Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums THE SEX-STARVED MARRIAGE Afterall...This IS my Life

crazedmom,

No problem :-) That's why we let ya know what it is (and Lil, thanks for the unabridged description too...it was interesting.) I'm sure people who have this mindset have it to varying degrees as well, and use a variety of different avenues as their sexual output (tv, porn, computers...you name it.)

For me for some reason though knowing that this is something my H struggles with gives me some peace. Hopefully we'll work completely past it someday, but if we don't I am learning how to work with it.

GEL

I am asking the universe for a friend I guess

I just wanted to post that since I wrote this, GEL has offered to email, I was invited to get together this weekend with a couple of college friends that I haven't seen in ages and another old college friend who now lives in New York sent me a really nice email out of the blue.

Coincidence?

Heather,

It's just simply putting yourself out there

GEL

I haven't done anything differently and the invitations seemed to come out of nowhere.

My son got sick yesterday and so was not able to go to the party however. But the good news is that my MIL offered to babysit him so that I could go. And D3 really wanted to see the baby (the hostess has a six month old), so her and I went to the party together. We had a great time and I was glad I brought her even though it would have been sort of nice just to go and be alone for a couple of hours too.
I lost touch with the hostess years ago and so was really glad to catch up. She lives about three miles from me, which I didn't know. So, we'll be hanging out again soon.
The friend who invited me to the party asked about Matt and I, asked if we were still sleeping in separate beds. I said yes. We talked about how long it's been and I said I don't know how I would feel if I were him. She asked if we'd been to counseling and I said yes but he quit going because he said he needed to see more commitment from me. She asked why he said that and I said because I've told him that if things don't change, I will not live like this forever and I've been on the verge of leaving for a really long time. That was the extent of the conversation because it wasn't the time or place to talk about it. But I did leave the conversation feeling really shameful again. She really doesn't know me well enough to know this personal aspect of my life, but she does know it. She knows because she was one of the first people I called when H threw me out of the house that horrible day. Did you guys see Grey's Anatomy Thursday? That flashback where the wife cheated on McDreamy and he threw her out of the house? That scene was heart wrenching for me....the similarities were astounding except for the part where he let her back in and said 'you stay, I'll go'. That compassionate part never happened to me, lol. I didn't have a best friend or a close family member to go to. I was like a lost ship sailing at sea and I probably told 5 people that morning because I didn't know who to call or where to go and she was one of those five people I told. So, she really doesn't know me all that well, like to know the problems that have gone on in our M or how out of character it is for me to do what I did. So, for her to know, but not know everything feels really cheap. I feel really cheap. And that's a really hard feeling to cope with.

On the M front, not a whole lot goes on when H is travelling. But the other night we were talking on the phone and I must have been talking about the crazy day we had or something, I can't remember, but H said "I'll trade ya" and I said "It's not about that" and he said "Yes it is, it's all about that, me getting to be with my kids".
The comment really bothered me and I've been short with him ever since. That sentence really sums up the past 5 years of our lives and he just doesn't GET it.
Could he really be that clueless about how much that statement would hurt me or does he say stuff like that on purpose?
Things like this really frustrate me because it makes me think he will never, ever change. He is just so aboslutely wrapped up with his kids, he doesn't even see the need for a wife, especially a wife who betrayed him. Is there any hope?!
And, you know, while I'm at it lol, I'm really sick and tired of him being 'woe is me, I have to travel and be away from my kids and they mean the world to me..boo hoo', why doens't he find something else? He doesn't even LOOK for another job. It's like the only way he would ever leave is if someone HANDED him a new job, like I'm trying to do at my company. Sometimes I just want to scream at him "NO, it isn't all about you being with your kids Matt or you WOULD be home with your kids, it's that simple".
Ugh.

Hey Heather!

