I DID NOT see ML as anything other than something that H needed. Don't get me wrong, I am usually orgasmic (as long as I'm not on SSRIs) and I always enjoyed ML while it was happening, but I just couldn't summon up enough energy or what-have-you to want to start ML in the first place.
My wife is ALWAYS in this place. Your husbands reactions are NORMAL under the circumstance. But the problem is that LD women, even when they start working the issue, they focus on SEX. This is NOT going to fix the problem. The problem that you face is how are you going to show your husband true desire. HD men often can not separate desire and love, which women easily do. Lack of desire means no love.
What is it that your husband could do that would actually help, or would actually cause you to desire?
Cemar wrote: ---------------------------------------------------------- What is it that your husband could do that would actually help, or would actually cause you to desire? ----------------------------------------------------------
What would it take to cause you to answer questions?
Answer everyone's questions and I will tell you the secret to generate desire in your spouse.
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
Cemar wrote: ---------------------------------------------------------- What is it that your husband could do that would actually help, or would actually cause you to desire? ----------------------------------------------------------
What would it take to cause you to answer questions?
Answer everyone's questions and I will tell you the secret to generate desire in your spouse.
-NOPkins-
Amen Nop's!! CeMar you STILL have not answered any of the very direct questions posed to you just in this thread alone. Do you avoid talking to your own wife and opening up to her as you do with us on this BB? If so, there's something right there that YOU need to work on.
Communication is something that is absolutely necessary to form intimacy, at least in this female's POV.
SEX alone does not create intimacy for a woman (it might for you, but I'm willing to put money on it that it doesn't for her)....it's the things that go on outside the bedroom that will help create that, that will lead to her desiring you and wanting to be intimate with you. I just don't see you doing those things that will foster that feeling in her though. You want this to be YOUR way, she must desire you without you doing the other stuff...you won't budge on that. So, you will stay in this place you are in now....you will remain in a stalemate.
Cemar wrote: ---------------------------------------------------------- What is it that your husband could do that would actually help, or would actually cause you to desire? ---------------------------------------------------------- ...answer everyone's questions and I will tell you the secret to generate desire in your spouse.
-NOPkins-
Ooh, Cemar...you gotta respond to this...cuz I wanna hear the answer to this one, too! LOL! cuz in all honesty, I don't know the answer to the question, either. It doesn't seem like I've "done" anything to cause this recent awakening in DW...'cept exactly what you've done, too: come here and whine about my problems for the last what? 4 years?? The difference is that a) she was unhappy with my unhappiness, and b) she read my unfiltered (i.e. "nasty") thoughts posted here on this board. Maybe its the power of the written word...different people process information differently, etc, etc. I don't know. Somehow, it struck a chord. But I know I wouldn't have ever said those things that I posted here to her face. rather "vinegar-y" stuff, when we all know, you attract flies with honey. But still, its not as if I never said anything about it. I've told her 1000 times that I'm unhappy with our SL...probably starting back in 1988, fer goodness sakes. How many times do I have to say it? like Choc said earlier, "how could you NOT know???". or not "get it"? well, she says she didn't "get it". {shrug}. I don't get that. This might be more of a mars/venus thing. I said it enough times for anyone to "know". Continuing to bring it up, express the same though, trigger the same argument, which lead to the same frustration, just seemed pointless to me, after a while. Better to just drop it, and move on, imo. anyway, maybe the same thing would work for choc and hd and cemar. show your w's what you've posted here. no, it won't make them feel all warm and fuzzy about themselves, but maybe it'll sink in if they read it. couldn't make things any worse. seems to have helped me, as horrified as I was at first to find out that W was lurking. (yikes. )
Originally Posted By: NOPkins
That is a great attitude!
aint it, though?! just the fact that she wants to get it, even if she never does, puts me way ahead of most here.
But the problem is that LD women, even when they start working the issue, they focus on SEX. This is NOT going to fix the problem.
I thought focusing on sex would fix the problem because I thought the lack of it WAS the problem. So did H. In our sitch the SL was the symptom of problems in the R.
Quote:
The problem that you face is how are you going to show your husband true desire.
In order to desire my H, I need to be open to accepting physical love from him, and he needs to be desirable. When he appeared to view me with contempt, he was NOT desirable. When he blew off things that were important to me but not to him, he was NOT desirable. When he refused to acknowledge that I was upset that he blew off things that were important to me, he was NOT desirable. When he approached me for a kiss or ML and he smelled of cigarette smoke, he was NOT desirable. When he ignored me all evening watching TV he was NOT desirable. When he came home after we both had WOH all day and sat on his azz reading the paper while I cooked dinner (and cleaned up) he was NOT desirable.
