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#561458 10/17/05 07:50 AM
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Hello

I have calmed down a bit since last night after I cried so much I couldn't cry anymore and then accidently fell asleep in my clothes because I was too damn exhausted.

DD4 climbed into my bed later on and I just hugged her for the rest of the night.

Anyway, here's what happened:

I went to his town at about 11am and when I got there, he wasn't dressed yet and there was stuff literally EVERYWHERE. I mean, I think I am untidy and my organisational skills aren't good, there are mud stains on my carpet that won't wash off etc, but this was something else.

There were bits all over every floor - looked like he hadn't vaccumed in a month, laundry lying in piles on the floor, toys in every room (DD4's bedroom is a tip, but I try to keep the rest of the house looking okay) - every room in the house was just littered with toys, dirty washing up still with food on still in the kitchen, dirty ash trays and empty wine bottles all over the place etc.

Sometimes because there's only 2 of us here I will soak the plates and then wash them at breakfast if I'm too tired the night before, but there's only like 2 plates, 2 cups etc. He's got a whole house full of washing up to do, and he left all of it.

There looked as if there was 4 days worth of dinner under the table.

I laughed at him, trying to stay jokey and light hearted, and said 'Honestly Andy, this place is a dump!' I asked him if he left it because he knew I was coming to clean.
He said no, it's usually like this. Ugh.

He went to get dressed while I said hello to the girls, and then he came back to make himself breakfast. He offered me a coffee. I accepted.
Drank the coffee and then he showed me how to work the tumble drier. I used to do it for him 2 years ago but I've forgotten since then.

Despite the mess, we seemed to be getting along okay, until Kate walked in (a cat).

Kate the cat is a Russian Blue and absolutely gorgeous. We rescued her from an animal shelter and I chose her. She initially stayed with me after the split but then she had a stomach complaint and kept messing and since I was pregnant with DD4 at the time, I asked him to take her as it's dangerous for pregnant women to handle animal mess.

Anyway, that broke my heart too as I loved her but didn't want DD4 to go blind. Kate has this really long furry hair which is grey in colour, she's lovely, so I kind of exclaimed, joyously
'Kate! my cat!' and went to pet her, as I've not seen her for 2 years.

Andy snapped
'She's not your cat, she's our cat. You haven't looked after her for 3 years.'

I felt my eyes smarting up and just said nothing, but really I was thinking 'shall I just get in a car and go home right now?'

He then said
'It's been ages since you were here.'
I said
'Yeah, 2 years.'
He said
'Yeah, after that fateful event.' (Our baby died, I was injured and nearly lost so much blood they were going to transfuse me but I refused).
I couldn't believe he would mention that, so I just said nothing and walked into the other room.

He went into the kitchen to make himself a pack-up for the hospital and I walked in there and said
'BTW, this is the only time I am ever coming here and that is because your dad is in hospital so don't think there is anything else to this; it's exceptional circumstance.'

He frowned, then nodded and said
'Why the sudden hostility?'
I didn't reply. He was being hostile to me over the cat.

He left and I engaged in some convo with my DD's - this went fine to start with and I started to enjoy myself, but then DD1 mentioned this miscarriage I had in 1998 (she was only 2 at the time but she remembers anyway as we had a memorial service and she held a lighted candle for the lost baby).
All of them talk about their sister avidly even though she never lived. She said to me
'Daddy says that when Courtney (the baby) came out, she was just bits, is that true?'
I flinched - esp. as I think I am still pregnant now - but said to her that really tiny babies who are sick, just get washed out of the mummy's tummy because they are too small to live on the outside.
I then started panicking in case Andy thought I was talking about this current pregnancy when he'd asked me not to say anything. I was terrified of any backlash, so I told her we couldn't discuss this topic anymore.

Then she moved her attention to clothes which I originally thought was a safe topic so she told me she was going to save up her £5 a week pocket money to buy clothes with and she asked me how much I spent on my clothes.
The outfit I was wearing was expensive, actually. I told her the skirt was £50 (it's silk), my boots were £50, my jacket was £45 and my top was £10 in a sale. So she was like
'Wow, you spent £155 on one outfit!'
I said yeah, and that I have loads more nice clothes at home because looking good is important to me, but some of them are only £5 - it depends on whether I like the design, not the price.

So she said she wanted to borrow my clothes when she was older. I said to her that by the time she is a teenager, she probably won't want to borrow her mother's clothes.

