Well, that experiment did not work at all...no response whatsoever from my letter to date. The message I keep getting from her appears to be "I will communicate if there is money involved coming to me, otherwise I could care less."
I am off for a 10 day vacation with my sons...I will try to not even think about her and just have fun with my family.
1) Review the last phone call and try to make notes as to why she hung up on you. Was there anything there that can be altered, 180'd, improved? Was there a mention of your needs, any resentful tone, etc...? In otherwords, you might plan thoroughly for the next contact with her to be truly acting 'As-If' she loves you, is interested in you, and you are happy as a lark.
2) I'd strongly consider going to a different church/service to do a better job of going dark, adding mystery, and perhaps pulling her to you. I get the picture of her having too much power, strolling into church only to ignore you and the boys. Add some pop to the sitch by not being there, having her look for you, maybe even calling to see what's up. This may help the boys as well. My S5 and I started attending Sat or Sun evening Mass instead of our traditional Sun am one that we attended as a family 'cause W switched to a couple other religions/churches immediately, and S5 was mourning her absence during our time to worship. I found more kid-friendly services and we created a new 'tradition' of prayer for he and I. We still mention W, pray for her, but the empty space beside us is not as striking as it once was. We (meaning S5 and I) feel stronger again as a unit.
Thanks for the advice Gabriel. I know exactly why she hung up on me. I was trying to do her a favor, but I am sure she didn't see it that way. I gave her notice that I would have to take her off my auto insurance policy since she had filed for divorce and started the time clock with the courts by having the case activated by serving me through certified mail. I could no longer accept her liability on my policy in that instance. I notified her in writing and gave her 10 days from receipt of the notice to get her own insurance. At 3:30 PM the afternoon of the 10th day, she called and left a VM saying if I could wait another 4 days, she would appreciate it. She had my home and cell phone numbers, but chose to leave the message at my work phone. I got the message the next day...and it was too late. I was calling her to make sure she knew she had no car insurance with me...she was angry...and irresponsible. Not my fault.
Anyhow, with respect to church...I think with summer visitation, I can do an even better job of going dark there, but I have seen her once in the last 3 months...that is all. I don't know where she is emotionally, or otherwise and am beginning to give up hope. Her immaturity with respect to her handling her issues and quitting our marriage in an attempt to simplify her life is not something I see changing as demonstrated by her behaviour, i.e., no communication unless it involves $$ coming to her, her lack of sensitivity towards my sons where she insists on invading their space in Sunday School and other things. She is a very slow and deliberate processor on most things, but our divorce was a real quick decision for her...I am not sure when she decided, but she told me 2 weeks after we had our last argument that she was leaving and filed 5 weeks later. She made it a point to tell me she was not considering reconciliation. I just have to leave her alone and let her miss me. Whether she will ever miss me enough is another question. I spoiled the daylights out of her and I guess that was not that important to her or she would miss it more already. I just don't get her statement "The reason we are not getting back together again is because you don't love my kids enough. It is my issue and I am not willing to do anything about it."
Quote: I just don't get her statement "The reason we are not getting back together again is because you don't love my kids enough. It is my issue and I am not willing to do anything about it."
Sorry for your sitch JohnDad. The step-kid issue is extremely difficult. Truth be told, I think it's the reason that I'm divorced and might not ever be together again. In contrast to you though my ex-W likes to hang out with me. We both have kids and I think the step thing came between us. It is my belief that she thinks it would come between us again if we remarried. It sounds like your ex just chose to hold on to the anger and let it fester and keep you at arms length.
Okay...I usually am optimistic, but your sitch doesn't have the slightest ray of hope to it. At least not how it stands now. It sounds like you have been rebuffed the few times you have tried. But are you absolutely sure that you aren't doing a whole lot of imagining what your ex is thinking and feeling. You've assumed she doesn't miss you at all...maybe she does but refuses to be weak. Who knows? It's just speculation.
So is it possible to poke your head out of the dark and see what's up? Ask how her kids are doing? Can you just call her and try to chit-chat a bit. I mean for no reason at all. As far as I can tell it can't make things any worse. The silence is deafening.
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
"doesn't have the slightest ray of hope" is just not true I still have some hope albeit weakening by the day. I do agree with you that she is showing me nothing. I know she misses me and she wrote back at the end of January that she "misses most the good things between us" but now she won't even write. Why that is I am just not sure. Maybe to make sure she doesn't encourage me to be hopeful? She is very stubborn...in fact, I think it is her stubborn nature that drove her to divorce me because the issue of her 21 year old daughter's disrespect towards me came up a bunch of times and in her responses to me, it was all my issue. It is pretty stubborn to take a position like that when I was trying to resolve a situation and make it better for all concerned. My wife insisted on having it her way or divorce...she never told me that, never declared the boundary or an ultimatum...she just got angrier and angrier and then left me and my sons (whom she claimed to love so very much, but not treats kind of crappy). I don't know what she thinks about. I know she wants nothing to do with me...either because she hates me or because it hurts her too much with the guilt of leaving me...take your choice. Wes, out of a total of 6 kids in the same house, the only one that was a problem was my xw's daughter...and she is the favorite of her mother and is over-indulged to the point you would not believe...even at the age of 21 years now.
I am going to own this board soon. My name is everywhere. I guess I'm having a slow day at work. Can you tell?
