When will H's indecision end?

[ValerieA]

My old thread (What happens now?) finally locked up on me.

D, thanks for your advice on that last post. So here's what happened: My friend ended up working last night, but I didn't tell H that. When I finally got back home from dropping the kids off around 7pm, H walked in about 10 minutes later. I was in the bedroom getting dressed to go out (by myself) then he comes in there too. H asked what I was doing. I said I'm going out. He asked where and with who. I said I'm going with so-and-so (both of which are SINGLE friends - he knows this - and, yes, I lied ) but I didn't know where they were taking me. H said, "Well, I don't think I'm going to Fresno tonight. Want to do something?" I still can't believe I actually did this, but I said, "No. I already made plans to go out with so-and-so. Sorry." H said after a looooong pause, "Well, will you call me to let me know where you're going when you find out?" Then I said (while putting on some Victoria's Secret body spray - he LOVES this stuff), " I don't know, I have to go. I'm running late!" He appeared to have a worried look on his face. Then he said in a mopey tone, "I hope you have fun. You deserve it. Call me if you want. I don't know, maybe I will just go to Fresno tonight. I have to pick up (co-worker) if we do end up going. You can call me on my cell, alright?" I said ok and told him to drive safely then left. I ended up just hanging out at another friend's place for several hours, had a couple drinks, and had fun! I never called H though. I guess I just didn't feel like it. About 2 hours after I left the house, my cell rings, I know it's got to be H, but I don't answer. In fact, I turned my phone off completely! I got home just before 1am. H and his co-worker had left earlier for Fresno. I know this because H left a message on the answering machine telling me about it and also saying he hopes I'm having fun, and he wishes I would call him since I wasn't answering my cell. I still didn't call him.

H just called about an hour ago and asked why I never called him back. I told him I got in pretty late, I was tired, so I just went to bed. H asked, "Well, what did you do?" I said, "We went out and had drinks and had fun!" H said, "Where did you go? And how come you didn't answer your phone?" I said, "You called? Huh...I never heard it ring." Then I quickly changed it to, "How's your morning going so far?" He tells me, and I listen. Then there's another long pause from him - I feel another R talk coming on. H said with a shaky voice, "You hate me, don't you?" I said, "No. Why would you think that?" H said, "Because I've ruined everything in your life....I don't know what to do. Whether I stay with you or leave, I know I'm going to hurt you either way. I feel like you're going to hate me no matter what happens. I just wish I knew what to do. I wish I could take back every bad thing I've ever done to you." I told him, "You've got so much going on in your mind, and it's got to be so confusing and stressful for you. I don't hate you, H. I never have and never will. If you decide to stay, the only way I'm going to be hurt is if you're here and you don't want to be here. If you leave, yeah, I'll be hurt, but I'll get through it and I'll be ok." H said, "I don't want to talk about this anymore." I said, "Ok, take it easy. I hope your day goes well." Then H said, "What are you doing tonight?" I told him I might go out again (this is true - my friend who had to work last night wants to do something tonight). Another long pause. H said, "If we can knock out these installs and I'm able to get one that's scheduled for tomorrow done today, and I can leave (co-worker) here to do the one by himself tomorrow, would you be willing to come and get me so we (H and I) can go out and do something tonight?" I said, "I don't know. Maybe." H said, "Well, let me get back to work, and I'll call you later to let you know what's up." Then we said goodbye.

I kind of wanted to tell him "no" since I already told him that I might be going out with my friend tonight, but I was afraid that if I did that, would that have been detaching too much? Turning H down two nights in a row? Hmmm...any thoughts please?

Thanks for listening.

[soccermom]

You are doing so awesome! I just don't think I'm brave enough to go out and do what you're doing. Your H doesn't sound quite so indecisive to me. Why would he even consider staying if he didn't want to work on the M? Forgive me if I'm confusing your sitch with someone elses....I read so many of them here. I'm obsessed. At least it's taken the obsession away from me checking H's cell phone! I don't even look at it anymore.

