How to GAL when SP is jealous/trust is broken??

[heatherg]

Ok, Akron, what can my H do to gain my respect back....
1.Tell me that my feelings matter. I don't think I've ever really felt that they do matter to him. I need validation.
2.Tell me that I am just as important to him as our children, that he would love to spend time alone with me, put the kids to bed early one night, go out one night, get away for the weekend, WHATEVER.
3.Take care of me. I'm strong and independent yes, but I don't want to be responsible for everything.
4.Take steps to end the alcohol dependency and validate my feelings on the issue.
5.Stop using pornography.
6.Stop focusing on the act of the A and start focusing on his feelings and the effects of the A.
7.Stop punishing me! Put his ring back on, allow me back in my own bed, and end the no kissing thing.

The first five are things I wanted before the A happened. They all still exist except number 4. He has made efforts in this area, but only b/c he's afraid I'll use it against him to get custody of our kids. So in addition to the first five, we not have six and seven as well. This is where it starts to feel hopeless.

I am so resentful toward H because I am a young, fun, intelligent woman and at the risk of sounding like I'm on an ego trip, guys look at me. I wish my H would have been half as interested in me as he has been in pornography.

He has not told me he loves me or that he wants our M to work or that he doesn't want to lose me.....he's told me nothing. The closest thing he has said to something positive is that he's agreed with me when I say we should try for the kids' sake. He's told me the only reason I'm still here is b/c of the kids. He says he cannot bear to be away from them and so a D is out of the question for him. At one point he told me that we should cohabitate in the home to raise our kids and that he was willing to forego his future with a mate (although he now denies he said that he didn't need the M). So I live here, not knowing if H gives a damn about me. At times I think his words are just his defenses. But either way, whether he's telling the truth or not, I know I cannot go the rest of my life like this.
Oops, got into a little too much detail....

[sage]

Heather,

Has anyone pointed you at Calystra's threads? Sort of similar sitch but her h was on the D train bigtime...she was wildly successful DB'ing.

If you've got some time on your hands:

Cal's threads (read from the beginning)

Sage

[heatherg]

Thanks Sage. I've read through some of her threads and will continue to read. I appreciate you taking the time to assess similarities, I am open to anything.

Heather

[heatherg]

Update~
H and I are speaking again. Yesterday seemed to be the turning point for him. I don't necessarily think it was anything I did, I honestly think he just got sick of not speaking. And I was working really hard not to let the silence affect me the way it has in the past, I've just been going through my days trying to be as normal as possible, making conversation that doesn't require answers from H.
So, this is a good step I suppose. I'm not feeling much like celebrating it though. I'll post more on that in a bit.

[heatherg]

