My H was tested for his testosterone levels...he came back completely normal, in fact he came back testing on the high end...with very active swimmers!
I had a list of things (mentally) for us to try before I knew he'd agree to a counselor. I knew that for him a C would be our last-ditch effort (although I knew all along it would come to it). We tried supplements for several weeks with absolutely no affect...the Dr. was the next step.
My H had a complete blood-workup and explained to the Dr. what specifically seemed to be the problem so he would know what tests to run. He came back completely normal on all levels...talk about frustration!!!! I was secretly hoping that a low T-level was the problem...that's something that we could have easily fixed.
Quote: I'm right in that boat with you Honey! I've also come to the conclusion that my husband fits the arousal=desire pattern. He's fine once I get things started, but damn! It's frustrating to always have to be the one to do that
Maybe I'm simplifying too much, but as the LD in our relationship, I don't wait for my somewhat nebulous sexual senses to burst into flame before I grab NOP's butt, cop a feel or grab him and lay one on him. I don't know, but even among members in the arousal-then-desire club, it's not impossible or psychologically damaging to get "physical" during the day with your spouse -IF- both partner's have reached a place where they *want* to express care for each other. Dang, it's that old relationship talk again!
MsNOP, as our resident LDW, lemme ask you a few things,
What 'inspires' you to grab some NOP and get things going. Really, im serious in asking. My LDW is definately the desire after arousal type. I have tried different ways to encourage desire-like behaviour with no sucess. Is loving and willing to please egnough to get things going until wanting kicks in?
I understand what you're saying...and I WISH my H was at that point. To be really honest though we haven't been working at it long at all...especially in comparison to many people on these BB's. I know change doesn't happen overnight...so fortunately for my H I'm a patient woman....who often gets frustrated!!!!
I broached the scheduled sex issue again with him the other night, he seemed more open to that this time...in the past it was downright distasteful to him. I'm pretty sure that he feels like a failure as a man (sexually speaking) because he just simply doesn't have the urge most men have to have sex.
I've gleaned from convo's we've had that in his younger days (he's only 44) this wasn't an issue for him. But he now suffers from quite a bit of sexual repression due to several years of severe squashing by others. It's pretty much these issues that he won't talk about (to anyone).
But I'm ever hopeful. And at least our relationship is going in the right direction now. I certainly didn't turn from LD to HD overnight, I know you didn't either....so I try to remind myself to be empathatic to him. I get frustrated sure But I do my best to get my frustration out quickly, re-group, and try, try, try again
It's this sort of question that prompted my (okay, mean and ignorant) comment of a few weeks ago when I said LDs were lazy. I'm NOT saying it now... but, for example, with regard to showing affection... when your spouse/partner comes home from work, even if you don't FEEL like it, isn't it common sense and civility to exchange a hug and kiss? Or when you go to bed, to turn to each other for a few minutes and reconnect before going to sleep? Neither one of you has to be aching with desire... this is something you can do for your partner just because it's a nice thing to do.
HDSocal's question, "what inspires you?" is a good one, don't get me wrong, but why does the LD person (or the HD person) have to FEEL anything at the time... why can't they just notice, or observe, or conclude that their partner could use a hug or kiss right now? Why can't they just make it part of their routine without fuss or struggle because they know their partner likes affection and that it's good for the relationship? There's that Economy of Emotional Deprivation... why not be generous with something that costs you nothing? (Or do LDs perceive showing affection as costing them a lot?)
As far as feeling real sexual desire and making a sexual move-- that's something else (and probably what HDSocal was getting at), but plenty of people on this board remark that their LD spouse is short on expressing good old garden variety affection, too.
When my bf is engrossed in something and I come into the room or arrive home, he greets me, but it's no big deal. When I'm here and he comes in, I usually greet him at the door, not always because I FEEL like it, but because I know how good it feels to ME to be made to feel welcome and I do it for him. If he greeted me at the door occasionally and made me feel really welcome and like he was really glad to see me, I would float away from sheer happiness... in fact, even imagining it makes me feel like crying. (But then in the LL, I'm a gift person, and I guess I see this kind of greeting as a gift. He's an Acts of Service guy, and I suppose stopping what he is doing to get up and greet me has no productive value in his mind; it just distracts him from what he was doing.)
NOP lady, you are correct. Until my H reaches the point where he thinks that loving me in the way I best receive it is more important than preserving his own sense of "self" we will stalemate on this issue.
Well, maybe that's not what she was saying at all.
I do know that I have asked him outright if there are any areas he would like for me to improve. I have also tried to finesse this information out of him, thinking that he didn't want to tell me outright. Every time his response is the same: "You are the perfect wife!"
Just in knowing him so well, I have started to make changes in how I approach spiritual matters. Last weekend he acknowledged this and thanked me for it. So I know that I am on the right track, at least..
Last night: H was DB'ing me! lol He got home from work, cheerful and humming and singing. I was cheery to him but somewhat reserved. Not wanting to withhold from him, but just feeling distant. When he sexually rejects me, my love starts to erode. After a while, I end up looking at him and thinking "Wait a minute! I don't want this guy; I'm not even sure I like him."
