My H and I are not at the point of piecing our marriage bac together but I am trying to understand his emotional attachment to the OW. I have some question and thought maybe those of you who have been through it and are further along in your sitchs than I am may have some insight.
Sometimes I fear he will never make a complete break from her. He has been communicating with her for over a year now. He has told me how he feels a strong emotional bond with her. He has told me how he has tried to break off the relationship with her on multiple occassions and has been unsuccessful. He feels that he can open up to her in ways that he cannot open up to anyone else. On several occassions he has called her his "best friend".
To be completly honest all of this hurts me so much more than the short-lived PA that they had. I want to have that emotional closeness with him. I want him to open up to me. At one time I thought him and I were "best friends". At one time I thought we had shared a close emotional bond too. But according to H, he has not felt this closeness with anyone ever before.
So my questions:
1. Has anyone had their WAS successfully break off the EA w/the OP after multiple failed attempts? How long did it take? What finally happened to make their attempt to break it off successful?
2. Is it ever possible for H and I to share the closeness that he feels he shares with her? If, as according to him, we haven't shared the emotional bond during 10 years, will it ever be possible? Sometimes I wonder if maybe she is the right person for him and I am not. Maybe he has been right and I just need to deal with it, let go and find the right person for me. Maybe he can be happier with her than he ever was with me.
Any insights or words of wisdom will be appreciated. It feels as though this EA will go on forever. I really do not want to be dealing with her for the rest of my life w/H.
Hey Tessa...I'm following you. Here is a little info that was posted on a new post of mine recently. It may give you some insight into what is going on. You may especially like the part about the "slow, and I mean slow, demise of their R" with OW.
Take care.
A couple of hints:
Touch and gos can last upwards of three weeks to a month, the MLCer will appear to be "normal" during this time. My xh and I went on a cruise just a few days before our divorce became final. He was still around for several months after the divorce too.
Before depression hits, you WILL see the MLCer reconnect with his children and original family, all his new friends will be history. As depression and withdrawal become more evident, the MLCer will withdraw from them too, but still contact them, just not as often.
You will see the MLCer distancing himself from the OW, and the slow, and I mean slow demise of their relationship.
You will see a great deal of anger within them during the beginning phases of depression, blaming EVERYTHING on you. As time goes by, their anger towards you begins to subside, as you watch the depression take over them.
Their eyes, skin tone, physical appearance, stance show signs of the depression too, but this time, even they are about to see it.
You will witness your MLCer going through each stage feverously searching for what is wrong with them, for all of a sudden even to them, their life begins to look bleak.
Like I said before, there will be no doubt when they hit depression/withdrawal, unfortunately, it takes a bit of hindsight to see all of the clues.
Here's some relevant Shirley Glass. I'm going through a very similar situation with my partner and this is something I've been working on diligently.
Quote: Q: Do affairs ever serve a positive function--not to excuse any of the damage they do? Dr. G. Affairs are often a chance for people to try out new behaviors, to dress in a different costume, to stretch and grow and assume a different role. In a long-term relationship, we often get frozen in our roles. When young couples begin at a certain level of success and go on to achieve all kinds of things, the new person sees them as they’ve become, while the old person sees them as they were. The unfortunate thing is that the way a person is different in the affair would, if incorporated into the marriage, probably make their spouse ecstatic. But they believe they’re stuck; they don’t know how to create that opportunity for change within the marriage. A woman who was sexually inhibited in marriage--perhaps she married young and had no prior partners--may find her sexuality in an affair, but her husband would probably be delighted to encounter that new self.
Q: How do you handle this? Dr. G. After an affair, I do not ask the question you would expect. The spouse always wants to know about “him or her”. “What did you see in her that you didn’t see in me?” Or, “what did you like about him better?” One man asked, “was it that he had a bigger penis?”
I always ask about “you”: “What did you like about yourself in that other relationship?"
How were you different? And, of the way that you were in that other relationship, what would you like to bring back so that you can be the person you want to be in your primary relationship? How can we foster that part of you in this relationship?
Q: That’s a surprising question. How did you come to know that’s the question to ask? Dr. G. There is an attraction in the affair, and I try to understand what it is. Part of it is the romantic projection: I like the way I look when I see myself in the other person’s eyes. There is positive mirroring. An affair holds up a vanity mirror, the kind with all the little bulbs around it; it gives a nice rosy glow to the way you see yourself. By contrast, the marriage offers a make-up mirror; it magnifies all your wrinkles and pores, every little flaw. When someone loves you despite the fact that they can see all your flaws, that is a reality-based love. In the stories of what happened during the affair, people seem to take on a different persona, and one of the things they liked best about being in that relationship was the person they had become. The man who wasn’t sensitive or expressive is now in a relationship where he is expressing his feelings and is supportive.