She said
'But I'm having your wedding dress!'
I flinched and then all the DD's started fighting over which DD gets to have the wedding dress (cost over £1000 new, London Designer wedding dress - absolutely gorgeous with a hand sewn lace train at the back).

I settled the dispute between them by saying that it depends what size they take when they're older as to who will fit into my wedding dress, and whichever DD that fits, can have it.

Then I started panicking again, thinking that Andy would think I brought up the subject of weddings/marriage with them so I decided to quit the convo and get on with some chores instead.

There was this big bag of clean laundry in the dining room so I got each of them to find their clothes out of the bag and put them away in the drawers upstairs (I can't climb the stairs). Then I put some washing on and dried a load of sheets.

Then I washed up the dirty dishes and threw the left over food out. Then I swept in the dining room and under the table and got rid of all the bits of breakfast and dinner welded into the floor. DD3 got the broom out and helped with this.

Then I vaccumed the hall, the bottom half of the stairs that I could reach and the living room, and asked DD's to tidy their toys away out of the front room.

After I'd done all that, I worked on some proof reading for my book, on Andy's computer.

We all had lunch together and then watched a film together and then I started preparing a fresh meal because Andy told me they've been having frozen stuff since his dad has been in hospital.

I made meals for everyone and left some food aside for Andy to heat up when he got home. Then after we'd eaten, I swept and washed up again.

The phone rang and it was bloody EX-OW2 which really put me on edge, and I asked her if I could take a message. She said no, rather curtly, and that she would text him because she 'knew where he was' (that really pissed me off).

Then Rose walked in (EX-OW1's 18 yr DD) to help herself to some coffee, and she said hello and asked me if looking after the kids was challenging. I wanted to hurl plates at her head for that remark.
Honestly, as soon as you lose custody, it seems the general concensus is you can't cope with anything and even looking after your own kids becomes an engineering feat.
I reminded her that Andy used to have a 40 hour a week job and that I was at home with a newborn, a 2 year old and a 3 year old all day, by myself, so if I can do that I can do anything. I said looking after 4 is not any different to looking after 3.

She asked me how the book sales were going. I thought
'You are the DD of the woman who slept with my husband; I don't want to have this convo with you.'
I just said I didn't know as we only get royalty reports twice a year.

Andy came back and looked shattered so I asked how his dad was and tried to be supportive. He said his dad was in a bad way and fluctuating all the time. I suggested going to do some reiki healing on him (I am a trained Reiki Healer). He said he was already doing some on him.
I asked how his mother was doing. He said she's been crying (unusual for her, she's an iron lady).
I said I'd saved him some dinner, but he said he wasn't hungry.

He then came in the room with a cigarette (drugs) and started to smoke that in front of me. I reminded him I was probably still pregnant, so he moved over by the window and started smoking out of the open window.

I told him EX-OW2 called for him. He told me 'I am not in a R with her, she's a friend.'
I slipped up and asked what she wanted to text him for, and he said it was none of my business.
I was hurt, since I've been trying to help and spent all day cleaning his house.
He asked why the 'solumn face'?
I said that he doesn't share stuff with me so why should I tell him what I feel?

It just escalated from there with him saying he never wanted sex from me anyway (that really hurt) and he took precautions so why should he care about it (the pregnancy), and that I wasn't what he wanted etc etc and that he wanted someone who could be a good mother to his children.

I said I try to be but you never let me in, you're always getting at me about them. I can't even have a convo with them without worrying what you will think.

Then we basically got in to this huge fight over the court hearings and he said I chose not to be there; I said I was only allowed to be there on his terms, being controlled by him and I just couldn't bear it.

I felt really used after I just tidyed up his mess of a house and looked after them all day so he could visit his dad, and cooked his tea etc and then he talks like that and even shuns my sex. I felt disgusting, like I wanted to get in the shower and scrub him off me. I still feel like that now.

Anyway, by the time we got back to my house, I just burst into tears and yelled at him and he just walked off.

Then after sobbing for 2 hours and falling asleep, I got a text message from him, saying
'I just wanted to say thanks for looking after them and helping; I appreciated it.'

I thought, you say all that and you appreciate me?? Too bloody late to say that now. I ignored it.

I'm not going to feel sorry for him anymore and I'm not going to try and be there for the girls when this happens all the time. I just can't do it, it's been 4 years

#561459 10/17/05 12:02 PM
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Hi Jo,

This is probably the 'toughest' 1st post I've ever written. I'd do the childish "I'm #1!!", but your post really made me want to get to the point.