Hang in there! You're doing a great job! You've obviously got your H thinking!

[kml]

Quit pushing him away and go out with him TONITE!! And jump his bones while you are at it.

His biggest fear right now is that you will never forgive him and you can never be happy with him - so PLEASE show him how good it can be before you run him off!

Ellie

[ValerieA]

...His biggest fear right now is that you will never forgive him and you can never be happy with him...

Ok. Thank you, Ellie, but how can I "ease" this fear or make it go away? I have forgiven him, and I've told him that a few times already. I have told him that I love everything in our life together, but there is no happiness in it for me if he's not there. I told him during one R talk that he made all the right decisions but for all the wrong reasons. He made decisions to make me happy, but never himself. He always sacrificed himself for the sake of my happiness. So how do I sacrifice myself for his happiness? He doesn't even know what it will take for him to be happy. He says he never has known. It's always made him feel good to do for me. I want him to be happy, too, and I've told him that numerous times! I'm literally at the point of telling him to go so that he will be happy and free of having to worry about me and my happiness.

I'm not deliberately trying to push him away. I'm trying to GAL to be prepared if and when he does leave. There are times when I sense H's insecurity about me doing something without him, and he takes action to get me to change my plans, so then he gets his reassurance, but then backs off. When I've changed my plans to be with him instead of my friends, we could be sitting or laying together and when I initiate closeness, I usually get, "My stomach hurts", "I'm trying to get comfortable, please, and that's not helping", or "I'm really tired, ok? Good night." I think this is the selfishness he talks about. "She's going out?! Uh oh! Let me get her to stay with me. . . .Ok, good! She's here. I feel better. I'm not worried now." I initiate intimacy, and I get nothing! I need kissing, I need touching, I NEED SEX!!! When H initiates it, I am more than willing! Loooong ago, H used to complain that I wasn't giving him enough so I gave him much more as he asked. Now, I'm the one complaining! I've told him I want more, and he said I could have it whenever I want, but EVERYTIME I start it, I get turned down! I just don't understand it. Is it because of the guilt? Sex has always been so hot for us. We enjoy it immensely! Even after the A, it has still been thrilling. But I want more, and I'm not getting it.

I already know that if H wants to go out tonight, I will go with him. If he can't, then I may still want to go out with my friend and he will know this because I'll tell him. I know he doesn't want me to go out without him. So what am I supposed to do? Stay home so he can be reassured again and continue to have me on hold? Or go out and possibly push him further away even though that is not my intent?

[ValerieA]

Just another thought: Could this possibly be a MLC? H is only 30, but I read in DR that it can happen at any age. H has lost a lot of weight this past year, he's obsessed with working out, and buying new things for himself (clothes, etc). He has bought numerous cars in the past couple of years - not new, but used "eye-catching" cars. He would buy one, use it until he got tired of it, then sell it to go buy a different one. He's been talking for the past year about wanting to get a motorcycle. I even told him to do those things if that's what he wanted. And just to add to all of this, he told me that I pretty much decided his life for him! I'm assuming this has to do with my decision in having our 1st S. He loves the kids, we both know that. But, seriously, could this be a MLC?

[ValerieA]

Another indecisive night, and not to mention a bad one. I know I'm supposed to be patient, very patient, with H, but I can't get over how unbelievably difficult this is! So about last night:

H called later in the afternoon to let me know he wasn't going to get the installs done early enough to be able to go out with me. I said that was alright. H asked if I wanted him to call me later, and I said if he wanted to, that would be fine.