Q: Can those things be duplicated in the marriage? Dr. G. That’s one of the goals, not to turn the betrayed spouse into the affair partner, but to free the unfaithful spouse to express all the parts of himself he was able to experience in the affair.
I see a lot of men who are married to very competent women and having affairs with very weak women. They feel: “this person needs me.” They put on their red cape and do a lot of rescuing. They feel very good about themselves. That makes me sad, because I know that even though their partner may be extremely competent, she wants to be stroked too. She wants a knight in shining armor. Perhaps she hasn’t known how to ask for it, or the ways she’s asked have pushed him away.
Hi Tessa ... I'm next door in Virginia! I understand you were asked to come along on our recent DB get-together this past Saturday ... wished you could have made it. It was very nice to put faces to the words. All very good people.
I fear my H may be caught up in an EA .. have no concrete proof .. just my woman's intuition. Can you shed a little light on your sitch? How did you find out? Signs? Ages? Who is 'she'? How did he treat you during this time.
My H has 100% completely detached himself from me emotionally. Very unlike him ... hard to believe he's not having that need fulfilled elsewhere.
Any words of wisdom you could provide would be wonderful! I've been in Newcomer's for almost 7 months .. just worked my way over to the MLC Forum. Hope to hear from you.
God won't make a mountain I can't climb! UPDATED: 5/9/07 ... I'm proof there is life after his MLC! My heart goes out to each of you that are experiencing the hell I lived through. God Bless You!
Hey Tessa. My H went back and forth for several months. He swore he broke it off, then I would find texts on his phone. He would deny it. Eventually I broke it off for him. I wouldn't recommend that, it's just what worked in our sitch. I literally called her and told her to stop calling, and when she kept calling, my DH changed his number and luckily (they were co-workers) her shift got changed to third shift. (Didn't have ANYthing to do with my friend that worked in their HR department, honest.:) ) Anyway, eventually, she tried paging him at work, or waiting around to see him leaving work, but he ignored her. She was hispanic, barely spoke English (he does not speak Spanish) so I had a friend who is Spanish call and leave a message on her phone. Her husband picked up her voice mail and finally, she stopped calling my husband.
After the alien returned my H, he admitted to me that he had thought she was the love of his life. They had this "token" of their love that he carried with him everywhere.
Again, after my H came back to his senses, it was really like he had woken up from a bad dream. The selfish and hurtful A-hole (really, for lack of a better description) that he had become totally disappeared, and the tender, loving, caring and honest man he had been returned. He told me then that he doesn't know what he was thinking, I was always his best friend and the love of his life.
So, yes, it can take time. Yes, it is hurtful, and yes, it can happen.
My H and I are on the boards now because of a completely separte issue, but our M is very happy for the most part. And we are almost through working out our remaining issues, which have to do with healing and moving on.
Thanks for the info. I don't know where my H fits in all of this. He can't seem to give up the OW -- although he says she is again "just a friend". I guess time will tell
Thanks for the link. I followed it and read the entire interview. I looked for her book the other day but didn't find it. I may just have to order it -- it's been recommended to me by several different people.
1. Has anyone had their WAS successfully break off the EA w/the OP after multiple failed attempts? How long did it take? What finally happened to make their attempt to break it off successful?
2. Is it ever possible for H and I to share the closeness that he feels he shares with her? If, as according to him, we haven't shared the emotional bond during 10 years, will it ever be possible? Sometimes I wonder if maybe she is the right person for him and I am not. Maybe he has been right and I just need to deal with it, let go and find the right person for me. Maybe he can be happier with her than he ever was with me.
I just happened to find this thread and thought I could maybe be of some help to you. In my R, I was the one who had the A. In all honesty, it started at a friendship and then went horribly wrong from there.
1. Yes. My A was an EA. I tried to break it off several times and failed. It took me almost a year. What finally woke me up was knowing that I wanted my XH back and that as long as OM was a part of my life, that would never happen. It took me feeling the complete and full weight of knowing that what I had done had broken up my family (it wasn't really all me, but my A helped push it over the edge). Once I truly felt that, I couldn't handle it. I knew I had to get my life back on track, for me and my family, and I finally ended it. It's been almost a year since I've had any contact with OM.
2. I don't know. That's what I'm trying to get back with XH. I think it is. I know that at one point we had gotten very close. I hate to say this to you, but it takes time. Lots and lots of time, for both of you.
