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I wish I could thank each and every one of you individually for all your support and cheers.

I have been a little sleep deprived for a few days, and I need to take better care of myself, so I will sign off for tonight rather than spend another hour or more on the computer.

But I have eaten well today, and I got myself to the gym this evening, so I am determined to stay fit and healthy through all of this.

Until tomorrow...

Hi, LG.

One thing I forgot to mention.

All marriage counselors are NOT created equal. I have heard of marriage counselors that not only don't support marriage, but support divorce. Make sure your counselor is marriage positive. Also be aware that I have read of counselors that will sabotage a betrayed spouse by taking sides with the wayward spouse rather than being neutral.

Don't blindly trust your counselor until you are sure of their commitment and expertise.

All the best,
-NOPkins-

Marc, How are you?

Hi LG,
You posted on my Happy Valentine's thread before starting this one of your own. Have no doubt you have come to the right place here.

You are doing great and following the advice here and in the books really well. It is hard but you can pat yourself on the back for that and gain strength from know that you have been strong - IFKWIM

My story is: 4 years ago H walked out, claimed there was no OW, I found from his cellphone bill that in fact there was. Confronted him then did everything the DB book said, and got him back. We have had many difficult times since then but when he came back he recommitted to our R and promised he would never leave again no matter what - in return I forgave him "water under the bridge" was my attitude. In other words it was a deal about trust - I guaranteed him trust if he would guarantee me trustworthiness.

Not once did I issue any kind of ultimatum over anything. He made the decision on his own to come back even in the face of asking me what he should do - I just said "I can't make that decision for you". The only condition was that if he came back he had to be trustworthy and this was his one and only chance to make that mistake.

You will attract her back by being "better", by being a better stronger person than she expects you to be, than even you expect yourself to be and that includes accepting your part in what has happened to your M.

I hope things progressed along the right path at the C. It may have been painful for you. I can imagine that it was. It may even seem right now that things have taken a disasterous turn for the worse. However it's not over until it's over and it is very early days still so do not fret if that appears to be the case.

As I say my H and I are still here four years on and still struggling to keep the M together. Just now things are looking up and I feel hopeful that we may have made a breakthrough. That is meant both as a warning that there is a long hard road ahead of you and as an inspiration that things can turn out to the good.

take care

Fran

Thanks for your encouraging message, Fran.

I don't have much time to type, as my wife is getting home soon, and we live in a small loft space (only about 550 sq. feet) so there's not much privacy and I will have to add a lot of details when I can write tomorrow.

Basically, our conselor was trying to be a fair moderator and did a pretty good job, but my approach may have back fired, since I did not have hard evidence, and my wife was insisting that this OM is just a friend. She said she doesn't know him that well, but that "he is really nice" and she finds him easy to talk to. They met on a web forum that focuses on english prog/rock music, or something like that.

As I shared the information I had, she kept wanting to know where I got my info, and started to get upset thiking that I had gotten access into her voicemail, e-mail, etc. which was not the case.
She was avoiding answering some questions, but she did admit that she was lying about the art history professor staying in the room with her. And then she finally admitted that the OM did go into her hotel room, but only so she could give him a music CD she burned for him, and had forgotten to take with her when she met him earlier to go to a NYC music store he had told her about. I have a really hard time buying this story.

My wife was saying that she now feels like every movement is being watched, and that my extreme controlling behavior makes her want to get her own apartment so she can live in peace without being watched or judged.

There is more to tell, and I am sorry I have to end it here for now, but thanks for keeping on eye on my thread.

Hi, LG.

Sounds pretty boiler plate to me:

- It's all your fault if she moves out.

- We weren't doing anything in the hotel room together. (Hint, the lobby is a marvelous proper place to exchange things.)

- You are being controlling (interpretation; I know you are watching me and I have secrets).

Your loft does sound small and near to impossible to keep secrets in. She needs her space to carry out the affair.

She wants to leave, and justify it by making it your fault.

Fair warning about marriage counseling (together, not individual), it is a complete waste of time while she is in the midst of an affair. Don't waste your money.

Don't tell her the extent of your knowledge of her actions. She is 99.999% likely to be having a physical affair. Don't waste your time wondering whether or not she is.

All the best,
-NOPkins-

Hi, LG.

Here is some more for you to digest.

- No needy/grabby/controlling gestures toward your wife.

- Do NOT pursue her.

- No relationship talk.

- No "I love you"s

- Eat.

- Get a job.

- Go out with friends.

- Exercise.

- Don't mope.

Here is what you say to her regarding the affair whenever she brings it up. "Wife, we both know what you are doing. Your betrayal of my trust and our marriage is very damaging." Make it your mantra.