You didn't DB well at all in that visit.

First, you went over there to clean, but keep your expectations high about it. Why expect more of a guy who has had 2 OW cleaning/watching his kids for him? Yet, he was able to thank you for your efforts finally, after you communicated the need to, and then you're rejecting his gesture of appropriate response? Come on now! If you won't lead, why get into any interaction for him.

Second, to go into another's place, and lay claim (a cat) to anything is dangerous ground. I can see why he bristled.

Third, the two of you have such sizable hurts related to your children and the miscarriage. IMHO, you're going to have to stay amazingly positive about this topic, and let the past go. Let it go, Jo. If not, the sitch is dead in the water. And you're children will suffer from even a lack of friendship or decency b/t their 2 parents.

Fourth, avoid the comparisons - e.g., I keep house so much cleaner. Either call the authorities about his filthy place out of concern for your DDs, or accept this as his way of being. I'd avoid cleaning for him, as that's not an avenue for respect, and he needs to grow out of his way of manipulating others, facing his reality himself.

Fifth, your DDs are very hungry for you. Their argument over a dress was about having you. It seems like they don't quite believe that you have enough love for all of them. Its not about the dress, Jo. Its about you. They love and want you.

Finally, I don't read that Andy's shunning you sexually. My take is he likely doesn't want you holding your possible pregnancy over his head, especially with the battleground your children (as a topic) have proven to be.

Move back toward a quiet, peaceful stance, Jo. If you're not ready to be supportive to him with no expectations, move away and give him space so that he has more energy and focus to deal with his father's grave illness. This is not a time to be looking for him to address any of your needs or to reassure (about OW2, his attraction to you, etc...).

I'm sorry if this post is rough. I've just seen you take steps that have reduced the progress you've made, right when Andy is showing glimmers of appropriate behavior and is finally alone (perhaps) to begin his own growth work. Try not to undercut this work of his with combativeness, Jo. Be a positive peaceful presence in his life. You'll best be able to do so if you work hard at self-care.

Gabriel



God heals the broken-hearted (Psalm 147:3)

Me: 44
W: 40
Separated 8/2011

S12
SD14
SS12
SD10
#561460 10/17/05 01:36 PM
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Gabriel

Firstly I didn't lay claim to the cat. Andy wasn't even in the same room at the time (he was in an adjoining room) so it was just an exclamation of pleasure to myself at seeing the cat, which he overheard while getting his breakfast. I never meant any harm by it.

Secondly, he will come in my house and look on my cell phone without permission, and say stuff like 'why isn't my name on your computer?' and 'that used to be mine' etc etc so I haven't done anything that he doesn't do.

I should add that I used to live there 2 days a week when I was first DB'ing so it feels like my home.

Thirdly, I wasn't DB'ing and didn't go round there to DB. I'm too tired for any of that. I went round there to have the girls and do chores while he was visiting his dad as his friends won't do it everyday, and I only offered that because his dad is dying.

I didn't expect him to thank me but I object to the fact that he started going on about 'wanting a good mother for his children' right after I have done all that.

The only mistake I made in my eyes is asking about EX-OW2 - but even with her I was polite on the phone.

I also don't mind doing chores for people - any people, not just him (I have cleaned my friend Sam's kitchen while she was at work, I have been grocery shopping for people and made Greek Salad for another friend and her husband; it's what you do when you are friends). Also, since my DD's live there I wanted to help.

As for getting at him about mess - I said it in a jokey way and he didn't take offence. He has been round here and told me he hates my (old) sofa and pointed out if I didn't mop the kitchen floor, when his place was evidently worse, so I put up with these remarks and smile sweetly, yet he can say what he likes?

As for my DD's, I do my best. I haven't raised them since they were 3, 4 and 5 and all there has been for years is fighting so I have very little to go on. Andy had already set down rules for what I was and wasn't allowed to discuss with them before I even went, and in my sitch, the fear of condemnation from him is such that no convo with them is natural.

You tell me how it is possible to get close to them when you're always wondering whether he would allow this, that or the other? I feel like another one of the kid's, not their mother or his XW.

When he first left, he just disappeared with them and I didn't even know where he was. I tried every avenue I could think of. I thought I would never see them again, then he only allowed 1 visit a month and kept snatching my baby, and basically I had to fight every inch of the way to have any kind of R with them.