Ok, so one of the things I listed that my H can do to gain my respect back is to stop looking at naked pictures of other women. Is that so much to ask??
I really, really would like some other POVs on this one because it's really interfering mentally with progress in my M. Like I said in an above post, I should be really happy right now b/c H and I are talking again for the first time in almost two weeks. But I'm not happy. This is why:
H leaves his laptop out, which he can't get online with anymore, something went wrong with it and he needs to have it fixed. It used to be pretty easy for me to monitor his online activity (which I started doing in about January), but that is not the case anymore b/c he uses a desktop at work now instead of his laptop. Yes, that is one of the things I discovered in the early months of snooping, is that H views quite a bit of porno at work. I have no idea how he manages this since he doesn't have his own office, just a cubicle. Now, it is the only way he can view it b/c our home computer is in the room I sleep in and his laptop is incommunicato with internet.
But he saves some of his [favorite?] pictures on his thumbdrive. He used to have them on his hard drive, but while snooping, I realized that he deleted those Friday night and now just has them on the thumb drive that he takes with him everywhere. He's named the files professional type names and buried them 3 folders deep, so as to hide them.
I first found those pictures months ago. Some of the pictures go back to 2001. But what I found Sat morning was that some of the pictures have been swapped out with new ones, which tells me H is still viewing. His favorite site is sublimedirectory.com. It kills me every time I see stuff like this....I am so many things, I cannot decide on a single emotion. I always knew pornography was an issue, but I tried not to think about it. Only when I accidentally (yes, truly accidentally) came across it, did it become an issue in the past. I was never a snooper, honestly, until these last few months. So, it's come up on more than one occasion pre-affair and a few times since the A. I've expressed my feelings on it but apparently, his desire to do it matters more than my feelings. And of course, now that I've been snooping, I'm finding that he was doing it a lot more than I ever realized.
I started to get really bitter after I kissed OM and a year later he's still carrying on like I had a full blown affair. I'm not trying to downplay what I did, but it seems there is a double standard here, no? When I realized how much he was honoring his feelings about what I did, it really made me do a double take on what I've been holding in, my feelings about his "other women". Plural. Of course now he says that by bringing up the pornography issue, I'm just trying to justify my own actions.
A week after I told H about OM, we have a talk about the pornography thing. He tells me that he likes to look at beautiful women and if we reconcile he'd like it to be something we can do together. WTF???? From my perspective, he's saying, "I'm tired of hiding this from you. I want you to know how often I do it. And I want you to approve it also so I don't have to feel any guilt whatsoever. Ok?"
I was thinking "my H just told me that he likes to look at beautiful women. I cannot remember the last time my H told me that I was beautiful". Is anyone feeling my pain here, or am I just too overly sensitive?????
So, here I am trying to outline goals to make him feel that he can trust me again. What about MY trust? MY feelings??
Yesterday we were at the mall. D2 is on my shoulders, messing up my hair, my back is killing me from carrying her around. H is with me and S4 is on his shoulders. In front of us walks this hot girl in tight clothes. My blood pressure went through the roof. All I kept hearing was "I like to look at beautiful women"....why would that just be restricted to internet viewing?? Duh, I'm not stupid. I was thinking to myself, if this was internet, I bet you'd double click on her, huh???
H doesn't understand that I NEED to be that girl and that I WANT to be that girl for him. But you can't dress like that when you're toting kids around!! I love my kids and love being a Mom, but I want to be a woman too!! I've tried so many times to tell him this. I want to go OUT without the kids, dress to kill. Come home and have hot sex. Before my A, I would ask H for time out, time alone. And he would just tell me how selfish I am, why I can't I just be happy with our family time? He won't even leave the kids to take me to a movie for crying out loud. The pornography is just SO unjustified!!! He won't let me be that woman, he'd rather look at someone else's tits. I don't know how to empower myself on this issue. I'm proactive. If I feel stupid in an area, I take a class. If I feel like my M is in trouble, I read books, go to counseling, etc. Get the picture??
What can I do about THIS though? I think that in the months before my A, I was acting out, really struggling with finding a way to empower myself against this insecurity that I HATE feeling. I suppose that's when the attention thing started~I thrived on attention from other guys to reassure myself that I am to them what pornography was for H. That was my way of "getting back".
I've been upfront and open about my betrayal and I haven't seen or talked to OM since I told H. But his betrayal continues. When we've talked about it, he tells me that he doesn't see pornography as a betrayal, but he can see where I might. But he says I shouldn't take it so personally, that all guys do it. He has never once said he would stop doing it, I've never straight out asked him to (should I have to ASK?). But he's never said he would stop, he won't tell me when the last time he looked at it was. He won't deny or confirm MB to these pictures. He has personal lubricant in the top drawer of his dresser, although he doesn't know I know that.
You know what I really want to do? Have a professional photo shoot, nude pictures of myself. And post them to sublimedirectory.com for him to find. He can download them and add them to his collection of pieces of @ss he'll never get.
Am I crazy???

[OG_Lou]

RE: heatherg

Am I crazy???

No, you are not crazy.

I have been reading some of your post and consider you a person that is working hard to improve your M.

I understand the emotions behind why you kissed the OM and I understand some why your H is looking at porn on the internet. What I don't agree with is his reluctance to quit the internet porn and take care of a real, warm, 3D person as yourself.