I hope that helped you some. If you have any questions, no matter what, feel free to ask them of me. I want to help others here so much. And if I can give you or anyone something from the stand point of the one who had the A, please let me know.
Hi Tessa ... I'm next door in Virginia! I understand you were asked to come along on our recent DB get-together this past Saturday ... wished you could have made it. It was very nice to put faces to the words. All very good people.
I made plans with my niece for saturday so I couldn't go. Plus I worked part of the weekend. Hopefully next time. I was told it was alot of fun.
I fear my H may be caught up in an EA .. have no concrete proof .. just my woman's intuition. Can you shed a little light on your sitch? How did you find out? Signs? Ages? Who is 'she'? How did he treat you during this time.
I didn't know about the affair until he told me. But looking back in the months leading up to him telling me he was more emotionally withdrawn from me. He repeatedly said to me "I just can't give you what you need". He stayed away from home more and more (not with her, just even more involved in his volunteer work). He spent alot of time on-line on a message board that she frequented too. As far as who she is -- someone he started talking to on a message board which proceeded to e-mails and then phone calls. Problem -- she only lives a few miles away. She's been divorced twice, is 10 years older than my H and has a 12-13 year old daughter. (H and I do not have any children). He told her all of the things I did wrong so she being the opportunist that she is, starting doing all of those things right. The part that hurts the most is all I've ever asked from him he wouldn't put the effort out for me but he did for her.
As far as words of wisdom -- I can tell you what I did wrong:
1. I cried, begged and pleaded trying to get him to say she meant nothing to him and he would end the "friendship" with her.
2. I confronted her --- really bad because by confronting her, I was the bad one in my H eyes and she had done nothing wrong. It really pushed him even further away.
3. I repeatedly told him my opinion of her -- that was really bad too because in his eyes she was/is an angel who has again "done nothing wrong".
4. From the beginning he has asked me to just leave him alone to deal with it. He has even blamed me for why this is still going on -- his opinion is that had I left him alone he would have "take care of" the issue. Maybe he would have, maybe he wouldn't have -- I can't go back and find out. But certainly not leaving him alone and not giving him his space when he asked for it was a wrong thing to do.
5. I focused too much on the "relationship" between H and OW instead of focusing on re-establishing a friendship w/my H and then rebuilding our relationship from there.
6. I have a difficult time letting it go. When H and I have spent time together I have found myself making smarta$$ comments which really do not help the situation.
So those are several of my mistakes.
The things I think I have done right:
1. Looking at myself and the person that I had become. Realizing that I didn't like myself and working at the changes to make myself a better person.
2. Leaving H alone. Unfortunately I haven't been able to do this for as long as he has needed me to. I left him alone for an entire week once and when I gave in and called, he was upset. I told him it was a whole week, that's a long time. He said, "no, to me it's not a long time at all". So the new thing I am trying to do is to leave him alone as long as necessary and allow him to "come back on his own" (those are also his words)
Quote: My H went back and forth for several months. He swore he broke it off, then I would find texts on his phone. He would deny it.
Was it the OW pursueing him or was he pursueing her during these times of trying to break it off? My H is the one pursueing her. He told me he tries to break it off with her, tells her he is choosing his marriage, then he and I have an argument and he goes running back to her. The crappy thing is she is still there waiting for him. I can't tell you exactly how many times this has happened but I know it has been at least 4-5 times. She once told him not to come back until he had divorce papers in his hands, but she still took him back several times after that. I have to say this on here -- she is pathetic!! (I know it's not all about her but I needed to vent that out) But you know what, my H is pathetic too (better to also say that on here and not to him).
Quote: Again, after my H came back to his senses, it was really like he had woken up from a bad dream. The selfish and hurtful A-hole (really, for lack of a better description) that he had become totally disappeared, and the tender, loving, caring and honest man he had been returned. He told me then that he doesn't know what he was thinking, I was always his best friend and the love of his life.
Thank you rottzilla for that ray of hope. My H has been exactly that -- a selfish, hurtful, a-hole. His favorite expression is to say about himself "yes, I am an a$$". Like he's proud of it or something. Anyway, sometimes, I see glimpses of who he used to be. When I see those glimpses of the old H, I feel my love for him grow. It is hard for me to let go and detach when I see him being the man I married. So right now, I'm limiting my contact with him so I can stay detached.
Quote: So, yes, it can take time. Yes, it is hurtful, and yes, it can happen.
It scares me realizing how much time and how much effort this will take. But I know I have to put my whole heart and soul into it and not worry about the outcome.
Here is a little info that was posted on a new post of mine recently. It may give you some insight into what is going on. You may especially like the part about the "slow, and I mean slow, demise of their R" with OW.