For continuity, here's my last entry into the annals of B movies:
well, guys, I’m sitting up, if not totally ambulatory. I was flat on my back for four days, and for the last two I’ve been up enough to cause irreparable damage to my R. Thanks for your concern while I was “out flat.” Thanks also to GBO for posting about my sorry state.
I’m not really supposed to be at the computer, but this is just too good a story to let sit. Get out the popcorn, folks. This is what’s known as a “horror comedy” in the biz.
S. and I had a huge fight this afternoon that culminated in his yelling, “I don’t want to talk about this anymore because I don’t want to see you anymore, and I don’t want to go to f*ing Chile with you!” Whereupon I picked up a stack of papers (killer papers, mind you, really dangerous papers), and hurled them at him, and through gritted teeth spat, “GET OUT.” I then hurled his coat and scarf down the stairs. Whoo! Are we having fun yet, folks?
There was some posturing, because I think neither of us really meant it, and he dawdled around, taking an inordinate amount of time getting his coat on, all the while yelling why he was in the right (I mean, if he really meant he wanted to break up, would he care to stay on after and explain why?), and I, in true GET OUT, I REALLY MEAN IT fashion, started to make a pot of coffee. Of course, I was making that pot of coffee with the utmost conviction. Oh, boy, did I mean it. The kitty was so confused he puffed up his tail and ran under the table.
After a bout of posturing and yelling back and forth, him taking long minutes to zip his zipper and me holding the coffeepot, it escalated again and he stormed out.
What caused such a row? Well. Let me see. Miss Switzerland 2003-2004, it seems, sent S. a postcard while we were away, saying happy new year. Since we had such a tumultuous new year, S. thought it best to hide the postcard and not tell me about it right away, violating our agreement that he would tell me about any correspondence when it happened (and NOT when HE thought it best to tell me).
Through the holidays, I had expressed my anxiety that she would try to contact him (after all, the last time they talked he neither told her we were back together nor ended their “friendship,” leaving it just hanging there). He never said anything. Granted, there has been no contact since September, but it wasn’t because they’d agreed not to speak.
So, he told me today (because I broke down and asked him) that when we arrived from Ga. there was the postcard, and that he felt he needed to write her a letter, and he wanted to do it before we left (a week from tomorrow), and he felt a tremendous amount of guilt at having “just stopped talked to her, and it was no way to treat a friend,” and he felt he needed to write at least a short note or postcard before we left.
I asked if he’d planned to discuss any of this with me, and he started to get really angry and that’s when the escalation started, about how he “was trying to focus on OUR relationship,” and how he had spent an “enormous amount of time trying to work out OUR issues,” and how he didn’t see when he could have brought it up. On and on, back and forth, “We had an agreement,” “It was a one-sided agreement,” “This is what makes me not trust you,” “Everything I do is wrong,” etc etc etc…
Now I haven’t even told you about the crap that’s gone on during my out-flattedness. It’s been a real trial, with him nurturing me on his terms and at his convenience, and hardly even then. But that’s just a side story, secondary characters in this drama. And to think, this morning we’d actually agreed to go to therapy! Now I’m wondering if I’m going to Chile alone.
Th-th-th-that’s all, folks!
Of course, I’m being flippant because my heart is still pounding from the fight and I haven’t had a chance to let it sink in. Later, I’m sure I’ll be back on the boards, lamenting, tearing hair, and crying my eyes out. What’s so weird is, he said it, but I don’t believe it. Why? He may very well believe it. He may very well be packing my things into a bag and setting it beside the door. He may be calling Swiss Miss right now, saying how sorry he is and that can they give it another go.
All I can say is, at least for now, I have to laugh. Are you with me, SD?
I'm so glad you're upright and I'm so sorry about the drama. You do seem relatively calm despite your pounding heart. I look forward to more insights from you into the whole thing and I'm sure you'll be getting the wisest advice.
(((((Jennifer))))))
Wendy
Me: 51 H: 52 T: 23 yrs M: 19 yrs S18, D16, S14 (special needs) PA: 2003/2004 Piecing: 2004 on Suspect H had EA: 8/2012-12/2012
Quote: All I can say is, at least for now, I have to laugh.
