well, I don't know if any of you remember me, I haven't posted for months. I am going from one extreme to another in my head and I don't want to screw up anymore. Here is my sitch:
M 33 H 30 together 6 years bomb dropped in jan 2004
he told me ILYBNILWY, that resentment had been building for over a year, that he met OW at work and that he was sorry but he wanted to see if he could be happy with someone else.
I suggested divorce, HE said no, that we could be separated, but still live together for our custodial sons' sake (9).
May 04 I found DB and read it, along with 5LL. Made things very clear. I figured out what his LL were. I lost weight, became more 'fun'. He noticed. I db'd my butt off and in NOV 04 he said he was going to break things off 'slowly' with OW. He went from seeing her twice a week to twice a month for dec 04, jan 04 and feb 04. But still talked to her constantly during this time and I caught him in a few lies. I think this made me beleive that he was just cake-eating and had no intention of ending things with OW. I told him that he can't expect us to 'fall in love' again while he still has OW in the picture.
During these 3 months I gained back some of the weight I lost, I just didn't make it my priority, I wanted to spend all my free time with H, since he was staying home more. BIG MISTAKE, it was a huge backslide and H began to think that I was getting too 'comfortable'. I noticed that he started going out more often with OW, things are back on track for them. I confronted him and he said that while he was with OW, I took such great care of myself, but as soon as he told me that he was ending it, I went back to my 'old' ways.
He said 'Why didn't you do the things I told you I needed you to do when I told you I would come back to you?' - he mentioned a few things that I thought I had changed about myself, but apparantly not enough. I tend not to do as he asks, but I do what I think is best. This has caused many problems for us in the past, ie he really wanted to have a baby right after we were married, I said we should wait a few years. This caused a lot of resentment inside him (which he hid from me until the bomb). We argued a lot about little things, but I didnt think anything of it. Apparantly he did. He felt that he had no control of his life and was trapped because I always did what I wanted regardless of what he wanted. (I told him that I wasn't a mind reader and that if he was really so bothered by things he should have told me...but I guess that's not good enough for him)
OW is pressuring him to divorce me, he told me that she doesn't understand that there is still something between him and me.
Last weekend he went away to 'think'. He called me about 10 times and was drunk. He said he 'missed me so much'. Nothing new, since he has done this before. However once he was sober he made a comment about feeling nostalgic about me. I got upset, I told him that I am not a childhood friend or an old piece of furniture for him to feel nostalgic about. He said that he misses the old me, not the person I am today.
Now he says I haven't changed, that it is just my personality, that we are both very strong-headed people, that even if he left OW, he doesn't think we will ever be happy together. He brought up a few recent examples of things he asked me to do and I procrastinated and it caused problems for us. I think he may be right. Maybe I can't change. He said that I shouldn't have any hope for us, and that he is tired of this situation.
Now it seems that I am worse off then I was a year ago, he is seeing OW again and now he doesn't believe that I can change or be what he needs. I don't know if I have the strength to DB again and to STICK TO IT. I am so drained. Last weekend he went away to 'think'. He called me about 10 times and was drunk. He said he 'missed me so much'. Nothing new, since he has done this before. However once he was sober he made a comment about feeling nostalgic about me. I got upset, I told him that I am not a childhood friend or an old piece of furniture for him to feel nostalgic about. He said that he misses the old me, not the person I am today.
He has mentioned many times over the past year that I should 'move out' for awhile. When I ask him why, he says he wants to see how he feels when I am not around for him to count on. That we are so intertwined that he can't fathom the idea of me not being there. He also thinks it will be good for me to get away from all the pain he causes me. I tried to leave a few times and he always stoppped me. But now he says he won't.
Keep in mind that he is still very affectionate with me, we even went away together for a few days 2 weeks ago on his suggestion - and we had a good time. It is very hard to distance myself from him emotionally, especially when we are still good friends and still ML.
I don't know what to do:
-Should I move out for awhile and let him live in the REAL world with OW while I try to GAL. (I know that you will suggest that I GAL now, but that is one of the things that caused problems between us - he felt that I didn't love him because I would do what I wanted.) This will give me a break from the constant drama and allow me to focus on myself.
