Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Infidelity/Extramarital Affairs/Jealousy Journaling: the continuation of my saga

Hi Rob, Wow you have had a LOT going on. I hope we can provide some support, don't forget to use us more often. I am glad that you continue in T, and even better that your W has started T also - that is a really big step. I really get that your W is really ill right now. Really ill. She could be damaging her throat and esophagus and stomach lining permanently with the bulimia, it is one of the most serious ED's and is so addictive. Most ED's are about feeling out of control and wanting to have control over something. And yet what they need most is to see your strength and firm boundaries. And do not be afraid of inpatient. It might be a really good thing for your W and for you. I can not even begin to imagine how stressful it must be in your home, all under the surface, like living with an alcoholic who tries to keep the drinking hidden. I remember distinctly taking my foster D's ED on, head on. Talking about it, looking under the bed for where she stashed the food hoping I wouldn't find it, back pack inspections every day, reports from my D about what foster D ate and didn't eat while at school (in front of her) - we were in her face. Nutritutionist, therapy, all of it, full on. However, I believe due to this, she recovered MUCH more quickly than she would have otherwise. She also knew that she coudn't stay with us if she didn't commit to getting well. Rob, you have a lot of leverage right now. Your W says she wants your family, wants to stay married. So what are your conditions for that to happen? Write it down. Get clear about that. How the OM thing must be handled (call to him with you present, elimination of cell phone, e-mail, etc., a promise to communicate to you every day for 6 months about thoughts re: him or attempted contacts, and any contact resets the 6 month clock, etc.), how the ED must be handled (inpatient, or see T 2 x per week for 1 year, keeping a purging diary to make it real or make it stop, etc. - check with the T) - what do you say, what do you do, what do the kids say when she eats like a horse and then spends 1/2 hour in the bathroom right after? Then, how the kids will be handled (what they will be told - I think honesty about this disease is important because they know anyway..., how they can help, freedom to talk about it instead of it being a secret, etc.) Anyway, see if you can get what it would take to make you give it another 6 months or another year with specific steps towards a healthier living environment. Because you do have a choice.

I believe that you are really hurt right now, and probably pretty tired. But I also believe that you maried your W and had children with her because you loved her. The OM thing is just another symptom of how self-destructive and messed up your W is right now. She is so messed up right now. What would it take for you to invest 6 more months? Or a year? Just to then reevaluate and decide again.

I believe you can do ths Rob. If your W had breast cancer, and was having a double mastectomy would you leave? When? Your W is currently mentally ill. Seriously. You will need lots of help to survive this though, and you will need clear lines so you will know when they have been crossed. You are the only one that knows where those lines are, about what you are willing and no longer willing to do or see or be subjected to. Your life matters, and your children's lives matter. But my guess is, with a little more support and a little additional compassion along with that hard earned detachment, you might be able to give it just a little more time to see if W is truly motivated now. Because it could be you and the kids are the best motivation she's got, and she may realize you are at the breaking point and she could lose everything. Don't think about 7 years of this. Think about what you need to happen RIGHT NOW to continue for a few more months. Then how long you will accept that level before you will want to re-evaluate again to see if there has been any progress and if you want to continue for a few more months. Think of this as YOUR bottom. Boundaries now Rob, for self preservation. Then look for the baby steps and reevaluate again. And see if that helps stir a little more patience. I am rooting for you, Rob. I know how you have been carrying this burden for a long time. You are doing such a great job holding your family together. Only you can decide when enough is enough. But I think you are emotional right now, because of the OM thing. Give it just a little time, to where you are not pissed, dissapointed and hurt. Because the OM is not about you. It is just a symptom of your W's messed up head.

Meanwhile, make sure you are doing things for you - just for you. What are you going to do for yourself, that will feed and water your soul? Start there, that is the most important thing right now.

Thanks so much for writing. You are awesome, Rob. You have quite a few folks in your corner here. Hang in there

Wow PL, you ARE my biggest cheerleader and your response has really given me pause to reflect and think about a lot of things.

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I hope we can provide some support, don't forget to use us more often.

