Hello to all I guess I'll just dive in head-first as I usually do. I am a HDH37 with a VERY LDW38. It started out near 20y ago with seemingly matched drives. After 5Y and 2nd child (S18,D14,D10) our freq. dropped to about once a month. By 8 or 9y it was bi-annual(I still remember the nite my D10 was made). By 14Y it was annual or so. Since 16y it has only been once and was give on my part only, that was 2Y ago(We were going to try to get into a schedule but she opted out) . She is a wonderful woman otherwise and I do think our attachment is love. We have been on a rollercoaster for many years and I am nearing my time to get off the ride. She is reading the SSM book but has already stated it is just another ploy of mine to get her to ML. We have been openly disscussing our situ for about 6Y which has kept up my hopes of our mutual happiness although the past year she is sick of talking about the "S" word. I guess my question is it worth investing more unfulfilled time waiting for her to come around,
I sure you'll need more info so ask away and I'll reply.
PS The situation with SEVENS reminds me of my own, he should ask his W if her interests might be for her own gender. I asked my W and she wasn't sure at first but decided she is straight.
ARealLongTime, welcome to the rollercoaster ride. Sorry you are in a situation like many of us here. The good part is you came to the right place.
ARealLongTime asked {{I guess my question is it worth investing more unfulfilled time waiting for her to come around,}} ARealLongTime if you wait it will never happen. My question is what is your life like now if you factor out what you do for or with your W? The reason is, sometimes the H does too little or too much with the W. The key is sometimes our lives get out of balance. Read these next 2 books to see why this might be true in your case.
Please read "Divorce Remedy" and maybe "The Five Love Languages", Gary Chapman.
{{She is reading the SSM book but has already stated it is just another ploy of mine to get her to ML}} My W says the same thing. Her reply is usually that some men and women just write books to convince women to have sex, include trumped up medical clains that having sex is good for your mental or physical health. To my W, sex is why women have mental or physical problems. Of course this is the opposite of what she used to say when her motherhood clock was ticking and she wanteds babies.
Ask your W to name 3 things that might cause her anxiety if you had sex once a week. Do not accept any non concrete answers like I do not feel like doing it" Good answers that you could do something about are what you need. Are either one of you two fixed so there will not be anymore babies?
There was a HDW that told her LDH (no ED problems for H, just no interest in ML) she was either going to have sex with him 2X a week or she was joining a civic organization that met 2X a week. It's called getting a life of your own with out your sopuse.
In my opinion, there are too many so called experts that say a person does not have to do what they do not want to do and the other spouse should respect their wishes, like I am not interested in sex and you have to accept that. To me this is one of the roots of the problem.
There are lots of good people here. Keep reading. Work is calling me.
Thank you for your replies which I'll comment on first ------------------------------------------------------ Ask your W to name 3 things that might cause her anxiety if you had sex once a week. Do not accept any non concrete answers like I do not feel like doing it" Good answers that you could do something about are what you need. ----------------------------------------------------------- In concept such simple questions are wonderful. Unfortunately, if the only statements that can be retrieved before her shift into pissed mode are like "I just don't need it" or "I only want to cuddle" sometimes even the occasional "If you need it that much go get it from someone else, just don't come back". I have learned to prod no further to avoid getting my feelings bashed in further or have "pissed mode" held for days.
---------------------------------------------------------- Tell her it's not a ploy to get her to ML; it's an attempt to save a failing marriage. ---------------------------------------------------------- I did say that very thing. I know her well enough to say it is a ploy of her own to avoid blame when she doesn't change. She can quote herself on her view of the book when she decides not to finish reading it.
Now to state I had a great day. Too bad it was unhealthy for my R. A MLF from work (talk every day M-F, close F 3y+) woke us first thing this morning. She needed some emergency repairs at her house( she is one of 10 or so I do stuff for). I got up and SSS, then offered to have W come along at LF's request(all 3 of us knew she would'nt) and left. I made the repairs and then enjoyed some air hockey with her her kids, and her friend.(yes LF is high potential for EA/PA, W knows it, hates it, resents it but still remains the same. Wow!) and I knew when I got home that the W would have retreated to our room for quiet time while I was gone. We of course had the "you know it hurts me when you ignore housework to do other peoples stuff, especially hers" which I then was obliged to the "it's OK for you to slave me out to your friends but not for mine". I then of course asked if she had read anymore to which she gave the expected "I'm not going to bother since the M won't work anyway". These exchanges used to push her right to POM but now they are like "please pass the salt" I wonder I she gets the same wierd satisfaction of being able to say to yourself you knew it would happen. Even if. you were the catalyst.