This damages everything. How then people expect me just to blend into this easy, confident mothering role after all that? I am terrified nearly all of the time. I did a family tree with them once and he went completely mad. I backed off from them because he hated everything I tried to do with them and would tell his lawyer and then send nasty letters etc.

I can't be me around them, anymore than I can around him. But you see, even outside people have their own opinion. They don't know what it's like on the inside or the impact that this has, and for instance, even you are being judgemental about convos I've had with them or what I should or should not have picked up from them.

So you think giving birth makes everything automatically natural? That blood means everything? Believe me, after going through that flippin' terror campaign, it isn't.
It's the same as if I have given them up for adoption and then suddenly years later, someone places the child in the room and says 'here's your DD.'

They are like new people I have to start from scratch with again.

And I know he's not quit all these controlling behaviours because remember the 'you have no authority' remark when I asked to have them, and the letter from his lawyer about their names in my book? He still does it now so I have everything to be afraid of.

As for the possible pregnancy; I have not discussed it with him. I sent him 1 email days ago, telling him of the possibility but stated in the email he was under no obligation. He sent me 2 texts on the subject, one asking how I was, and 2 saying he was sorry about the clinic.

I have never put him under any pressure regarding it and think it was fair to ask him not to smoke around me since that can cause miscarriage and birth defects. I would not have mentioned it otherwise. If I still am, I intend to do all of it alone and he's not coming to the birth or getting involved, so I feel the sex remark was totally out of hand.

Plus, I think he was telling me the truth; he really didn't like it, else it wouldn't have felt the way it did. I don't expect him to congratulate me on my sexual conquests, esp. not now with his dad like that, but to rub it in my face like that when all I did was ask him not to smoke around me, is a bit cruel, in my opinion.

Jo.

#561461 10/17/05 01:52 PM
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Jo,

Again sorry for what sounds like a hellacious day. I am only going to address one area...your daughters. I completely agree with Gabe. It sounded like daughters that desperately want their mother. But you have a defense against this...I haven't been their mom to them since they were 3,4, and 5. I just don't think that matters to your DDs. I think there is a foundation to work from if you let go of the past. I would try to forget about Andy. He's not worth your time. But I would at least consider ways to foster the R with your daughters. Isn't there any legal recourse as far as visitation? If you can spend more time with them perhaps you can foster a more natural feeling R. And who gives a rip what Andy says or thinks. That marred your entire discussion with your daughters. Who the hell cares what he'll think?


In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years.
Abraham Lincoln

It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed.
Theodore Roosevelt

#561462 10/17/05 02:05 PM
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Jo -
sorry, but I have to agree with Gabe's observations. It sounds like both of you were equally responsible in the downward spiral your interactions took. It's like my kids bickering - it really doesn't matter who took the first shot, the one who continues it is just as culpable as the one who started it.

I see you reading way too much into everything that is said. I suspect Andy feels bewildered and confused around you because he never knows when some statement of his is going to set you off.

Jo, I know this is a terrible situation, and Andy is a very confused guy, but a big part of DBing is working on ourselves. Learning to improve your pattern of interacting will help you in all your other relationships. You REact so quickly and blindly, you end up whip-sawed around emotionally. I think you can learn to be more proactive, and control your course better.

BTW - blood test today?

Ellie

#561463 10/17/05 02:11 PM
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I do, Wes, because if I don't, he makes my life too much of a misery.

I let them look at baby photos - that's 'harping on the past' (so he said, I got a solicitor's letter for that and a bollocking from CAFCASS) - the same with the home videos.

Cutting and sticking we did out of magazines he said was 'offensive' (don't know why?) - had EX-OW1 shouting at me on the phone about that.

When I did a family tree he said it was 'inappropriate' and that got mentioned in a court report against me.

When I had to take DD4 to the clinic, he turned up with EX-OW1 and she yelled at me that 'she had Andy, she had the kids, so why didn't I just give DD4 to Andy and f**k off out of their lives?' (said in front of Andy) - I was reduced to tears and the hospital refused to see my DD because they didn't want to be involved in a domestic.

I let them play with marbles - he and CAFCASS said that was dangerous as they might trip on them and fall over.

I got to be so depressed and so scared that I used to throw my post in the bin because I was afraid to open it in case it was another solicitors letter. This was what it was like the whole time I was having regular contact.

I could have more access (but can't get it legally as I've run out of legal aid), but NOT if it means going through all that again, which it will.