-Should I stay home and start dbing again all over from scratch? Can it work a second time, or will I just be wasting another year of my life? Is it possible to get back on track again or have I blown my chance? I don't know if I have the strength for this, I may make things worse. I can't be close and intimate with him (very important LL for him) and detach myself at the same time - so I will be hurting a lot when he leaves to see OW. I know she is tired of this situation, so should I wait to see how it plays out?
- Do I stay at home, but not be his 'wife' any longer. Should I try to get 'over' him, and just try to be friends. Do I give up and just accept it is over for now, (I know there is always a possibilty for the future).
You might not have thought of this but have you thought of why he wants you to move out for awhile. Depending on the length of time your gone, he can claim abandonment. This might not be his idea, but I'm sure the OW is putting in her two cents worth. What this does is weaken your position in regards to shared equity and custody.
Bottom line is you need to discipline yourself, work on your problems in your own house. You seem to know what to change, get started. He is telling you what he needs, make it so. Sooner or later the other women will fade away, she will not wait long in the wings with little change or no hope. So don't "go away" for awhile, that only leaves the door open and you essentially make the tough decisions for your H. He is confused, he knows what he should do and he knows what the easy thing would be to do. Of course they are nowhere near each other. It's tough being an adult.
My suggestion is to get started again. Fix those things that are causing this problem, NO SHORT CUTS THIS TIME. It's not going to be easy and doing "your" version of what he wants is not going to solve the problem. Make him feel like a priority, but don't come off clingy. From what you have said he seems to feel he is not a priority, sort of he gets what is left over when you are done taking care of your needs.
Give these questions some thought.
What is she (OW) offering? (attention, attentiveness, focus, respect)
Why does H not see that from me? (yes old habits are hard to break, some times we have a hard time forgiving)
I'm not saying to not work on yourself and take care of yourself, but he has to feel like he is your best friend and lover. Do you see that in the way you treat him. You know his love language, dig in and do it. At least he will communicate it to you and he didn't bail at day one. Count your blessings and "get it done".
thanks for your words of advice, they help to keep me focused.
I am not worried re abandonment issues etc... our situation is a bit different than normal. We both make almost the exact same salary. Our son is really our nephew, we have joint custody with his biological dad (my H's younger brother). We have been raising him for the past 6 years and he goes to his biological dad's place every other weekend. My H's mother lives with us, as does his other younger brother. So I think it would make more sense for me to leave as opposed to my H, because it's mostly his family in the house. I am not worried about custody of our son because I wouldn't fight for it, I would leave him with my H, and just have visitation.
This weekend my H told me that he thinks HE is the one who should move out. I asked him why, he said because HE is the one who is 'the bad one' in our situation. I told him that if he wants to leave that's fine, but that it wouldn't be a permanent situation. I wouldn't stay and take care of the house, take care of our son and HIS family. If we do divorce, he will be the one assuming the responsibility, I will be on my own. So I asked him what was he hoping to accomplish by 'temporarily' leaving the home?
He told me that he hates hurting me when he leaves to go with her, this way I would get a break from it. He also say that he really needs to see how he feels when he doesn't have me to come home to. He said that even though he spends friday or saturday with OW, they usually just go out and get drunk, then he passes out, wakes up in the morning and then comes home to me. It's not like they have the same kind of relationship that we had.
I told him that I agree, that the 2 of them aren't really experiencing a real relationship, that they never have to stress out or make compromises about real-life decisions, they just have a good time.
He said that maybe this move will be the catalyst for him to decide to give our marriage another shot, he is not sure.
I gave the decision of moving out myself, or making him move out a lot of thought last year. I had decided back then that I should be the one to leave. But now he is suggesting that he leaves. The dilemna I have is what would be better, in terms of DBING?
Me temporarily moving out:
PRO'S
- I wouldn't have to deal with the day to day issues of taking care of the house (groceries, budgeting, helping with homework, making lunches, laundry etc...)
