My wife's LLs are definitely "words of affirmation" and "quality time." Followed by "Acts of Service" and "gift giving" and WAY dead last is "Physical Touch." She beams when I compliment her, and I especially try to do it front of other people, especially her parents (and especially her father), as their approval is important to her, and their style is to give it very grudgingly. (They love her very much, they're just not big "touchy-feely" types, and her father is also hopelessly chauvinistic).
We've been married 22 years. It is only in the last year or two that I've finally cut way back on the "quality time" with her, and I still give her many, many "words of affirmation." For her beauty, but I also make sure to compliment her on her new job, the job she does as a mother, the great daughter she is to her aging parents, etc., as she has mentioned before that she wants to be seen as more than just beautiful.
So that's a long way of saying "Yeah, I've cut back recently," but only on one of the two. "Quality time" is just tough for me, as frankly, she's not that much fun to be around. She takes "high maintenance" to a new level, and she can also be a real beotch sometimes. So the past couple of years, I've focused more on GAL, as I've coached my boys' baseball teams and worked out and stuff. But I still give her lots of WOAs.
I do think the "jealousy" comments are her freaking out over my lack of initiation the past five years. Like Piglet says to Pooh, she wants to "Just be sure of me," but it's a weird way to show it.
If she wants to be sure of me, an un-asked-for hug, or a full kiss on the lips, or even a back scratch would do it. And she knows that.
Sorry for hijack, CeMar, but it's not like you answer anyone's questions anyway.
Choc, I'm with MrsCAC on this. You may think you are talking in her LL, but are you really? Think of it as a foreign language that you are not fluent in. It is really easy to think you are saying one thing yet convey a totally different message than what you intended. Attempting to talk in another's LL is no different. It takes practice as well as feedback to let you know if you are hitting the mark or not. Unfortunately that feedback can be difficult to understand or even see if you are not actively looking for it.
A few weeks ago you told us of an exchange at the dinner table where you said you don't show jealously toward advances at yoru W by other men. That exchange was a glimpse of her feelings. My friend, she is hurting at least as much as you are and she's trying to tell you in ways she knows how. You two need to learn how to talk to each other, and by that I mean learn to share your feelings. It works. It is hard to do, no make that very hard to do. It takes a conscious effort and is uncomfortable, but it is how you will make headway. One of you has to break the ice and start the communication off. Since you are the one here, you win that prize.
Are you in counseling? Have you tried a Marriage Encounter Weekend, or maybe Retrovueille (sp)? You may need some help learning to communicate intimately with one another.
If you were speaking her LL, she would respond (unless she really is a hopeless princess/b1tch).
I wish it were that simple. There are dozens of reasons wy women are LD and relationships issues is only ONE of them. This may make it hard for them to respond even when their love language is spoken.
Mrs.cac4 thanks for posting the following items in bold. When he appeared to view me with contempt, he was NOT desirable. When he blew off things that were important to me but not to him, he was NOT desirable. When he refused to acknowledge that I was upset that he blew off things that were important to me, he was NOT desirable.......
Questions for mrs.cac4 or mr.cac4. I understand a couple having different levels of importance on what they are interested in, thinks is important, and supporting the OP is necessary even if s/he doesn't see that importance.
What do either one of you think you would do it the other has a want related to or bordering on OCD, or something you think is extreme.
One case is, my w likes pets and will donate $$ to rescue pets in a combat area of the world, but isn't interested in doing much for the local animal shelter.
I posted this example, not to be critical of my W/BB, but to give a situation where I lose respect for her practical reasoning process. I have no way of knowing where the money goes if we/she donates money to some unknown fundraiser. If I do something for and at the local shelter, I see what is or isn't being done for the animals.
I think I already answered this, but this is what he has been doing lately: TALKING to me (rather than looking at the floor or the TV while I talk); TALKING to me (rather than making sarcastic comments); TELLING me what he needs--in plain English (rather than the sarcastic comments that I need to interpret); being KIND and LOVING (rather than cold and distant).
Talking to me, rather than..... I think I have this as a goal. What did either one of you do, or would have done if your situation would have included?....
Problem areas are; Staying on track, sticking to the topic. That is a big one for us at times.
(rather than making sarcastic comments) I give compliments; she takes some part of the compliment as a criticism.
being KIND and LOVING (rather than cold and distant I am not cold and distant, but I am self-protective.
For the first time in I-don't-know-how-long I am feeling adored by my H, and it feels really good.
Sometimes I can see this in BB, but often it's timing or situational variables that interfere with the outcome. What works one time is not necessarily what works after a few implementations.
Mrs. Cac4, your participation on this forum, from the LD perspective, is greatly appreciated.
A few weeks ago you told us of an exchange at the dinner table where you said you don't show jealously toward advances at yoru W by other men. That exchange was a glimpse of her feelings. My friend, she is hurting at least as much as you are and she's trying to tell you in ways she knows how. You two need to learn how to talk to each other, and by that I mean learn to share your feelings. It works. It is hard to do, no make that very hard to do. It takes a conscious effort and is uncomfortable, but it is how you will make headway. One of you has to break the ice and start the communication off.