Nonetheless we had a pleasant night together with our kids. At bedtime, I was stalling SO bad. I couldn't face going in our room and knowing that he'd most likely initiate and I felt no desire for him. I was not in the mood to drum up any desire for him.
Sure enough, I went to bed and he began kissing me and being aggressive (for him). I didn't dare touch him because I suspected that this 'show' had not yet communicated anything to his squeezy bits. I finally told him that I had no desire right then and wasn't this ironic--now you had TWO people who need physical stimulation before they feel anything. How romantic! At this info, he began earnestly touching the bits and BAM! he came to life. It was really strange. He went from putting on a somewhat realistic show to giving me the real thing--all from actual contact with the bits. Suddenly his desire was there (good grief, I would think SO...it had been a long time!).
I still couldn't give up my resentment (I should be in an R with my pal resentment since I seem to love it so much) and asked him if he had missed THIS at all. He replied, "Yes..sometimes."
LOL
I swear this guy is a machine and not human.
Anyway, we did the deed and it lasted all of two minutes. We were both laughing while doing it, knowing that it would be short and sweet.
The discomfort was minimal, thank goodness. He was really worried about that. I think I did not realize how afraid he was of hurting me. I suppose if I had been the one to watch an 8 lb baby shoot outta there, I might feel nervous too. But...you all know me...if something hurts, I am not one to lay there like a martyr and not say anything. I would have called a halt to the entire thing if it wasn't going well and he knows that. So that was his own little bit of neurosis kicking in.
One thing he kept repeating while we were getting started was "I just needed an icebreaker." Over and over. In the most insistent voice. Afterwards, he repeated this line. I think it was his way of letting me know that he needed a way to make the transition from looking at me as the wounded mother of his child, to the healed red hot lover.
(insert screaming voice) Apparently me saying the words "I want to ML to you" were not enough!
Another thing he kept reiterating was that he needs physical touch to get his mind focused. That is, he doesn't think of me during the day, or find himself aroused just by looking at me because they are not also accompanied by touch. The touch could be as simple as a hug or kiss, btw.
I understand this but I also know that there are PLENTY of times when the physical touch doesn't work its magic that he is describing. In fact, I would say that there are actually 3 criteria: He has to have touch, it has to be the 'right' time, and his mind has to be somewhat at ease.
He is a PITA to have sex with, that's for sure.
This weekend I am going to bring up the schedule thing and see what he thinks. I'm sure he will resist it but I am going to push for a 30 day trial.
At any rate, we're back on the wagon. I hope to get back to where we were..I now realize that it wasn't perfect but it was pretty darn good!
Honey
P.S. Annette, remember that convo we had a loong time ago about how H buries the Victoria's secret catalogs deep down in the trash? Well, I've had one sitting on the counter in full view for 2 days and it's still there! LOL I'm not sure if that's progress or a coincidence..
Quote: What 'inspires' you to grab some NOP and get things going. Really, im serious in asking. My LDW is definately the desire after arousal type. I have tried different ways to encourage desire-like behaviour with no sucess. Is loving and willing to please egnough to get things going until wanting kicks in?
I think a difficult thing to deal with is that to get to the oasis, you have to trudge through a lot of desert. I don't know what it's like for other folks/relationships. But NOP and I had a lot of relational crap that we had to deal with. I wouldn't have been inclined to cop a feel a year ago, because our relationship had become so strained.
It took willingness from both of us. It wasn't pretty at first and we had quite a few blow-ups and slip-ups during the process. It took *both* of us recognizing that we had a problem. It took *both* of us making efforts to change the dynamics. It took so many conversations (confrontations?) - not always pleasant, but almost always somewhat productive.
I don't know about marriages where the relationship is fine but the sex sucks or is non-existant. Because that's not in my point of reference. If you can't discuss sex, affection, snuggling, sleeping together, your longings and needs with your spouse, etc., then I don't see how you can really proceed into *doing* what you want if you can't even *discuss* what you want. I'm not saying that it is an even/or situation (talk or action) because we kept talking AND working on the sex issues at the same time.
Aargh. I think I've meandered.
What inspires me is that this is a man that loves me and whom I love. This is a man who has so many admirable traits yet who can and has admitted to his less than stellar attributes. Who has told me that he wants to spend the rest of his life with me. Who can manage to step back and regroup when things get heated. A man who works with me in my weaknesses and speaks to me of my strengths.
Out of all that easily comes expressions, both physical and emotional, of love. It has become natural for me to grab him when I walk by, touch him as he passes, and in general look him in the eye and let him know that I'm glad we're here - together.
So you hadn't given up on things with NOP then... that's good to hear!
I hope that I can have something similar with my W in a year or two, after she wakes up and realizes that there's more to life than children and crochet projects. I'm doing my best to hang out while W continues to wallow in self-pity and "woe is me." It's tough, and sometimes I feel like I should give up and walk away.
But I do my best to get my frustration out quickly, re-group, and try, try, try again 
But a roll in the hay would do wonders for most of us.....