- I could spend time only on ME, improving my exercising, shopping, doing things I want to do without time constraints.
- H would have to take over the responsibilities of the house (seeing how much I have to do).
- H would have to STAY HOME without me there during the week, to take care of our son and home.
- I would be able to control when H gets to see/contact me.
CONS
- I would be alone alot - I wouldn't have the comforts of my home (computer, etc) - I would miss stuff at home (son, cats etc...)
H temporarily moving out:
PROS
- he will get homesick (proven in the past when he went on trips) - he will finally make a decision on what path to take (me or OW) - he will be financially tight - no money to party with OW.
- he will have to be the one initiating contact with me, and he won't be able to say that I am the one who can't 'let go'.
CONS
- he will be able to see OW during the weeknights and spend a lot more time with her (time he used to spend with me) They will get much closer.
- he will not miss me and think that he will be okay if we divorce.
- He will mistakenly believe that this is how his life will be if we divorce (not taking into account all the new responsibilities he will have)
Keep in mind I say 'temporarily' moving out, because eventually we will have to decide to stay together or divorce, if we divorce then we will sell the house and split things 50/50.
Very tough call. Obviously I am in no position to make an educated recommendation. Only you can make that decision. I am proud of the way you seem to be handling it and seem ok with which ever way things work out. To me it seems he has nothing to complain about, you sure seem to be very helpful with his family sitch. My first reaction would tend to say plan A, but as I've said, only you can make that decision. Keep us posted and I'll chime in as able.
I don't think anyone should go any where. Now, can you list the things that your husband wanted changed? Then, let's turn these into goals and break them down. You still have a guy who really cares about you, you just need to do some work.
Similar stich in that my H and I were v. good friends and ML during his EA.
In my stich, I moved out - twice. The first time was for a couple weeks - stayed with relatives. The second time I moved for a month to a town 30 min north of where we live and rented a month to month furnished apt.
During that month - yes I was lonely at times. But I believe it really helped me - and indirectly the stich. I really GAL and detached. I could focus on me and not worry about where he was and who he was with.
When I came back after a month - he wasn't ready to commit yet. So he ended up moving into a friends house for a month. That pushed him over the edge. After a month he was recommited. I think it helped too that OW rejected him.
I moved out for me. It was a way that I could control at least part of a stich that was out of my control.
I don't think much would have been accomplished in my sitch if we would have played the stay or go musical chair thing. Depending on the sitch I think it gives too easy of an opportunity to giving up and bailing. By sticking it out I feel I have told wife that I am in this for the long haul. Choices, choices, choices.
thank you all for your help. I think the best thing is for us to stay put, however it has gone past that. H told me this week that he has made his choice. H says that he is NOT leaving me for OW (yeah sure), he is just ending things between us. Neither of us wants to sell the house yet because it really is a good investment and we don't want to disrupt our custodial son's school etc... However I can't see us continuing to live like this, we are fighting a lot more about our situation and I find myself unable to be strong and db or hide my pain after almost 2 years of this. I really think I need some time to myself to refocus. H said he doesn't know what will happen without me, that maybe he will miss me so much that he will realize he made a mistake, but bottom line is that he is not happy with me right now (of course not, since he lets OW make him happy).
He told me that he DOESN't want to move in with OW, but doesn't think we can afford for him to get an apartment. I think that I will move out temporarily for a few weeks, then we can talk again after that and see if we can make a final decision. In the meantime, I plan to GAL to the max and remove myself from this crazy rollercoaster.
Some of you asked about what he wanted changed and what goals I should set:
H wants me to be physically fit, I gained 35 pounds over the past few years. He did too, but he joined a gym and is now in great shape. I lost 30 pounds last year too, but I have gained 15 of it back during the time that H told me he would break up with OW (dec/mar 05). H thinks that I only lost the weight to get him back and then when he told me he would try to come back - I gained it back. This is partly correct, my primary LL is quality time, so instead of going to exercise, I would hang out with him, I was so happy that he was staying home that I wanted to spend as much time with him as possible (BIG MISTAKE). I explained this to him, and although he says he understands, he still feels I didn't care enough.