Sorry to hear frustration is creeping up on you. I gotta ask, though, why are you worrying about this stuff? It's clear you're not going to leave. You're buying (building?) a new house with Matt. So focus on the positives...what you focus on expands. When you run across a negative see if there's another way of looking at it. It's not about making the right decision, it's about making the decision right, remember? You've decided. Now discard the pieces that get in the way of your happiness and emphasize the rest.

Even though we're (practically) divorced, Steff continues do the most irritating, bewildering things. She's nice most of the time, unless she's stressed, but...for example, she has a class one Saturday per month. I'm making plans for one weekend toward the end of October, so I've asked her what weekend her class is so I know when I need to watch the boys and I can plan around that. But she won't get back to me. I asked nicely three or four times. Then I asked her exasperatedly. Then I told her I was going to make my plans in three days whether she got back to me or not, which she says is pressuring her. She's the one who may need me to watch the boys on her weekend with them, why can't she tell me when she needs me? It's been two weeks and counting.

Who knows why? It's always something like this. Should I get spun up about it every week or do I just accept that this is who she is and this is how our R will be? If I hated it enough I could give up custody of the kids and move away, or possibly move away and do a summer/school year custody split, but it's hardly worth that. Nothing for it but to waste as little of my life on her issues as possible.

Matt's going to be exactly who he is. There's always hope he'll institute some changes and start acting more as you'd hope. Meantime, getting spun up by the kind of stuff he's always done isn't helping you, him, your M or your kids. You've found the most peace when you've put this kind of thing aside and focused on your own life and happiness.

Hey Burgbud,

I gotta ask, though, why are you worrying about this stuff?

I was really more hurt by his comment than worried about it. It hurt, it just did.

It's clear you're not going to leave.

You say that like you're disappointed in me I'm taking it day by day. I spoke with my C about this the last time I was there and I'll tell you what I told her. H has said he needs me to be more committed to him. That statement along with some other things he's said point to him needing to know that I am in this M with both feet. There were a couple of things I was holding out on because I *wasn't* in the M with both feet, i.e. building/buying a house and possibly getting him a job at the same company as me. If things aren't going well in a M, there are some very valid rasons not to do either and I was looking at it from that angle. But if you're trying to make the M work, there may be some very valid reasons to do both. So, I decided to really try to give him what he's said he needs. I know this will put me in a more difficult position later if things in the M do not improve. But, I'm trying to have faith. It's a 180 for me

So focus on the positives...what you focus on expands.

I really do believe this is true. I'm half way through the movie 'What the Bleep do We Know?!' and it's really interesting. I read the book "ONE" by Richard Bach many years ago and it was a good preface for a movie like this one. Watch it sometime if you're inclined.

It's not about making the right decision, it's about making the decision right, remember?

Right! And so, my decision to build, etc. I've got to give it a real try. I've talked to so many people who've made it through the rough times in their M and they all say that it takes TIME. Lots of time. We've got a good start on the time part I'm figuring

You've decided. Now discard the pieces that get in the way of your happiness and emphasize the rest.


One day at a time......some days I commit to my decision once again and other days I doubt it and like you said, I do try to discard those thoughts. They're useless. But I think I need to be aware and be realistic about how things are coming along.

Should I get spun up about it every week or do I just accept that this is who she is and this is how our R will be?

I see your point. There is a major difference though as you get to limit the effect Steff has on your life now that she's no longer in it on a daily basis. Reconciling is a really tough road and every day seems to require a new commitment to my purpose. H's actions can really impair my abilty to recommit each day, lol.

You've found the most peace when you've put this kind of thing aside and focused on your own life and happiness.

Right you are my friend.

I did tell H that he hurt my feelings with his comments. I figured the passive aggressive shortness with him needed to stop and I needed to be honest about my feelings, so I told him. He apologized and said it wasn't his intention to hurt my feelings. I said it was two-fold-first his specific exclusion of me when he said it was all about him getting to be with his kids and second when he made it sound like he would be fine with seeing me gone and having to travel if it meant he would get to be with the kids. I don't want to trade places with him and I wouldn't. I don't want to travel and be away from my kids, therefore I don't. So, talk about trading places doesn't make any sense to me. Anyway, bottom line, he apologized and said he didn't mean to hurt my feelings that it was more of a misunderstanding than anything. I felt better after we talked.

