The thing I thought of when you mentioned the birthday thing is...what about your kids? I guess I'm thinking that he might use that as an opportunity to point out to your kids how uncaring you are....you know take the opportunity to make you the bad guy.
What "I" might do is tell him after the fact...after you've gone to dinner that you waffled about it and really didn't want to do anything for his birthday but you did it anyway.
As far as the driving without his license goes and getting arrested....I know I don't need to say this to you, but his behavior ISN'T changing, and that's too bad.
Make you plan and follow-through with it, that may be the only way he pulls his head out of his butt!
GEL, you're right, his behavior isn't changing, much...but for some reason the driving without a license arrest isn't the big pointer to that, at least to me.
It's the fact that he doesn't take responsibility for the mess he's gotten himself into. The reason he didn't get the restricted license is because he didn't show up at a hearing, because he had trouble getting a certified letter. The post office delivered several notices when no one was home, with the option for him to sign to allow them to leave it in the mail box, which he did. When that happened two or three times, I told him he should just go pick it up. He refused, saying they're screwing up (they were, we have mail problems here all the time). BUT DUH! He knew this was important and he needed to take care of it...but, you know, it's not his fault.
So he missed his court date.
And the other thing was the self centered way he selected what he was willing to risk driving for.
Anyway...I wish he'd gotten pulled over that day when *I believe* he went to the club. That would have been perfect. Oh well...
Not to mention he insists he wasn't really drunk when he got arrested the first time...just checking his cell phone and hit a curb. He "only" blew a .1 and the legal limit is .08...blah blah blah. whatever.
As far as my kids, they're old enough to know the score...16 and 13. In fact I doubt they'll really want to go without me. I am not worried about them thinking I'm the bad guy in this. If they were younger, it would be a different story. I actually reminded my 16 yr old D last week that his birthday was coming. I just may wait to see if she says/does anything. I'm still playing by ear. I will decide as I go along. I bought him a gift a couple weeks ago, so I'm not totally unprepared if I decide I want to do something last minute.
I honestly think the best thing for us to do would be to separate for awhile. He has problems, that much he acknowledges. I asked him if he thought getting rid of me would solve them...and he thought about it and didn't say anything. The fact is he knows he's screwed up but doesn't seem willing to do anything about it.
He also acknowledges he has "strong feelings" for me but is not "IN love" with me.
Unfortunately, the only way we can really afford to split would be to make some pretty permanent financial decisions. Plus he thinks he deserves the house because he was the main bread winner for the past few years...he just doesn't get that it doesn't work that way, especially in a community property state. I don't think he realizes how much he has alienated his kids...he thinks I should just move out and leave him the house and kids. There is no logic to his thinking, and no end to his selfishness.
And the funny thing is he was on a business trip for a week and got lonely and depressed. Maybe he missed his strippers..LOL, but it's me he called to talk to.
Well, again, I need to get some stuff done...
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
Sorry things continue to be lousy for you, and you're forced to make some tough decisions.
Quote: And the funny thing is he was on a business trip for a week and got lonely and depressed. Maybe he missed his strippers..LOL, but it's me he called to talk to.
For whatever my opinion is worth (the price you pay for it ) I bet he does miss you.
It sounds to me like all his talk of D is his way of keeping you on edge, making sure you're still there, in a way. I bet anything he wouldn't really go through with it. He depends on you to be there to be his concience. It may not be 'love' in the sense that most people understand it, but in his world he can't live without you.
He knows he's got troubles, but as long as you're still there, he doesn't need to deal with them. It does sound like he needs a good dose of reality.
I am sure that I have posted this before, but I don't remember your answer.
Since you are talking separation, have you read "Love Must Be Tough" by Dobson? The book deals mostly with affairs, but it equally applies to addictions and other aberrant behaviors in marriage. The principles contained therein specifically deal with separation as a catalyst for change in a broken marriage. It is one of the few written works that I think properly deal with separation.