Get Michele's book "The Divorce Remedy" and read up on the infidelity section, specifically "The Last Resort Technique".

I doubt you did much "wrong" during the counseling session. Your wife was not being honest. Hard to have a "heart to heart" when only one party participates.

All the best,
-NOPkins-

LG:

I am going to second what NOP has said. Be patient but persistent. No blaming, but a stead-fast 'knowing' of what you know. You mentioned you have been working on your psychic abilities.

So, I will recommend that you continue to meditate, and you continue to 'thank' for guidance. The most important thing you can do in this moment is trust your intuition, but also trust in the unfolding of guidance. Be strong in your intuition, and be strong in your 'faith' by saying 'thank you for guiding me through this.'

If you want to see your marriage succeeding, 'SEE' it suceeding. What does that look like? What does that feel like? See it. Imagine it. Feel it. Go to your place. Accept nothing less. And say 'thank you,' as many times as you can in a day.

On your part, see yourself as a leading man. See yourself as strong and confident. There is no hurdle that you cannot overcome. If she is involved with someone else, be it a EA or a PA, you CAN overcome. See it. Feel it. Mind follows breath. Breath is spirit.

You ken?

Corri

Hello LG,

I've been following your sitch from the sideline, and agree that you're better off in this forum. The truth is that after dwelling in the newcomer forums for a while, you realize that there is a lot of "blind leading the blind" going on. And when you encounter a new type of crisis, it makes sense to request assistance from personel with experience in that type of sitch.

Our sitch's are similar. My W dropped the bomb back in the summer of '04. It was during her vacation trip overseas. During the proceeding months, she searched for an apartment, stopped having intimacy with me, retained an attorney, and had me served.

I, too, had my suspicions that she was not being completely honest with me. And I had also noticed that, since returning from her trip, she was looking for an excuse to go back to her country, where she had previously vacationed. A few months later - around Christmas time - her grandmother became gravely ill, and so she went back. In the midts of our marital dilemna, I accepted that she needed to go be with her grandma. (Actually, I didn't have much choice or say in the matter). I did, however, naively request that we "pause" our sitch until she returned.

Anyhow, she returned more determined than ever to separate from me. And during our 2nd marriage counseling session, she got the "Christian" couselor to side with her and announce that I needed to accept my W's decision to separate. I have to admit that I didn't take it too well. Or better put: I reacted pathetically! I wish I had found this forum back then. And though I did get emotional support from the newcomers, what I needed was experienced input.

It was during my web searches on topics of divorce, child custody/support, father's rights that I came across websites/e-books devoted to stopping divorces. One of those publications eventually led me to this DB website. I regained hope in that I realized that all was not set and done. And that I didn't have to surrender to divorce. I set out to fight for my marriage -ready to tap into any resource necessary. I did a lot of reading, understood what was going on, and most importantly, realized that something could be done about it.

I also used electronics, and uncovered the fact that she was involved in an EA with (though I'm pretty sure that it didn't get physical). I confronted her with this info - I never really led on that I had hard evidence - and she denied it, but at the same time testing to see what I knew, and how I new it..... The OM was a chilhood sweetheart, and the R was in a developmental stage. I eventually realized that the OM was not my primary adversary.

I was able to - with the help of various sources - Bust My Divorce. But not until I learned valuable lessons. And that is the primary reason for my post. I disagree that you should "trust your intuition". I've been through your ordeal, and I can attest that your current state mind is not that reliable. You are most likely not sleeping right or eating well. That plus the fact that you're entire world has turned upside down, is reason to understand that your emotions can play havoc on your mind.

Right now you're probably exxagerating the bad and jumping to conclusions all over the place. And that's understandable. However, if you have taken stock and decided that you want to defend your marriage, then you need to rely on reason and not on your feelings/intuition. Learn from our mistakes:

-Don't be needy.
-Don't pursue.
-Become that attractive, positive, happy, even cocky guy that enamored your wife to begin.
-Don't be always available to her.
-Go out and do something that you like.
-Enjoy friends - even if they're girls. I now you probably don't feel like doing that right now, but that is the prescription that's required to regain the confidence that's necessary to achieve your objective.

Just last night, before we went to sleep - after 2 1/2 years since D-day - my W thanked me for fighting for our marriage. She proceeded to tell me that she doesn't know how to explain it, but that she was falling in love with me like when when first started dating. Then we fell asleep in each other's arms, but not until we ................................... like when we used to date. Don't get me wrong, we've had our ups and downs along the way. But after you learn correct info about relationships, then just like you can Bust your D, you can also learn how to nurture a happy R.

I wish you the best and will provide a list of the resources I found helpful in getting me to this point.

What an inspirational post, 2nd chance! Thanks for posting that.