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Yeah, I have to admit that I kind of fell out of relying upon the vast support group here for a variety of reasons, but mostly because I wanted to spend as little time thinking about everything as I had in the past. This has been one of the hardest tests I've ever had to face in life and it was consuming me. It still does to some degree, but nothing like it has in the past year. After letting loose yesterday, it felt really good and I remember the value of the support network here, so I can hazard a guess that you'll see more of me in the near future

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I really get that your W is really ill right now. Really ill. She could be damaging her throat and esophagus and stomach lining permanently with the bulimia, it is one of the most serious ED's and is so addictive. Most ED's are about feeling out of control and wanting to have control over something.

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There is no doubt in my mind that she is seriously ill. The physical damage is something that concerns me greatly, especially since it has become so intense over the past few months. The way she looks after the purge is just enough to nearly make me cry....her eyes are all red and blooshot, her voice is raw. Just pitiful. I don't think I would have ever understood the addictive nature of it unless I had lived with it, it is mind boggling to me.

One of the things I did discuss with her is the fact that, basically, through recovery, she will have to learn to eat again. I mean its amazing to me that such a basic instict will have to be re-learned.

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I can not even begin to imagine how stressful it must be in your home, all under the surface,

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It is quite stressful for everyone involved I will grant you that, and my daughters are caught in the middle. Some of the things that really upset me with regard to this is the effect and impact she is having upon their development. This is a woman who used to be such an integral part of these girls' lives...a stay at home mommy who nutured them and gave them heaps of love. Right now, mommy is very distant emotionally and pysically...and your question regarding the children actually reminded me that I wanted to talk to their school counselor about the problem so that they are aware in the event that any odd behavior begins to crop-up.

While I'm not overly confrontational about the ED, I have stepped up my discussion of it with her. I don't want to come across as controlling or overbearing at this moment because I know that she will resist all efforts to control, but she knows that I have reached my limit and I think you're right. I believe at this moment I have more leverage right now than I've had throughout this whole ordeal to finally get her to recongize the severity of the situtation.

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So what are your conditions for that to happen? Write it down. Get clear about that. How the OM thing must be handled (call to him with you present, elimination of cell phone, e-mail, etc., a promise to communicate to you every day for 6 months about thoughts re: him or attempted contacts, and any contact resets the 6 month clock, etc.), how the ED must be handled (inpatient, or see T 2 x per week for 1 year, keeping a purging diary to make it real or make it stop, etc. - check with the T)

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Out of anything that I've read today or yesterday, and everything that I have thought about, this, as well as OT's suggestion of setting boundaries, has really hit home with me. I guess at some level I believe I owe it to her and my girls to evaluate what it will take for me to be a part of this and be real clear about what it will take for her to have that opportunity. Part of what scares me right now is the feeling that I'm not feeling at the moment (strange as it may sound). Yes, I am fed up. Yes I am tired. I want "me" back, the guy that had drive, could look towards the future. All that has been stripped because I allowed this situation to do that. There's a lot of resentment in that and I have to find it within myself to get over it, if I can.

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I believe that you are really hurt right now, and probably pretty tired. But I also believe that you maried your W and had children with her because you loved her. The OM thing is just another symptom of how self-destructive and messed up your W is right now. She is so messed up right now. What would it take for you to invest 6 more months? Or a year? Just to then reevaluate and decide again.
I believe you can do ths Rob. If your W had breast cancer, and was having a double mastectomy would you leave? When? Your W is currently mentally ill. Seriously. You will need lots of help to survive this though, and you will need clear lines so you will know when they have been crossed. You are the only one that knows where those lines are, about what you are willing and no longer willing to do or see or be subjected to. Your life matters, and your children's lives matter. But my guess is, with a little more support and a little additional compassion along with that hard earned detachment, you might be able to give it just a little more time to see if W is truly motivated now. Because it could be you and the kids are the best motivation she's got, and she may realize you are at the breaking point and she could lose everything.

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PL, I have to be honest with you, I think this is the part of your post that really has struck me because up until this point, I didn't even think that this would be an option, but reading this over and over again, I realize that you are so absolutely correct. Much of what I'm feeling right now has to do with the emotions of having OM rresurface and the betrayal that goes along with it and I've been doing my best to separate that from everything else. Honestly, this might be one of the first times that I have really stepped back and tried to evaluate the situation without the emotional attachment.

So yes, I think I need to give serious thought to what it will take for me to invest another chunk of my life in this, and maybe this whole situation can be viewed as a turning point in moving things forward instead of an end. I'm really having a tough time getting my thoughts together for this reply, but just know that reading your posting has sent my mind whirling (in a good way) and has had a hugely positive effect on me. Thank you.