I think the book is especially applicable to your situation.
I am glad that you are hanging in there. I believe that your husband will really appreciate your strength one day.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I don't think you should ignore or "forget" his birthday. Believe me, I am all too familiar with the dynamic of H doing something provocative, W reacting, and H distancing because of W's response ( while the behavior doesn't get fully addressed). Stay strong and set boundaries ( even if that means separating), but if your ultimate goal is to save the marriage, try not to let the hurt/anger/resentment spill over into the good parts of life ( like birthday celebrations). JMO.
You know, IHJ I agree with you, and I've lived by that in the past. I'm really not ignoring it to make a point...or be mean. I just don't feel like I can muster up anything at all right now. And after being told repeatedly that he doesn't want me in his life (even though his actions say otherwise), maybe I do want him to see that I'm the only one in his whole life that does anything or even thinks of him.
And yes, I know that second statement contradicts the first.
My kids have already made other plans. I only saw H for a few minutes this morning before he left for his b-ball game. I was half asleep, so not mentioning at this point really isn't a major issue.
Every holiday we have or celebrate, he always makes it from the kids to me. He doesn't sign the cards, he doesn't put his name on the tags of the gifts. I know he buys them, I know he puts the thought into them and pays for them...but it's another way of his not acknowledging me.
Even if he were to call me on not doing anything for his b-day, it would be easy for me to say something like "you don't want me around, you don't want me to do anything for you, I just left it up to the kids this time'
Last year, the kids had so much going on the weekend of his b-day, (finals & stuff) they really couldn't go out to dinner. So I offered to take him out, and then we could go out with the kids next weekend. He refused to go with just me. Then he moped around because the kids really didn't want to do anything with him.
It sounds so childish on my part, but I'm giving him what he's been asking for. Maybe the reason I don't feel like doing anything is because I've had so much of what I've done thrown back in my face.
I'll probably cave anyway. I really don't have it in me to do this to him. It just almost seems better to not do anything than to do some half hearted celebration.
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
Sally... I see where you are at now. Sometimes it does take an eye-opening experience to jar our spouses back to reality. I know my own brand of "tough love" ( after reading PM) helped to waken up my H.
So take his birthday cake and you know what you should do...wait, wait...that's not the right advice, lol.
Since I seem to have two issues going on here, I thought I'd address it in two different responses (it's my thread and I'll do what I want to).
Unfortunately FF, I think he would go through with a divorce...in a flash. This time last year, we were weeks away from a final decree. It's funny how I'm being so stubborn about this. I KNOW that he will not be happier if we divorce. It seems like he thinks it's the next stage in his life...everyone, grandparents, parents, cousins...everyone in his family divorced.
Of course he didn't go through with it. But only because I fought long and hard against the way he was going about it. He filed when I was unemployed, after transfering the joint bank account into his name only...the petition asked for him to get the kids, the house, everything. I was trying to deal with this with NO lawyer, no money...I was temping but couldn't get ahead enough to come up with a retainer. It was crazy and through the whole thing I was trying to get a real job and not have a nervous breakdown...he had scheduled court clinics to decide who would get the kids, the whole deal. Finally I told him he had put our whole lives in the hands of judges and lawyers and please STOP doing this...and after pleading and pleading with him he finally did about two weeks before our court date, days before the child custody clinics.
I keep saying this too...we get along fine, agree on a lot of the day to day life stuff. We have raised a couple of great kids.
I think a big part of his problem is he thinks he's missing out on some sort of big party boy lifestyle? I don't really get it. His brother never married, goes out all the time. I know he's miserable. Does H really want that life? I know his brother would change places with him in a minute...heck his brother has always been in love with me. I'm the person his brother came to when he had his big AIDS scare (yeah, we ALL want that life). I imagine if his bro didn't live in another state, I'd still be the person he came to with stuff.