He has issues with my housekeeping, and the groceries I buy. (apparently his MIL complains about the food) I thought that I had improved tremendously, buying what they wanted and taking better care of the house, but I guess I didn't improve enough for him.
I realize that he is looking for reasons to leave, I also realize that because he is a pessimist and suffers from depression he tend to only focus on the negative things. I may do something 'correct' 9 times out of 10 and he will mention the 1 time that I didn't. I point this out to him but I don't think he realizes it for himself yet.
I know he loves me, but he is not happy with me and of course there is OW who is trying so hard to please him. Well if I was single and had all the time in the world to focus on myself and on my 'boyfriend', I would be wonderful too. But the reality is that I have to take care of a home, and have many responsibilities that are stressful. The 2 of them just wine and dine all the time and don't have to deal with any responsibility. I pointed this out to him too, and he agrees that they aren't living in the 'real world' and he doesnt know what will happen to them when they have to. But I think he wants to find out.
In my earlier post I listed the pro's and con's of me vs him moving out. I discussed it with him a little more and I have more details:
He said that he can stay with OW (at her apartment that she shares with her sister who doesnt like my H) on the weekends we don't have our son, and he will go over there to sleep 1 or 2 nights a week, after our son goes to bed.
I see some advantages to this situation:
- H will get very tired driving to her place and then driving to work from there in the morning (it is an hour away) - OW sister will cause tension for them - OW may be happy at first, but it won't be enough for her and she will continue to push him. - I get to stay home and will have more time to DB.
Disadvantages:
- H could get closer to OW, - H doesn't really get to see what life is like without me, I will still be taking care of the house as usual. - I won't be able to focus on myself, I will still have all the responsibity I had before (grocery, housekeeping, etc...)
Now compare the above scenario to ME moving out:
pros
I wouldn't have to deal with the day to day issues of taking care of the house (groceries, budgeting, helping with homework, making lunches, laundry etc...)
- I could spend time only on ME, improving my exercising, shopping, doing things I want to do without time constraints
- H would have to take over the responsibilities of the house (seeing how much I have to do).
- H would have to STAY HOME without me there during the week, to take care of our son and home.
- H will experience life without the benefit of me I can go semi-dark, something I can't do when we are living together at home, or if I am at home with his family.
CONS
- I would be alone alot - I wouldn't have the comforts of my home (computer, etc) - I would miss stuff at home (son, cats etc...) - I will have less time with H to DB. - OW will be happy that I am out of the house.
So I am still at a crossroads, H suggested that I use some of out vacation time (we took a week off work in august) to spend by myself and think about what I want to do.
(did I mention that we work together? we drive in to work and back home together too. We don't work in the same dept, but we usually do lunch together about 3 days a week. So even if I move out and go semi-dark, H and I can still see each other for lunch, so I will still be able to DB)
Any more suggestions, I would really appreciate it. thanks
I like the second choice. I like the idea of you moving out, going semi dark and working on yourself. But ONLY if you work on yourself. Go ahead back to the gym, lose the weight, make YOURSELF happy. Truly happy. This is not about making him THINK you are happy, it's about BEING happy yourself. Don't be alone, meet some people. Join a club, get out. Then, when he sees you for your lunch time meetings, he will see the inner glow you have from your true happiness.
I'm not saying it would be easy, it would be hard. But I think it is worth it. Plus, you won't have to have the heart break of thinking about where he is and when he is with her.
Your H will be off in fantasy land at OW apt. with NO responsibilities. Let him experience all the things that you took care of in the home. I bet after a period of time, he would think twice about his complaints about your grocery choices and housekeeping. He needs a dose of REALITY. Just my opinion It looks like you are getting some excellent advice here
Last edited by SP1; 08/08/0504:54 PM.
According to the Buddha, praise and blame, gain and loss, pleasure and sorrow may "come and go like the wind," but happiness comes if you can "rest like a great tree in the midst of them all."
It looks like you are getting some excellent advice here