I know the time to laugh will end, but at least you were able to laugh. It's too much pressure to see every up and down on the rollercoaster as life or death. I'm not sharing anything profound or uplifting, but I do think it's a good thing you were able to laugh, despite all that you wrote and all the rest of the crap you didn't describe here.
I hope you're better than "totally ambulatory" RSN.
K
My sitch More importantly, Light A Million Candles
It sounds like your H really wants thing to work out between you. I know it seems futile, but stay at it - your H wants things to work out - I feel this. He doesn't know how to take care of you, but he wants to.
Thank you Wendy, Koshka, Christian, Nevanna, and welcome, Caesar!
Oof! What a day. Right after I posted, S. let himself in and appeared on the landing outside my study, hovering in the shadows, asking if I had a moment. I said "of course," and we went into my room. He stood there for a moment, us looking at each other, and he gave a slight laugh, and then we both cracked up. Not rolling on the floor, mind you, but I had the giggles bigtime. They were nervous giggles, for sure, but I was also getting a good laugh in at my own expense.
I asked him if he was covered in paper cuts, which sent us again into laughter. He said he came over to apologize, and I said I was sorry too, and we talked for a minute about that was no way to be, after all the talking we'd done all day, and he asked me if I changed my reservation for Chile already (huh? I guess he thought I had because I was sitting at the computer), and I laughed and said "No, I'm going to Chile, with or without you," and he said "My sentiments exactly," and I said, "And if I have to sit next to you on the plane? I have a new iPod!" which was his big Christmas gift to me this year, and so that got a big smile, too.
Whew. So I went out on a limb and said "Would you be interested in going to see a therapist before we go?" and before I even got it out of my mouth he said "Yes," and we talked about logistics (he wants to go to this woman he saw twice years ago, and after asking him how he felt about having been there with someone else, and his saying it wouldn't be an issue, we agreed that he would call her, and that I would ask my T for a rec as a backup). I said we should just see it as one session, and leave it at that, and revisit the therapy issue when we get back (I was trying to make it seem less threatening to him, although he seemed totally into it, actually).
So he wondered aloud how much a 50-minute session would actually do for us, and I suggested we go for two hours, and he immediately agreed, and so there you go.
He then asked if we should still get together tomorrow night as planned to talk about our trip, and I said, "I think we should plan this trip," and he said "I think so, too," and we agreed on a time, and we hugged, and he left.
I'm still reeling over the reaction he had over corresponding with OW. It sounded so much like where we were last year, with my freaking out and his stonewalling. Ugh. And he JUST read Shirley Glass's interview I sent him about infidelity and he STILL wants to write her, because just not talking to her "is no way to treat a friend?"
I want to ask him to see the letter before he sends it, but I'm not sure of myself. Any ideas? I'm definitely going to bring it up in counseling. I will probably try to see my own T before we go, if possible.
I was telling H2H on the phone last night (thanks, H2H, for being there for me so late at night!) that this is an issue I will leave him over, that if he starts up with OW again I will make it clear that I will leave. But how to take a stand when he is reverting back to old behaviors with her (or so it would seem)? I know one postcard does not an EA make, but it's dangerous territory, and I knew at some point there would be some communication, sice it was left dangling. So why did *I* know she would contact him at the holidays, and according to him, the postcard was "out of the blue"?
I'm glad to hear that you're feeling much better and that your update yesterday has a much more promising outcome. Also glad that S has agreed to get into some C with you before the fact.
No whacks intended, but I think you're getting it now that jealousy is really tearing at the 2 of you and is most unnecessary and hurtful. That little monster appears when we are feeling very insecure and out of control.
It doesn't go away without some really tough self work... so good for you for recognizing that it needs to be addressed now.
Jennifer, I'm about to turn 43... which doesn't give me the license to say that I know more than anyone else. But somewhere between the ages of 38 and 40, some weird stuff happens. My friends and I have the tendency to wax nostalgia and to delve deep into the past to see where we achieved something, where we failed and what we could have/should have done differently.