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Thanks so much for writing. You are awesome, Rob. You have quite a few folks in your corner here. Hang in there

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No, PL. You are awesome and having you, along with GH and OT in my corner has been the best thing that's happened to me. I can't thank all of you enough for your support and guidance.

Hang in there Rob. Nice to have you back...sorta...well, you know what I mean.

GH

Yeah, well, don't take this the wrong way, but I'm not that ecstatic about being back, lol....not that the company here isn't great.

Well, I pretty much have given my sitch over to a higher source at this point. I pretty much laid it out to my W that the only way I can feel comfortable enough to continue on is if I know that OM is out of our lives and that she will committ to doing whatever it takes to get her self better. As to item one, I told her that I felt it was necesary for her to tell OM the things she had told me in a phone conversation that I could overhear. This pretty much became her line in the sand and she refused. So now that I've laid that out there, I'm pretty much stuck to that position. The truth is, I don't want to accept less and I don't feel that I should. Unfortunately for her, she doesn't see it this, but will offer no compromise in return. In other words, my course is clear. She is not out of the fog, despite wanting me to believe that she is. I've pretty much reached my limit here. She has said a million things about wanting this, wanting our life, but apparently she doesn't want to take steps necessary to show that. In my book, the actions speak louder than words and, well, I see no action.

So that's where things stand now. Not a good update, but an update nonetheless.

(((Rob)))

Don't know what to say, my heart goes out to you and this latest twist. I know we aren't supposed to say this, but perhaps it will be for the best. Go dark on your W; do things with your kids (without her), etc. I know your sitch is a little more complicated with the ED and all, but perhaps if you completely drop the rope, it will force your W to finally face things. You've set your boundary, now it will take more work on your part to let your W know you are serious about it.

Sorry I can't offer much more, as you know my life is too confusing for me to sort out let alone be of any damned good use to anyone else in the "advice" department!

But I did want to send the sunshine back to you today!
NM

Hi Rob,

I am so sorry to hear about this conversation. I am sure you are dissapointed. But it also clarifies where things stand. Now, what actions are YOU going to take? You set a boundary, how will you manage it? In order for W to respect you and your word, you must honor your boundary faithfully. Otherwise nothing you ever say will carry any weight again. I am so sorry that W wasn't as ready as you hoped she would be, to commit to the M. It could be she will need to lose the kids and you, to see that she needs to make some changes. Sometimes the rock bottoms are ugly. So, what's next?

So Rob, has she never done the "right" things in terms of working on your M, or is it just lately that things have spiraled?

The bottom line here is that I firmly believe that you have the right to decide that you are no longer willing to accept this R she has with OM and if she continues it, you will take certain action.

I too hate to hear this, especially after all this time thinking no news was good news.

All I can say is that make sure you take care of yourself. It seems to me like this point you are at can be a lot like the first bomb drop and just guard against making any decisions from emotion. Consider your "big picture" and decide things from the best place possible.

GH

NM, PL and GH

Thank you so much for checking in with me today, it means a lot.

Yes, it really does clarify where things stand and PL, you are absolutely correct that once that boundary has been set, I can't back away from it....but the point is, I didn't put the boundary out there without recognizing the consequences. I spent a good deal of time preparing myself for this outcome and, well, I'm not surprised.

So, what's the plan for me? At this point, I've really gone emotionally dark (actually not a leap, because I've been emotionally dark for about a couple of weeks) and now checking out my options for living arrangements. Unfortunately, I know my W will not leave the house and I cannot force her (because ostensibly she has nowhere to go) and we can't afford an apartment on her own. So, I may look into moving in with a friend of mine and sharing costs. I'm really not sure of what to do. I can't see staying in the same proximity with her for a variety of reasons so I feel that I must make a clean split (helps with emotional detachment I beleive)

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So Rob, has she never done the "right" things in terms of working on your M, or is it just lately that things have spiraled?

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You know GH, you put forth a good question to make me reflect. As it stood with OM, she never put forth the effort to assure me that he was out of our life. She would say that she knows that it has to end, but make no effort to do so.

I guess lately what really hurt was the fact that for the last six months, I literally thought OM was not the issue and that her ED was really most of the issue. I asked her on several occassions whether OM was part of the picture and that if he was, that was information I needed to know so that I may be able to understand what I was dealing with (depression, OM, ED). She emphasized on every occassion that he was NOT part of the picture.