Then on the way home from my SIL's house tonight something weird happened that I just don't even know how to feel about. It was quarter to nine and H hadn't called yet, which is odd b/c D3's bedtime is 8:30. H didn't answer his phone so I left the following voicemail: "Hey, it's me. It's quarter to nine and it seems weird you haven't called yet. We're on the way home from SIL's and I plan to put the kids straight to bed, so hopefully you get this and call back soon. Bye".
A few minutes later my phone rings. It's H. It's lound, he's obviously in a bar. My mind races. Today's Sunday, he watched the football game at a bar today....the game started at 1pm and they are an hour behind, which means he's been in the bar for nearly 7 hours. OMG. Ok, I have no proof of that. I just sit there. He's guilty, I can tell by the way he's acting. I said "The kids will not be able to hear you, why don't you call back when it's more convenient for you?" He said ok or something equally weak and I hung up. A few minutes later he calls me again and it's quiet. He says something, I can't even remember what honestly because it was so obvious he was drunk. I said "H, you're drunk. Why don't you go back and finish your party and you can talk to the kids tomorrow?" He tried to say something about being cut out and couldn't even get his words out because he was so drunk. I said "OMG, you can't even speak.....I can't hear this" and I hung up. I turned my phone off and unplugged my home phone when we got home.

Drinking like that is really not a negotiable issue for me. I feel a little outside of myself at the moment.

Thanks for stopping by Burgbud.

So, for her to know, but not know everything feels really cheap.
...
You say that like you're disappointed in me

You're in a tough sitch and it would help to develop some thicker skin. My guess is not as many people are judging you as you think.


I'm taking it day by day.

So, I decided to really try to give him what he's said he needs.

I'm struggling to rectify the idea that you're taking it day by day but at the same time you're in the M with both feet. It doesn't matter what I struggle with, though, what matters is that you're clear about it so that your life has direction. Are you clear on how you're in the M with both feet while at the same time taking it day by day?


I'm half way through the movie 'What the Bleep do We Know?!' and it's really interesting. I read the book "ONE" by Richard Bach many years ago and it was a good preface for a movie like this one.

I enjoy Richard Bach's books very much. I was looking into that movie some months ago but some internet research on Ramtha and JZ Knight made me cautious: Wikipedia entry


There is a major difference though as you get to limit the effect Steff has on your life now that she's no longer in it on a daily basis.

Heh. If only.

The reality, however, is that there's little difference. We can both limit the effect our partner has on our lives (in your case, from within your M...I'm not talking about leaving). Doing so costs us something. We either pay that cost or deal with the effects. Getting spun up because these people are still who they've shown themselves to be time and again isn't good.

I don't know what to tell you about his drinking. Others are much more in tune with that issue than I am. I'm sorry that's on your plate along with everything else.

Good luck, heatherg.


Oh, and I meant to include this before, from a post Corri made in another thread not long ago:

"You are not powerless, Lou. Neither is Hairdog, or any other person here. We just all, for our own reasons, limit our own choices, by our own CHOICE. And then we get pissed at our spouses for it."

That goes along with the saying, "You can have anything you want, but you can't have everything you want." You choose to stay in your M (a decision I'm entirely neutral about, btw...it doesn't have anything to do with me...my 'rescue-y' days are over ). Now make your thoughts and actions consistent with that decision.

Are you clear on how you're in the M with both feet while at the same time taking it day by day?


