and thinking or knowing the reward schedule won’t meet your expectations, caused more pain/frustration than in a situation that is almost devoid of potential rewards.
So what is the biggest motivating factor? Frustrations caused by a person not getting enough rewards in a potential land of plenty, or ( giving up the current R) thinking one will find the reward if one looks in the right places and does the proper prospecting, knowing all a long, one might have many lean times or not ever strike pay-dirt?
Back to proximity. The SO is there everyday=higher expetations, which cause more frustrations if those expetations are not met.. Gennerally??? IMOP yes. The more difference there is between what we want and what we re think we have, the less happiness/satisfaction we experience.
Quote: If I believe that I can only be happy if I get all the sex that I want
How are you extrapolating this from what I said?
I am currently not getting "all" the sex I want, but it's close enough and I'm quite happy.
There were times, in the beginning, when I was tres hot to trot...and willing to lead...and wanted much more than what we were currently having. Still yet, I found no comfort in the fact that if I were single, I'd have found a way to be content without it. (if that's even true, which is my whole point)
I think that, with HD women, there is a point where their sex drive goes haywire at the thought of turning their sitch around and having their men lead. When that doesn't happen, their drive lessens a bit and they settle into whatever routine their men prefer. IOW, they don't continue to 'lead', they just adapt to being led in a way that doesn't completely fulfill them but is quite good nonetheless. I think that is what has happened with you and I. We happen to be married to guys who are not technically LD, in that their drive is fairly normal and predictable, but are more susceptible to mental/emotional dampers.
RE: Lil BTW my phone psychic whom I mentioned a while ago said this relationship is over and we both know it.
If your bf thought/felt this too, is he the type of person that can let go of the old R and move on? Can you do the same thing?
I see and experience lots of wants that are hindered by lack of moving forward, being stuck at a point, concern if what I am doing is the right thing to do, will it work if I do it, what if the next R is like this or the new R fixes a group of old problems but new ones will come up, do I want a next R? My Point? Being stuck is a common problem.
About phone psychic Lil?????. I think that is giving a little too much power to outsiders and then I think this psychic thing is really what some people call intuition.
I am not particularly religious, or believe in some / or one all inclusive theory of spiritual life, (though did attend church and bought into a Southern Baptist type of beliefs for 5 years, studied some biblical histories and lead a class for the same).
I have a distant friend with a PhD that is fairly religious/seems dedicated to God me, that proves astrology works. I am not saying she is right or wrong. I did ask her if what she called astrology was more like intuition. I know she has that.
Maybe I am just wondering Lil. Psychics, astrology, religious doctrines. All too much sometimes and competing to say they are right or the way, what ever "the way" is?
My question is "don't you think you would get better answers from your bf's C in a joint session, if and when your bf would be OK with joint sessions?"
If I am all wet or touching on a "NO GO" area sorry. Sometimes I need to MYOB (mind my own business)
Lou, trying to see the gray and still do what is right.
Quote: I am currently not getting "all" the sex I want, but it's close enough and I'm quite happy.
Then we're in complete agreement. All I was saying is that it was important to figure out what "close enough" or "good enough" was for me sexually within the context of whatever else is going on in my life. I'm certainly okay with 24 hours of celibacy. I'm certainly not okay with the thought of lifelong celibacy. Am I or can I be okay with the thought or the reality of a couple weeks of celibacy if my H's not in the mood for whatever reason? Would I be okay for a couple monthes? If I'm not, what are my choices in dealing with this? I've found that, for me, initiating sex is not a good choice to make in this situation and it doesn't become a better choice no matter how long I go without sex, though it obviously becomes a more tempting choice.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Quote: I think that is giving a little too much power to outsiders
I don't give her, or the religious POV (rabbi, kabbalah, Bible), or counselors (the six I've seen since I started dating bf OR the one he is seeing now) any particular amount of "power." I give each of these about as much power as I give to the people on this board-- which is to say I value ALL input that makes sense, no matter what the source.
One day I was feeling in a funk and pulled into the parking lot at school where I sing in a choir every day. On the ground was a bit of paper with this written on it: "Everything is difficult before it is easy. Buddha" I don't know if the Buddha said that, but I valued it as input.
The more difference there is between what we want and what we re think we have, the less happiness/satisfaction we experience.
That's very true. So changing your perception/philosophy as Mojo is saying can be very effective. The problem lies in the person's ability to actually do that. HP and I have a similar view on sex. I could have written this exact thing: HP: I think my point is that, for some of us, the idea of "I'd be happy if I was single and not having sex, so why does it bug me so bad now?" is simply not true. I'd be climbing the walls and VERY eager to get back into a relationship so I could resume that part of my life again. For me, it's the same whether I'm in an R or not--lack of sex makes my life incomplete.
The whole basis of humanistic psychology (particularly Carl Rogers) talks directly about the gap between a person's self-concept and their experience/reality. If one's self-concept is that of a sexual being, than not experiencing that side of themselves will create great anxiety/depression, etc. It is much easier for people to change their experiences than to change their self-concept of who they are. Mojo is a rare bird in that sense. It can be done and is often very successful in terms of happiness, but extremely difficult for many people. I for one, do not see myself easily changing my self-concept as a sexual person. If the M ends, I will fairly quickly find another sexual partner. That is me. I see instances of some women (and men) who get D and talk of not dating (having sex) with anyone in 4, 5, ,6 years and on. Those people are hard for me to relate to but I understand that everyone has a different self-concept and certainly people's views on the importance of sex is as varied as anything else. So what do you do in a SSM? If you can manage the Mojo way, than more power to you. Probably effective. But expect that you will need to rework a large part of your self-concept, of who you are. My bet is most people on this board are unwilling or unable to do that (myself included). But I am digging the ideas Mojo. Still simmering in my brain. Me likes.
Here is a great book, guaranteed for you to forget your troubles at least for a few hours. :-) The name of the book is "Hot Waters" by Kathryn Jordan Please read it is a wonderful escape. The book is based upon a lonely Minnesota housewife in a unhappy marriage, she decided after 25 years of marriage to fulfill her ultimate fantasy. She books a room at a spa and retains the service of a consort for the weekend and her dreams turn into reality. A must read.
sorry to hear your troubles lately, your sister in ED hell,