Well I am going to continue reading and research on R but after having the same verbal meals day/day mo/mo ect... I think its WAH time again. It got us to MC last time about 7y ago(most boring 3m of my life). The last series of MC did not end well so I think I will suggest separate C to start. I know I will have to file for separation to push this to fruition on a reasonable timetable.
The only person I worry about is D10. D14 was crushed when I did this the last time although nothing was filed then. D10 is well aware of Mom/Dad problems and her and I have discussed them again this year. It amazes you when a young person says "well at least you two won't be able to fight that way". I hope my feelings for the R can survive the experience this time. I wonder if I'm saying this just to get my foot out the door with no intention of return, I know its a tempting option, expensive but tempting.
It sounds to me that the only thing you have not tried is setting some firm boundaries. It sounds like you did so about seven years ago, but failed to maintain your line in the sand.
Read the post I made on the 'a unique ssm' thread to Steeler15... I think it applies to you as well.
I think you should go and find a counselor right now, do not wait for your wife. Find one that will help YOU. I'm sure you understand that the only way you can change your relationship is by changing yourself. Find a good, REALLY, REALLY good shrink who can help you get rock solid with yourself. This, more than anything, will help your R (and if it doesn't, then you have at least saved yourself.)
Thank you Corri you wrote: ____________________________________________________________ Read the post I made on the 'a unique ssm' thread to Steeler15... I think it applies to you as well. ____________________________________________________________
I did read your post and it and other similar thoughts were on my mind as I wrote my statements. I might add a line or two to personalize it but it is difficult to do without seeming vengeful or selfish
On the topic of shrinks I think i do have my own hesitations of seeing one due to some childhood visits over my parents divorce when I was about 7. I can't remember anything about it except a puzzle in the waiting room, but I know it left me with a bad impression and my youth went downhill shortly after.
Quote: I did read your post and it and other similar thoughts were on my mind as I wrote my statements. I might add a line or two to personalize it but it is difficult to do without seeming vengeful or selfish.
I would not advocate writing this in a letter that you give to your spouse. It is best to do face to face, eye to eye. I would also advocate seeing the shrink first, and making sure that your anger and resentment are truly expunged before having this conversation.
There is a difference between having this conversation out of sheer frustration, and having this conversation after one has truly accepted the state of the marriage. When you can say those words with true love, you will know you are ready to say them.
The conversation of which I speak is not one where you're hoping to get your spouse to change. That doesn't work. Ever. It is a heart-to-heart discussion which tells your spouse: this is who I am, this is what I want for MY life; it has nothing to do with you. If you don't want that, I understand, I love you. But I just can't be who I am NOT, and no one has the right to ask me to be that way.
Boundaries are not threats. "If you don't do this, then I will do this." They are "I" statements. "I am a person who needs trust, communication and intimacy in my life and in my marriage. I'd like to find that with you. If you don't feel you can do that, please let me know. I will stay in this marriage as long as I am able, but I don't know how long that might be."
In this way, you throw the ball back to the spouse's court, where it belongs. They will continue to try and bounce the ball back to you, for they WANT you to carry the ball -- that way, they control you and the relationship by leaving everything up to you... they are faultless.
But when they finally understand that they are left holding the ball, and no, you are not taking it back... they make a decision. They have to. They have no choice.
This sounds very simple. It is anything but, for YOU must be rock-solid in who you are and what you want in you life because you love and respect YOURSELF.
At this point, the spouse will do one of two things. They will either change, or they will leave you. You cannot control either decision. (They could leave you right now, but why do that? You're carrying the ball)
When we realize we can't control anything but ourselves anyway (and that is very scary and difficult to admit), we realize we have no true choice but to love and respect ourselves first, and our spouses second. Otherwise, what are we truly offering them?
Quote: On the topic of shrinks I think i do have my own hesitations of seeing one due to some childhood visits over my parents divorce when I was about 7. I can't remember anything about it except a puzzle in the waiting room, but I know it left me with a bad impression and my youth went downhill shortly after.
This could be a valid instance of transference, you know. The bad feelings you had regarding your life falling apart at a very tender age is linked to the memory of the shrink, rather than your parents (for linking it to your parents would increase the pain. It's a defense mechanism).
I'm still going to encourage you to find one all on your own, right now. Much has changed in the field since you were a kid, and not all shrinks are created equal. Find one with whom you are comfortable, and keep looking until you do. Explain to them your feelings regarding shrinks so they know; there are many, many ways to find a good one.