I'm just not putting the pressure on myself that if I stay to work things out that I will always have to stay. That just isn't true. In the past, I've put a lot of pressure on myself as far as worrying about wasting too much of my <young> life with H. So, when I say I'm taking one day at a time, I'm not allowing myself to get too far into the future. I can't predict the future, so there's no point in trying to see possible outcomes/scenarios. For now, I am here because it's what feel right overall. But I've stopped telling myself 'it's now or never' because it's just not like that.

I was looking into that movie some months ago but some internet research on Ramtha and JZ Knight made me cautious:

Thanks, I'll check it out.

H called this morning and we exchanged a few sentences, pleasantly. I asked him if he had been at the bar since the football game yesterday. He said no, they left the game then went to get t-shirts at a brewery and ended up staying....a long time. And trying a bunch of different micro brews. I said 'you were pretty messed up'. He said 'yeah I was. It was stupid'. I said 'ok, well at least we're in agreement on that. I guess we can move past it now'. He said 'ok. It's been a loong time since I've been like that.' I said 'yes it has....and it didn't bring back very good memories to hear you sound like that. I don't like to see/hear you that way...for that matter I don't like to see/hear anyone that way.'

That was pretty much the end of it. But I feel better about it now. The communication thing really works when it works

Heather,

Your last post....doesn't sound like someone who is fully committed to their M to me. I don't mean to be nit-picky either...it just simply doesn't.

Saying this...."I'm just not putting the pressure on myself that if I stay to work things out that I will always have to stay." sounds to me like someone who is still giving themselves an OUT. It just doesn't "feel" like you are committed hon. It's a far cry from the words "for better or worse" dontchya think?

I believe I get where you are coming from, so don't think I'm just pounding away at ya here...I'm not. But, even saying something like "I'm taking one day at a time and doing the best I can in my M each day." sounds more committed than what you wrote.

I'm glad to hear though that you two at least had some pleasant communication about a touchy topic!

GEL

I know you're not nit-picking, it's pretty clear even to me that I'm still leaving myself an out. I also agree that it is a far cry from 'for better or worse'. I think I implied the wrong message with the following:

That statement along with some other things he's said point to him needing to know that I am in this M with both feet. There were a couple of things I was holding out on because I *wasn't* in the M with both feet, i.e. building/buying a house and possibly getting him a job at the same company as me.

My point wasn't necessarily that I am in the M with both feet now at this very moment, but that I am working toward it and trying to change my perspectives that were holding me back.

It will be a really long time before I stop planning my escape however subconsciously it may eventually become. I may never stop to be honest with you. I am very weary of where my R has been and though the progress has been slow, there has been progress because I know that if my M went back to where it was, I would leave. I am weary. That is the best way to describe it. The innocence in my R is gone and I now believe that 'for better or worse' is very subjective and not nearly as permanent as it's supposed to sound. Everyone has their limits and when things get to the 'worse' part, people typically know when their limits have been breached and their 'worse' has become a reality that they never imagined when they uttered the words. The innocene is just gone for me and I really wish it weren't because I do believe in the institution of M and I do believe in love. Unfortunately, I just let my R with my H get to a point where no R can return unscathed. Boundaries have been crossed, respect has been shunned and emotional/verbal abuse a common occurence. There is no way to say the 'for better or worse' to H again I don't think....I've been to the worse and wouldn't knowingly go back.

even saying something like "I'm taking one day at a time and doing the best I can in my M each day." sounds more committed than what you wrote.

Both statements are true. I am doing the best I can. I also give myself permission to leave if things start to go back to where they were.....if H starts to drink like he used to, if he puts his hands on me, if he tries to use the kids as ammunition against me. Looking back, I see that the long term price for those kinds of interactions are too high for both me and the kids.

I'm also giving myself an out if I find that H and I just can't reconnect. I don't want to live forever the way we are. If we cannot continue the forward movement, i.e. two years from now we are still in separate beds and he's still not wearing his rings.....then I've got to go. At that point, I've got to believe it would be for the best.

With that being said, I truly don't believe we'll still be in separate beds in two years. That belief is what gives me the strength to keep trying.