Anyway, it really is all a huge big Mid Life Crisis flag...I have read up enough on THAT subject and I can tick off most of the symptoms, right down to the car he drives.
Should I let him throw away his whole life just because he's going through this big childish phase?
The reason I bring up the separation thing is that I think, in a way, it would be a good thing for him to see what his life would be like. What he wants is for me to move out, let him have the house...and I just disappear. I do believe in that scenario, he would eventually realize what he's missing out on.
However, I refuse to turn the house over to him. For obvious reasons...We can't afford two houses right now. I can't/won't squeeze the kids into an apartment with me. The kids would not want to stay at the house with him if I moved out (and I would never leave my kids anyway). And if we did eventually divorce, we all know that me moving out of the house would hurt my chances of getting it, or part of it, later.
So that leaves him moving out. He refuses to do so. But if I could get him to do that, just being away from it would make him miserable and give him one more thing to blame on me. He works on the yard constantly, it is beautiful. I would not be able to keep it in that condition, even if I were motivated to do so...again, one more way I would ruin his life if I were to stay here and he moved out...watching his beautiful yard fall apart.
Not to mention that he would be incredibly broke when he realized that he would have to pay rent plus pay child support. He honestly seems to think that he can just be single and not have to pay for the kids anymore or something. So when I legally made him fork over $$$, which I would probably have to do to get anything out of him...I'd be ruining his life.
So if we separated, he would be miserable, but all he would see is how **I'm making him miserable**. So it really is a lose/lose situation. I'd get to be the "evil ex taking all his money". He tries to hard to make me the bad guy...that would be one more way to make it happen.
And NOPkins, you have mentioned that book before. I'm sort of all "booked out". I read reviews of it, got the main gist of it...I don't think it's going to give me any answers I don't have. I really feel like I can't change him...he needs to work on himself. That's probably what the book pretty much says anyway. I reread the MLC stuff of the Divorce Busting books and really, I think that's what he needs.
What he really needs is to pull his head out and really see what he's doing...and what he's giving up. Sometimes I think I should give up trying to figure out what is really motivating him. Maybe he really is this one dimensional selfish person that he appears to be...heh
Anyway, after slamming him so hard I should say that I'm not a total idiot, this man has worked hard and provided a decent life for his family...he does put the kids before almost everything. He works hard, he deserves to go out and have fun sometimes. I don't want to deny him that. I have never thought he had a drinking problem, the DWI was just a symptom of all the other junk that he's going through. He can be a total sweetheart and he does take care of me. i would venture to guess, having read a lot of the threads in this board, that we have a better marriage, even better communication than many of the people in the SSM forum. Which is another reason why I can keep holding on considering all the other stuff he's putting me through.
Quote:
He knows he's got troubles, but as long as you're still there, he doesn't need to deal with them. It does sound like he needs a good dose of reality.
He needs it bigtime...and as long as I'm around, he likes to blame all his troubles on me. I'd love to give him a taste of what his life would be like without me...I need some sort of "ghost of christmas future" or something though so he can really see without all the other issues a separation would cause.
Sometimes I think I have the weirdest life ever...
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
Quote: Sally... I see where you are at now. Sometimes it does take an eye-opening experience to jar our spouses back to reality. I know my own brand of "tough love" ( after reading PM) helped to waken up my H.
So take his birthday cake and you know what you should do...wait, wait...that's not the right advice, lol.
Hugs,
IHJ
LOL...thanks for understanding...still can't figure out the right answer to this.
I just want to say too, how much this board has really helped me. I can't imagine where I would be without having ya'all to bounce ideas off of. Probably the looney bin.
Slowly all the roles we act out become our Identity,
And in the end we are what we pretend to be.
-Jerry Cantrell
Quote: Should I let him throw away his whole life just because he's going through this big childish phase?
You aren't "letting" him do this Sally, it's his choice. No matter how you fight against his choice....it's still his to make. And, the more you fight against it...the more appealing it may become to him.
) I bet he does miss you. 