H called my cell around 7pm and asked what I was doing. I told him that I was leaving the mall to go home. "What were you doing at the mall?" I told him I was shopping for some new clothes and CDs. "What are you going to do now?" I said that I was going home to eat then get ready to go out with my friend. "Well, where are you going?" I told him I didn't know, that my friend knows places to go better than I do. H said, "Well, if she takes you to a club, are you going to dance?" I said, "Yeah, probably. I haven't danced in sooo long." H asked in a pissy tone, "If some guy asks you to dance, are you going to dance with him?" I was not prepared for this question. Dancing with another man was the furthest thing from my mind. I should have just said "no", but for some unknown reason, I said, "Probably not." Things went downhill from there. H snapped back, "Probably not?!!! What the hell does that mean?!! You WANT to dance with someone else? Fine. Go ahead. That's what I f***ing deserve. I hope you have a real good time." I said, "No! I am not going to dance with anyone! That's not what I want! I just want to get out and have a decent time. It's better than being home all alone with nothing to do. Why do you have to be so damn nasty? Why do you have to assume the worst when I want to go out with someone other than you?" H said, "Because I picture all these guys hitting on you, and I can't stand it. The thought of you being with another guy f***ing kills me! But I feel like that's what I deserve. So you know what? I want you to go out, and I hope every m'f'er there hits on you!" I was so angry at this point, I didn't know what else to say. I told him, "You know what I want? I want you to decide what you want to do. Do you want to stay together and work on this M or do you want to leave? It's been 2 months of not knowing where to go from here. Am I supposed to be happy because you're still home? Or am I supposed to prepare for when you leave? I don't know how to move on because everything changes from one day to the next. It's like we take 2 steps forward, but 4 steps back again and again!" Then H angrily shouts, "Well, you know what then?! When I get back tomorrow (which is today), I'm leaving!". . . . .I said, "Ok." H said, "There! You wanted a decision, and you got it." I said, "Ok." Then after a moment of silence, he said, "Me and (co-worker) are going to get something to eat now, so can I call you later?" I said, "If you want to." H said, "Do you want me to?" I said, "Stop worrying about what I want! Do what you want please!" Then we said bye.

I was very disappointed in myself at that moment. I was thinking to myself, "Great. You really screwed up now, JV. He's leaving." But to my surprise, no tears. Not one. I went home and at that point, I didn't feel like going out anymore. So I just stayed home and wrote in my journal about the day's unfortunate events. I shed a few tears, but no sobbing. I don't know. I guess I'm just tired of this. I guess I just don't have the patience it takes to DB.

The phone rang around 10:30pm last night. I thought it might be my friend or maybe even my parents if something was wrong with one of the boys, but it was H. Didn't think he would call after what happened. H asked why I was home. I told him I wasn't up to going out after all. We talked for a few minutes. He was telling me about some funny incident where they ate. Then he asked how the kids were. I said they were fine and reminded him about them being with my parents. Another "I don't know why I said this", but I did. I said, "You need to talk to the boys, and you should do it before you leave. Don't ask me because I'm not going to do it for you." Then H said, "What do you mean? So, what? I'm leaving now?" I told him, "Did you not tell me just a couple of hours ago that you were leaving when you got back?!" H said, "Yes, but I didn't mean it. We were fighting, and I was mad. . . . I'll be home in the afternoon, so can we talk more then?" I said fine. Before saying goodbye, H said, "I'm sorry, JV. ILY." I just said ok then hung up.

I am so tired and confused with all of this. I just don't know what to make of H anymore. I keep trying to not have any expectations from H. I'm beginning to feel very empty.

[SherryL]

Hang in there Jv.

I know how you feel. My ultimatum (even though I haven't received an answer YET) wasn't as hard as I thought. I just want to see some progress whether it is with my M or me moving on. This same old same old is driving me crazy.

Really decide what you want. You have what most of us want. A H who says ILY and sometimes wants work on your M.

I know this is hard. But think long and hard about this. I have made my choice for my reasons. If my H leaves(and I think he will) I know it will be hard and lonely. But there are things I will not miss at this point. Living with certain things (anger, mood swings, no affection, no love) for 4 months takes it toll and I am ready to move on.
I am hoping my H feels that in me.

I understand your feelings about being empty. That is part of why I made my decision. I honestly do know what I feel at this point. I, too, am empty and don't think I have much more to give. This whole process is draining.

But, please, think about what you want. Your H is trying to come to terms with what he did. He needs time.