I don't have experience with A's of any kind but have often had to resort to satisfying my own needs. I guess I don't have any advice except to ask your H how much hypathetical surfing, (if you had the desire to) you can do with out him feeling rejected.

Tell him he is damaging your ability to trust him and that is what led you to have the OM as a kissing friend.


If I see something I have experience with, I will comment later. Any questions about specific items? ask.


Lou

[heatherg]

Hi Lou, thanks for stopping by~I've read some of your posts on others' threads and I believe I've read some of your thread as well.

I understand some why your H is looking at porn on the internet.

I'd love to have your expanded version on this comment~

ask your H how much hypathetical surfing, (if you had the desire to) you can do with out him feeling rejected.

Do you mean I should suggest using porn myself? Like to turn it around and see how he would feel if it were happening to him? Can you clarify if that's what you meant?

Thanks so much~
Heather

[desdamona]

Hi,

I don't think you are crazy. But then again, I think porn is not really a big deal. Men have been sculpting statues of naked women, making what is considered the best art in world that is focused on naked women. They used to look at nudist magazines, then they had Playboy and now the Internet. I just don't seem to feel threatened by it.

If you and husband were fine in every area and having sex like bunnies, would it bother you? Explain more why you think your blood pressure would go through the roof if husband looked at cute girl in tight clothes. You did. I bet you can remember everything she wore, the curve of her body, her hair etc. I bet she is gone from his mind.

It reminds of that old proverb about the two monks who had taken vows not to every have any sort of contact with women. They come to a stream and encounter a woman who cannot cross to the other side. One of the monks picks her up and carries her to the other side, puts her down and the two monks continue their walk. The second monks continues asking how the first one could have touched a woman, how he could have broken his vows, etc. This continued for miles. Finally the monk who had carried her said calmly, "But I put her down on the bank. You are still carrying her with you"

I am not saying your feelings of jealousy are wrong. I am just asking you to think about how much power you give these women you have not met over your life.

desdamona

[Jabez]

You mentioned that H had a possible addiction problem w/alcohol. Perhaps addiction is in his personality and that him viewing porno is also an addiction. I'm not saying that viewing porno is right, but if you think of it as an addiction instead of those women competing with you, does it help you to stop thinking about it so much?

I don't know how to break the porno habit if he doesn't want to. I know that there are blockers that can be installed, but that may just tick him off.

J

[heatherg]

If you and husband were fine in every area and having sex like bunnies, would it bother you?

Yes, it would still bother me. Every relationship sets boundaries about what is acceptable and what isn't, within the context of the R. Many would say that what I did, kissing another man, wasn't actually cheating. I know it was, b/c I know it wasn't at all acceptable in the context of our R. Here's another example for you. I've had a couple different vibrators over the course of our R, but at one point I wanted one that resembled a penis, H was uncomfortable with that. We've just never made comments out loud about people of the opposite sex, etc. I've always thought we had a very respectful R in that way.

I just don't seem to feel threatened by it

I understand that not all women wouldn't necessarily be threatened by pornography, but I don't think that's so much the point. For my M, the point should be that I have a problem with it. I think we could have gotten past what I did a long time ago. But again, that's not the point. The point in my M is, how my H feels about what I did. See what I'm saying? With my A, it doesn't matter how I feel, it's about how he feels. And if he expects me to fully respect that, then it has to work the same way on issues I have a problem with. At some point, it becomes more about putting the other person's feelings first than it is about the act itself.
I don't think I felt quite this threatened before I realized what a double standard H had and until I started snooping and realized how much he was actually hiding from me. Hiding indicates that you know you're doing something wrong. Not inherently wrong, b/c like you said, many wouldn't have a problem with it. But wrong b/c he knows how it makes his W feel.
I don't think I'd have a problem with an every now and then type thing. But the guy looks at this website just about every day I'd bet.

But I put her down on the bank.

I don't think he put her down on the bank if he's got pictures of her on his thumbdrive. What do you think?