I became so desperate at times I considered giving him DD4 just to get him to leave me alone - all I wanted was peace, at any cost, and it's only been my closest friend's encouraging me to keep hold of her and keep my head up that has kept me going through those times.

In fact, my closest friends who went through it all with me, say I shouldn't even see them at all because they were there while it was going on so they know what happens when I do have them regularly.

The only time he didn't do that was when we were together which is why I have tried for so long.

Jo.

#561464 10/17/05 02:27 PM
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Hello Ellie

I know I shouldn't have argued back and maybe some of my remarks were a bit tactless, but I am so tired of having to stay so passive all the time just to keep the peace with him, plus it was my first time ever at his house in 2 years and he'd already told me beforehand not to discuss pregnancy etc with the kids and then my DD brings it up and I'm just so scared all the time of doing the wrong thing I can't be natural anymore.

I know he was probably wound up over his dad, but I honerstly feel like whatever I do for him or them is not good enough (even the people on here think I am not a good enough mother, I can tell) and it just makes me want to run away and hide somewhere.

I can't have another blood test as I'm not going to the clinic - but I have one more pregnancy test left so I'm going to wait until my next period is due (25 October) and see if I miss a second one, then re-test.

My pain stopped, I haven't started bleeding and I've had a few bouts of sickness so I thought maybe it might be working (until the pain stopped because it's died?) I don't know.

Anyhow, I think I'm safe for a bit longer as I don't have any weird symptoms.

Jo.

#561465 10/17/05 02:42 PM
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Quote:

but I honerstly feel like whatever I do for him or them is not good enough (even the people on here think I am not a good enough mother, I can tell) and it just makes me want to run away and hide somewhere.





I'm not judging your mothering, just reading into your posts that your daughters want you in their lives and looking for ways that it would be possible to see them. And trying to offer you hope that if there was any way to see them consistently that you could feel more like their mother. I actually think Andy is about the worst parent I can envision. Seriously...what kind of person sees children as possessions? I'm pissed at him. I don't have any suggestions because it sounds like you've been there and done that. I guess my only suggestion is to get Andy out of your life. Don't text him, don't talk to him on the phone, don't IM, don't open the door for him. Just let him go completely. If he truly loves you the way he should he'll figure out a way of regaining your love. Just MHO.

Me


In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years.
Abraham Lincoln

It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed.
Theodore Roosevelt

#561466 10/17/05 03:05 PM
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Quote:

but I am so tired of having to stay so passive all the time just to keep the peace with him, plus it was my first time ever at his house in 2 years and he'd already told me beforehand not to discuss pregnancy etc with the kids and then my DD brings it up and I'm just so scared all the time of doing the wrong thing I can't be natural anymore.





There's a difference between being passive and being proactive.

What might that look like?

Quote:

there was stuff literally EVERYWHERE. I mean, I think I am untidy and my organisational skills aren't good, there are mud stains on my carpet that won't wash off etc, but this was something else......I laughed at him, trying to stay jokey and light hearted, and said 'Honestly Andy, this place is a dump!' I asked him if he left it because he knew I was coming to clean.
He said no, it's usually like this. Ugh.






First - saying a dig in a "jokey" way doesn't keep it from being a dig. I'm sure he heard it as a criticism. And I suspect it came out of your need to show him you could be a better parent than him. This was really counter-productive. And, yes, pretty insensitive to bring up his housekeeping skills while his father is so ill. You came to do him a favor in his time of need - it should be given freely and kindly. If you had been in his place, and he had made that comment to you at such a time, you would have been furious at him. Far better approach? "Don't worry about a thing, Andy, go see your dad and we'll whip things into shape here for you".

Quote:

Andy snapped
'She's not your cat, she's our cat. You haven't looked after her for 3 years.'




Duh, do you think he reacted that way out of resentment over you sniping at his housekeeping?
Or maybe he thought originally that he was only taking the cat during your pregnancy, and resents that you never took her back? Or maybe he just finds it painful to remember those tough times. Or maybe he thought you greeted the cat more enthusiastically that him and the girls.But you leap to assign the worst possible motivation to his comment.

Anyway - why not respond directly - something like "yes, I know she's yours now, but I still miss her".

Quote:

He then said
'It's been ages since you were here.'
I said
'Yeah, 2 years.'
He said
'Yeah, after that fateful event.' (Our baby died, I was injured and nearly lost so much blood they were going to transfuse me but I refused).
I couldn't believe he would mention that, so I just said nothing and walked into the other room.