Sherry

[dodgermf]

I was in the bedroom getting dressed to go out (by myself) then he comes in there too. H asked what I was doing. I said I'm going out. He asked where and with who. I said I'm going with so-and-so (both of which are SINGLE friends - he knows this - and, yes, I lied ) but I didn't know where they were taking me. H said, "Well, I don't think I'm going to Fresno tonight. Want to do something?" I still can't believe I actually did this, but I said, "No. I already made plans to go out with so-and-so. Sorry." H said after a looooong pause, "Well, will you call me to let me know where you're going when you find out?" Then I said (while putting on some Victoria's Secret body spray - he LOVES this stuff), " I don't know, I have to go. I'm running late!" He appeared to have a worried look on his face. Then he said in a mopey tone, "I hope you have fun. You deserve it. Call me if you want.

JV, JV, JV,

Like the MasterCard commercial says, "That is priceless!!" Judging from your last few posts, it seems like he is spiraling. I couldn't tell you which way I think he's going to fall. I have no idea. However, you stick to your guns. I think you continue to focus on you and what's right for you. Of course this is advice coming from a guy who blew up (in a big R talk) at the W on the phone 4 days ago and hasn't spoken to her since, but I digress.

I'll be keeping an eye on you...hang tough!

D.

[ValerieA]

Thanks for the understanding and support.

Sherry, you're so right about this being very draining. I'm so ready to move on, but H won't let me. Again, you're right about him needing to come to terms with what he's done. I feel like he wants or thinks he deserves to be hurt worse compared to how I was hurt by the A. Maybe I should give him a good 2x4 whack. Will that help? Just kidding!

D, I'm trying to stick to my guns, too, even though it's hard. Trying to hang tough!

It's just after 4pm here. H isn't home yet but should be soon. I went to out to lunch with my parents, my stepdad's parents, and the kids. We had a nice time. When getting in my truck after we ate, my cell begins ringing and I notice 3 missed calls. I answer it and it's H in a panic. He said he's been calling me and everyone else for the past hour and a half looking for me. He was scared because he couldn't get a hold of anyone and didn't know what was going on. After telling him we were all ok and having lunch, he calmed down. He told me he was finishing up work and would be home by early evening. I said ok, I'd see him then. When I got home, there were 5 messages from him when he was going crazy looking for me.

I know he's going to want another R talk when he gets here. I'm not really in the mood for another one, but I will listen to him. From our last convo last night, I feel like he's going to tell me he wants to stay together, AGAIN, but in a few more days, he'll have uncertainties, AGAIN. Either way, I'll do my best to appear "chipper".

Thanks for listening.

[ValerieA]

H got home several hours ago. No R talks when he got here either but I believe that's because the kids were around. I just greeted him home with a friendly smile and hello. H has hugged and kissed me several times over the past few hours. He initiated all of it. I wasn't sure how to feel about all that, but I matched his intensity. H would talk to me and act as if everything was fine and dandy. I was fine with that.

I put the kids to bed around 8:30pm then go into the living room. H grabs my hand and leads me to the bedroom. (A little background here: In the past, whenever we got into an argument, H would always initiate sex. Why? I don't know.) Just as I thought, he initiates it.....Ellie, I know what your thinking! "Jump his bones! He wants you!".....but I stopped him and said not now. H looked at me like he was shocked. Hey, I have to admit that I was pretty shocked myself! I can't remember the last time that I wasn't in the mood! H said, "What?!...You don't want me anymore?" I told him that I do want him. I always want him, but I couldn't help but feel like he was trying to do a "quick fix". H said he was sorry, that wasn't his intention (hard to believe though when I look at the past). He said he just wanted to make me feel good. We just talked a little then his co-worker called and said he needed help with a service call he was working on in Sacramento. H tried talking him through it, but the guy just wasn't getting it I guess. So H is in Sac right now and will be home in about an hour and a half or so.

I feel like asking H if he's staying or going (especially after last night's convo), but I know that's just more pressure he doesn't need. Things are pleasant right now. I like it this way. I'm just not sure how long it will remain like this.

As always, thanks for listening.