I have to tell you that my 20 year high school reunion really set the stage for this for many, many of my friends who are the same age. I figured that this was the appetizer for some to have a full blown MLC--because some of the males in my age group were a little too fond of the past and less enthusiastic about their present.
Anyhoo, this also resulted in my contacting some people in my past to get some answers. One turned into OM (EA and nearly PA) and the other was my guy before Mr. W.--whose R with me was passionate and emotionally charged. We had not seen each other since I moved to CO and had lost written touch a few years afterward. (Our communications were awkward, and I got the answer why later on.)
A year before I turned 40, I got a phone call from him out of the blue. Turns out, he was doing the same thing I was doing (and the rest of our peers). Note: I was with him but breaking up with him when Mr. W. catapulted into my life. He was VERY jealous of WBMM (ha GBO, I get to counter this!) but told me that he would prefer to trust me than to mistrust me. Turns out, that unconditional level of trust was what really attracted me to Mr. W.
My 40th birthday, we headed back to SFO to celebrate. WBMM had asked if he could meet all of us for dinner. Mr. W. agreed--he said he felt that I deserved some closure on a R that was never truly closed. To say I was stunned was a gross understatement.
What I'm trying to say in a very long winded fashion is that people are going to pop up into your life and the life of S over your lifetime. Some will be people who have had more intimate Rs with each one of you.
You can choose to see this person not as a threat, but as a healing opportunity to draw you two closer. You can choose to instill trust by extending it carte blanche and accepting his word as the gospel truth. The more you give to this process, the less fear you're going to have.
And the contrary is also true: the more you feed that monster, the more he's going to steal from you and S.
Swiss miss is only as important to you as a couple as you make her. It really and truly sounds as though S doesn't feel as passionate about her as you do.
So by letting him write to her and closing that chapter, you're less likely to feel that she is going to come catapulting back into your married life in the capacity that you've labeled her.
Capisce?
My two cents? Allow him to close this loop in the capacity he feels necessary to do the right thing as a human. After all, you want to marry this guy, right? There is nothing MORE attractive about a prospective partner than seeing them as kind hearted and one who is willing to consider how others feel. (Yes, that includes you...)
Now, I'll leave you with a big bite to chew on: What does Swiss miss have that you don't? I am pretty sure the answer is nothing. But if there is something, you have the intelligence, knowledge, skills and wherewithal to take care of your little green monster once and for all.
Hugs to you! (But not ones that will injure your poor neck... )
Betsey
p.s. Don't ask to see the letter. It's not a trust building question...
Last edited by Underdog; 01/18/0502:37 PM.
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
I really do know that I have to get rid of my insecurities surrounding Swiss Miss (and insecurities in general). But I do disagree somewhat with what you say as it applies to her popping up in our lives.
Most experts on infidelity say the A partner SHOULD share any correspondence with the OP, and I’m hoping the T will say that to him. I can agree not to freak out if he can just be open about this, and at least share his intentions about where he expects this "friendship" to go, and NOT share with her anything bad about our R.
Shirley Glass talks about this, NOT sharing the sad details of your R with the OP – it sends a signal that he MAY be available, and in our case he did it over and over, making it much easier for her to slither closer to him as our problems grew. I know I have to get rid of the monster, but just writing this one off as a “random person cropping up in our lives” doesn’t work for me – it’s only been 4 months since they spoke, and he wasn't even able to tell her we were back together!
As SD put it on my thread many moons ago, there's a difference between old boyfriends and girlfriends whose Rs with S. and I ended on appropriate terms. Case in point, one of my ex-BFs is one of my best friends today, and S. and I visited him and his fiance in Miami last year. The two of them (S. and my ex) hit it off like old war buddies! But Swiss Miss is someone who has actively disrespected our R, and any correspondence from S. is reinforcing that it's OK to do that.
I'd love to hear other thoughts on this, as I'm sure they are widely varied in opinion. As always, Betsey, I'm really listening to you.
All of the upset, my H is feeling "weird" as wel. Go figure.
Betsey