Why shouldn't he mention it? It was his trauma too. If it's too painful for you to discuss, then just say "Andy, that period of time is too painful for me to discuss".

Quote:

He went into the kitchen to make himself a pack-up for the hospital and I walked in there and said
'BTW, this is the only time I am ever coming here and that is because your dad is in hospital so don't think there is anything else to this; it's exceptional circumstance.'

He frowned, then nodded and said
'Why the sudden hostility?'
I didn't reply. He was being hostile to me over the cat.




Gee, you REALLY set the stage for negative interactions here. It's like giving someone a gift for their birthday, but saying 'don't get used to it, I'm never going to give you another one." How much would you enjoy opening the gift then? And I'm sure he didn't understand the connection between you sudden hostility and the cat thing.

Better approaches?
1) Just not saying it. After all, his dad's ill, you came to do him a favor, favors should be given graciously. You wouldn't treat another friend this way, would you?
2) Be straighforward - "you know, your comment about the cat hurt my feelings. I'm here to help you out today, I don't appreciate being snapped at like that" (which might have led into some honest statement on his part, like "well, I felt like you were more excited about seeing the cat than about seeing me, and my feelings were hurt").

Quote:

I then started panicking in case Andy thought I was talking about this current pregnancy when he'd asked me not to say anything.



Why not just take Andy aside when he returns, or email him, and tell him DD asked about that prior pregnancy, but that you definitely did not talk about current.

Quote:

She said
'But I'm having your wedding dress!'
I flinched and then all the DD's started fighting over which DD gets to have the wedding dress (cost over £1000 new, London Designer wedding dress - absolutely gorgeous with a hand sewn lace train at the back).

I settled the dispute between them by saying that it depends what size they take when they're older as to who will fit into my wedding dress, and whichever DD that fits, can have it.




Why on earth wouldn't you have said that they each could wear it when their turn came? I think it's sweet that the girls so obviously want to be connected to you and be like you.

Quote:

The phone rang and it was bloody EX-OW2 which really put me on edge, and I asked her if I could take a message. She said no, rather curtly, and that she would text him because she 'knew where he was' (that really pissed me off).




Or, you could have done a little happy dance that OW got to hear and know that you were there with your girls! What a great opportunity to rub it in her face! The glass is half-full, Jo.

Quote:

Then Rose walked in (EX-OW1's 18 yr DD) to help herself to some coffee, and she said hello and asked me if looking after the kids was challenging. I wanted to hurl plates at her head for that remark.
Honestly, as soon as you lose custody, it seems the general concensus is you can't cope with anything and even looking after your own kids becomes an engineering feat.




You know, you really read a whole layer of subtext into that comment that probably wasn't there. Maybe she was just a normal 18 year old, thinking "that's too much work for me", or maybe she was thinking that your physical disability must make it difficult. Don't project your insecurities into other people's mouths.

Quote:

I was hurt, since I've been trying to help and spent all day cleaning his house.
He asked why the 'solumn face'?
I said that he doesn't share stuff with me so why should I tell him what I feel?





This would have been a good time to say "gee, I worked hard all day to make things nice for you here, I;d appreciate a thank you". Said nicely, he probably would have thanked you! (And notice, even after your fighting, he DID send you an email to thank you later).

Look, Jo, I'm not criticizing you, just trying to point out that when you change YOUR behavior, the people around you HAVE to change in response.

Ellie

#561467 10/17/05 03:06 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 6,901
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 6,901
(((Jo)))

You've had quite a weekend!!!

I have to agree with the others. Be yourself with the girls. You are a wonderful mother and don't let Andy's attitude affect that....ever!!! Just be yourself and ignore his idiotic ramblings. Say what you want, do what you want, etc. Stop walking on eggshells and letting his craziness affect you.

You will always be a part of the girl's lives. Andy will probably have many OW in the future that will come and go. You will always be their mother and should always be consistently in their lives. Make sure of that if at all possible.

I honestly see the time coming when Andy may not be emotionally able to care for the girls and that's one of the reasons you need to stay in contact with them. He seems to be spiralling out of control lately. Also, is there a law where you are that when they reach a certain age, they can choose which parent they want to live with?

I'd also look into "forcing" him to live up to the visitation agreement. If that means taking him to court, then do it.

Jo, no one here thinks you're a bad mom. I think I speak for everyone that we wish you had all the girls with you as you are by far the more stable parent.

You have to stop letting Andy's craziness get to you. The girls need a stable presence in their lives and you are it.

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