OK -- I vote for her. I'm weary of always being the one. Furthermore, I submit to you that there' a reason why she doesn't: because she knows that the roads will lead to her issues, and she's terrified and riddled with guilt about it.
That being said, we really DON'T know how to communicate with each other. We weren't good at it when we met, we were no better at it by the time we were married, and we're probably worse at it now than we were 20 years ago. Absolutely horrible.
Choc, I've suggested this to you before, but don't recall what you said: Have you considered a WWME weekend? It is all about learning to communicate with your S, and it is set up so that the conversations between you two are in private, no one else at all hears them.
Absent that, I found a book that I thought was very good regarding learning to communicate, which I've mentioned here before: "How to Stay Married & Love It: Solving the Puzzle of a SoulMate Marriage" by Nancy Lundrum.
Learning to communicate is the first step toward improving your marriage.
Book description: This sensible self-help book draws on family-systems therapy in recommending thoughtful "self-focus" for women stuck in difficult relationships with either mates or families. Emphasizing that "a truly intimate relationship is one in which we can be who we are, which means being open about ourselves," Lerner ( The Dance of Anger ; Women in Therapy ) highlights the importance of women defining themselves, their needs and limits, rather than reacting to anxiety unthinkingly--either by emotionally distancing themselves from problems or by overreacting. A staff psychologist and psychotherapist at the Menninger Clinic, Lerner illustrates her points with case studies from her family as well as her practice. To explore what unhelpful patterns of behavior may be passed down from past generations, she advises creating a genogram, or family diagram, going back to a person's grandparents or earlier. Lerner's book presumes at least an acquaintance with professional jargon but should be accessible to most readers of pop psychology. **************** Several reviewers said that although the book appears to be aimed at women, it can apply to men as well.
Other interesting titles by this author: The Dance of Anger: A Woman's Guide to Changing the Patterns of Intimate Relationships The Dance of Fear: Rising Above Anxiety, Fear and Shame to Be Your Best and Bravest Self The Dance of Connection: How to Talk to Someone When You're Mad, Hurt, Scared, Frustrated, Insulted, Betrayed or Desperate
Lou, Lil, fearless and others....thanks for acknowledging my contributions to the BB. It really means a lot. I've always had issues with the BB format because of the lack of instant feedback as you get with a live convo. But, I'm putting out my thoughts, trying not to fret about them and how people perceive them, and stepping out of my comfort zone. The posters here are a great bunch of people.
Lou,
My issues weren't of the OCD variety as you describe, but pertained to things like division of labor in the house, being treated courteously, not being taken advantage of, being respected and so forth.
H and I are lucky to have very similar spending habits. In your sitch, you need to set boundaries and limits. Does BB have a set amount of $ that she can spend on whatever she wants? Or is she spending excessively and that spending is having repercussions on your finances/budget? If it's the former, I think you just need to let it go. You may think she is spending the $ on stupid things, but you really can't control it. It becomes a power struggle. If it's the latter, then you need to speak up and come to a compromise you both can live with.
Regarding talking, I used to get really upset with H when he would look at the TV while I talked to him. I always felt that he didn't really care what I had to say and that he was chosing the TV over me. Then one day he told me that he found it very uncomfortable to look me in the eye in a situation like this (talking about feelings, issues in the M, etc.) I began telling him I wanted to talk and then asking him to turn off the TV. He didn't have to look at me, but he had to give me his undivided attention.
We always would get off topic, go off on tangents, etc. Actually, it was me who did almost all the talking, so I would get off topic. Some marriage counselors advise shelving a convo that can't be resolved to be picked up at another mutually agreed-upon time, but I found that very hard to do. What I did find, though, was that each time H and I had one of our talks, I would get more insight into our R. I might go to bed after a talk/argument feeling hopeless, but within a couple of days I felt more determined and had more confidence to keep working at it.
Our biggest problem I think was that H was virtually unable to tell me his feelings about anything. When he did talk, what he said sounded so angry and defensive that it really threw me. It took some reading for me to figure out what we were doing. (One book that helped was "The Seven Principles of Making Marriage Work" by John Gottman. This book gave me some insight into our communication patterns and why they weren't working.
Why do you think BB takes your compliments as criticism? Can you give examples?
H's self-protection mode was to be avoidant/dismissive. For a person like me who really likes to talk about my feelings, it was torture to be shut out like that. I took it personally for many years until I understood he was only self-protecting.
As H admitted on Cemar's thread, he hasn't really "done" anything proactive, other than buy Michele's book and post his thoughts here. But he has done one other thing, and that is to respond positively to my changes and efforts. That has made all the difference.
No, we've never done a WWME weekend. My parents used to recommend it from time to time, as they used to TEACH/FACILITATE them, but we've never done one. I honestly don't know anyone for whom they've worked more than short-term (I seem to recall that you came back all fired up, but since then, things have fallen back into the status quo?), and our lives are SO full with the activities of the four kids and both of our jobs, I'd hate to take all that time away.
I also have this aversion to "seminar" type stuff, from WWME to Promise Keepers and the like, as it seems like they always put the onus on the man to be more caring, more sensitive, say ILY more often, etc. I think I have the opposite problem going on -- too much of a "princess" mentality in the fetching Mrs. Choc.