Okay...so we know the problem. But we aren't looking for solutions. I have a feeling that after all this time that she isn't going to come crawling because you have gone dark. That simply is just not working. If you want this woman back (do you under her terms?) you need a different approach.
I don't want you to get in a sitch where she has to say "yeah I miss some of the good times" or where she tells you how bad you were to her spoiled daughter. That's R talk. I'm suggesting putting out feelers to see if it is possible to start working towards friendship. Just call her and say "Hi. Just wanted to see how you are? How are the kids?" If she hangs up on you, uses profanities, vulgarities, and obscenities, or threatens to have a restraining order block you from ever calling again then I guess you have your answer. But what if she chats with you? Can't you at least make up an excuse to call?
I don't know enough about your sitch to know if she hates you. It sounds like you don't know either. So what will it hurt to test the water a bit. Let her know you still exist.
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
Wes, I understand exactly what you are saying. To tell you the truth, I am scared of her...scared of getting a direct rejection from her. Probably I am scared of reality. I will work my way up to it I guess when I decide that feeling that particular pain of rejection is worth the release and moving on with my life. What I don't understand is why she won't even bother to write me to tell to go to hell. I told her in the letter I sent about a month ago that if she ever changed her mind about working on our R, I wanted to hear from her. The ball is sort of in her court. No reply to that letter, but she sure cashed the check! I think she might just still be a little bit angry. Her way of dealing with tough things is denial...don't think about it, it will all go away in good time. Of course, that is really a bunch of poppycock and partially why our M went down the tubes.
Quote: I told her in the letter I sent about a month ago that if she ever changed her mind about working on our R, I wanted to hear from her.
Dude, that was your first mistake. When you make comments like this to her, she thinks of the old R and everything that was icky to her about it.
You have to start from scratch and build a new R. Repeat after me.... NO R TALK! NO R TALK! NO R TALK!!!
Quote: I think she might just still be a little bit angry. Her way of dealing with tough things is denial...don't think about it, it will all go away in good time. Of course, that is really a bunch of poppycock and partially why our M went down the tubes.
I think you are more than just a little bit angry still too. This is a pretty negative comment about her, honey.
One of the things I've learned through DRing is that a lot of it is taking negatives and turning them around into positives.
Sooooooooooooooo, dude, what are you doing that's positive these days??? Huh???
Quote: What I don't understand is why she won't even bother to write me to tell to go to hell. I told her in the letter I sent about a month ago that if she ever changed her mind about working on our R, I wanted to hear from her. The ball is sort of in her court.
And this is what I mean. A letter saying if you want to work on us? You might as well have just sent a letter entitled "ultimate pressure". She might be angry or then again she might not want to respond because she percieves that all you want is her back and to talk ad nauseum about the R.
I know you are scared. Especially of the rejection. I can sympathize. JohnDad, I pursue more than most people. You know what? Every time I initiate something with my ex I'm worried I'll be rejected. The first times she was less receptive than she is now. In fact I have been rejected a number of times. It's a test to see if despite the setback whether I can start over again with just sounding friendly. I think what you need is just to try to wedge your foot in the door for starters. The interaction doesn't have to be great...it just hopefully won't be angry and bitter.
My suggestion (and yes...I'm advocating initiating contact) is to call her. Get you nerve up and do it. Say "I ran into so and so today.....or I ran across an old bill for whatever....or I was reminded of you today...and I just wanted to call and see how you and the kids are doing. Hope everything is okay." See how it goes. You'll know if it's not going good so just get off quickly with a "it was nice hearing from you again...have a nice night....bye" And get off the phone first. I dare you. Just do it and post how it went. I'm scared too. Scared that you are going to be dark up until the time she's married someone else.
I'm pretty pushy aren't I. Actually I'm indefatigable.
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
Quote: My suggestion (and yes...I'm advocating initiating contact) is to call her. Get you nerve up and do it. Say "I ran into so and so today.....or I ran across an old bill for whatever....or I was reminded of you today...and I just wanted to call and see how you and the kids are doing. Hope everything is okay." See how it goes. You'll know if it's not going good so just get off quickly with a "it was nice hearing from you again...have a nice night....bye" And get off the phone first. I dare you. Just do it and post how it went. I'm scared too. Scared that you are going to be dark up until the time she's married someone else.
I still have some hope albeit weakening by the day. I do agree with you that she is showing me nothing. I know she misses me and she wrote back at the end of January that she "misses most the good things between us" but now she won't even write. Why that is I am just not sure. Maybe to make sure she doesn't encourage me to be hopeful? She is very stubborn...in fact, I think it is her stubborn nature that drove her to divorce me because the issue of her 21 year old daughter's disrespect towards me came up a bunch of times and in her responses to me, it was all my issue. It is pretty stubborn to take a position like that when I was trying to resolve a situation and make it better for all concerned. My wife insisted on having it her way or divorce...she never told me that, never declared the boundary or an ultimatum...she just got angrier and angrier and then left me and my sons (whom she claimed to love so very much, but not treats kind of crappy). I don't know what she thinks about. I know she wants nothing to do with me...either because she hates me or because it hurts her too much with the guilt of leaving me...take your choice. Wes, out of a total of 6 kids in the same house, the only one that was a problem was my xw's daughter...and she is the favorite of her mother and is over-indulged to the point you would not believe...even at the age of 21 years now. 