Secondly, occassionally she would tell me that she wanted "our life back" wanted a new start, etc. In August, she told me that our beach trip was hopefully a new beginning for us...as it turns out, on all those occassions I never had a chance because she was always in contact with OM.

So, there were signs that maybe she was thinking about doing the right thing....but never put it into practice. Even to this day, she "wants me to think about what we had and could have" tells me that she loves me very much and I mean the world to her....tells me that she doesn't want us to split...tells me that she can't believe what's she's done....etc. All the words that I want to hear obviously, but without the corresponding actions. Since finding out about the phone, I asked whether she ever talked to OM to finally end things.....she said she gave him back the phone and told him that she couldn't do this anymore. Not a word more. Ostensibly, she hasn't talked to him since, despite me telling her that it was important for her to express the fact that she doesn't love him (what she told me....but apparently they exchange ILY's) because it really isn't fair to him. I have no idea what to believe or what to trust.

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It seems to me like this point you are at can be a lot like the first bomb drop and just guard against making any decisions from emotion. Consider your "big picture" and decide things from the best place possible.

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Well, at some level, any decision we make will always have some level of emotion attached to it, but yes, I understand what you are saying. I've spent the last few weeks just trying to separate my emotional response from my rational response. It took some time because I had huge reserves of anger and resentment, but in the end, I know that I deserve more and that she will never respect my boundaries because in the past I've always wavered them in the hopes that she would finally see her way clear.

So what is the "big picture?" I really don't know at this point. My girls are going to be devastated, family and friends will be shocked (but not totally taken aback), our house will have to be sold and possessions split up.

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The bottom line here is that I firmly believe that you have the right to decide that you are no longer willing to accept this R she has with OM and if she continues it, you will take certain action.

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This is an interesting point that I wanted to expound upon because in my experience, my W doesn't "get" that its a personal boundary and not an ultimatum. For her, if I set a boundary or exress true opinion on something, it becomes either a total criticism of "her" as a person or I'm trying to control her. Unfortunately, that's not the case and I've explained it to her that just by exrpessing what I see as a boundary, does not necessarily mean that she has to follow it, that's her decision....but know that the decision she makes will have repurcussions upon what I consider acceptable. A strange distinction, but a necessary one that she doesn't quite grasp. Unfortunately, a LOT of this stems from her mindset and the ED because to her, everything is a power struggle. SIGH

So, again, thank you for checking in and I'll be sure to keep you all up to date as things develop. Know that while I'm disappointed that things are where I want them to be, I'm a better person for going through this process.

Have a good weekend!

So not a whole heck of a lot has transpired on the R front....since my last post, I have been basically dark emotionally from W, keeping my distance and trying to get perspective on what the next step in my life is going to be. You know, I would give anything to go back about three years in my life and have the knowledge that I have now....well, I'm sure just about everyone feels this way.

So, Satruday night, my W is getting ready for work and we got into a discussion of sorts about everything and nothing at all (these are the worst conversations and really are so unproductive), but the gist of it was a rant on my part. Okay, not so productive, but damn, I really was a bit angry about the whole situation that has transpired over the course of one year. Well, as the conversation unfolds, I get hit with this statement from my W: "Everyone has turned their backs on me and now, your no exception." Needless to say, I was floored...granted, she understood that my distance was in direct reaction to her inability to commit and so forth, but still this really struck me. I, of course, reminded her that everything that was currently affecting her in her life was, on some level, her decision and that she alone held the key to making things right for herself.

So, this conversation really didn't get us anywhere further than any other had. Yesterday morning, my W brings up the topic of her eating disorder and once again ackowledges how much it has drained the life out of her. At this point, she recognized that she really needs serious help, perhaps more intense help than just regular therapy. she admitted that she is ready to take even the next step of very intensive help and has now expressed great interest in seeking inpatient therapy!

So today, she talked with her therapist and has got a referral to several in the area. Basically, it looks like we have some options and W has taken some VERY positive steps to moving forward. If all goes well, she could be well on the her road to recovery within the next week or two.

This is a major step for her and I'm so proud of her for doing it. I realize that, for the time being, our R must be put on hold, but this is so much more important than that at this point.

Well, I will provide more details as they become available, I just wanted to let everyone know that progress is being made.

Rob