What was my role in all this? Apparently I never told him in a way that he understood that his behavior made him undesirable. I complained, I nagged, I told him "1,000 times" that he wasn't pulling his fair share, that he was taking advantage of me, that I was tired of doing most all of the work in the house. How could he not know? Wasn't it obvious that I was unhappy? Of course it was. Just as obvious as it was to me that he was unhappy. But he still didn't "get it." His behavior didn't change. He didn't "get" me any more than I "got" him. At this point, to me, sex wasn't any more important than whatever it was that I thought was important. He wanted sex, I wanted help around the house. Actually what I really wanted was respect. I don't think I felt respected. Even though I see it differently now, my feeling then was...why should I try to see sex as important when he won't try to see my stuff as important?
See, the thing is, when you're an LD woman you really have to WORK to get in the mood to ML. It takes a lot of effort. I thought it was more difficult for me to get in the mood to ML than it was for him to wash a few dishes. For an LD woman, getting in the mood requires letting go of everything. This is really hard to do! There is nothing passive about it. Not if you're trying to get into the mood to ML the way that you and my H and the others here want. I used to tell H that I really wished I could just flip a switch like he seemingly did. Just like the old SNL skits with Wayne and Garth..."ooh, Kim Basinger....schwing!"
I just discussed this with H and he said, "but doing dishes is a CHORE. Sex is fun and healthy and good for you, etc. etc." He is right now and he was right back then and I logically I understood it back then. But to me, sex was the chore because it required a HUGE effort to clear my head and make it happen, whereas, doing dishes took 10 minutes that could be a Zen-like experience. I didn't need to engage or disengage my thoughts to wash dishes.
Quote:
HD men often can not separate desire and love, which women easily do. Lack of desire means no love.
LD women don't express their love through ML. How does your wife show her love to you? OK, never mind, you won't answer that. This post is just as much for me as it is for you, anyway.
Quote:
What is it that your husband could do that would actually help, or would actually cause you to desire?
I think I already answered this, but this is what he has been doing lately: TALKING to me (rather than looking at the floor or the TV while I talk); TALKING to me (rather than making sarcastic comments); TELLING me what he needs--in plain English (rather than the sarcastic comments that I need to interpret); being KIND and LOVING (rather than cold and distant).
For the first time in I-don't-know-how-long I am feeling adored by my H, and it feels really good.
Mrs. cac, if anyone can get through to cemar, you can (and believe me, we've ALL tried over the years).
Cemar, if you want to know what is going on with your W, you can either ask her (which you appear not to want to do), or you can print out this post of Mrs. cac's and study it.
In fact, why not print it out and give it to your W and ask her, "Is this how you've been feeling?" (I don't know why I suggested that. I'm sure you won't do it.)
Quote: ---------------------------------------------------------- For the first time in I-don't-know-how-long I am feeling adored by my H, and it feels really good. ----------------------------------------------------------
Choc, are you reading this?
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
Quote: ---------------------------------------------------------- For the first time in I-don't-know-how-long I am feeling adored by my H, and it feels really good. ----------------------------------------------------------
Choc, are you reading this?
Yes. But it's hard to "adore" someone who doesn't respect you, and who makes no effort to speak to your LL the way that I do to hers.
I am gaining a lot of good insights into my wife's thought process by reading the LD women on here, though. Even had a bit of an epiphany/"aha!" moment about 15 minutes ago when reading the distinction she's making here between "knowing it" and "getting it."
But it's hard to "adore" someone who doesn't respect you, and who makes no effort to speak to your LL the way that I do to hers.
Choc, to this I say you must not be speaking her LL. You think you are, but you aren't. Maybe she doesn't really understand what she wants. If you were speaking her LL, she would respond (unless she really is a hopeless princess/b1tch). I have a hard time writing off people, though, because I think it all comes down to self-protection and fear. If we can peel off the layers and get underneath then we can find out who the person really is.
I think that your W doesn't really understand how you feel because you aren't communicating it to her in a way that she understands. What is her LL? I'm sure that she's not feeling loved and this is at least part of the reason she is LD, especially since you wrote in NOP's thread that she was HD earlier in your R. She's unhappy! Find out why!
I never replied to your original "jealousy" post with my thoughts, but I'll tell you now. My guess is that your W wants you to be jealous because at this point she'll take ANY attention from you. This isn't any different than children acting out to get their parents' attention. They'll take negative attention over none at all. I have felt the same way toward my H, when he would be dismissive and avoidant. If you avoid and dismiss your W to protect yourself, then she will crave attention even more. And as NOP said, if she doesn't get it from you, she might start looking elsewhere.
) 
