last sex was several weeks ago - at that time, wife told me I needed to be more sure of my self and confident. of course, we know how it is being a HD person in a LD relationship where you have been told no 80% of the time for 17 years - how could anyone have confidence.
so, now she is pretty much telling me that she can't get in the mood unless I'm sure of myself.
So, I'm trying. This sunday I came to her early in the day and told her in no wishy washy way that I WANTED HER - and she seemed pretty happy with it... okay, so far so good. Then as the evening rolls around we're waiting for kids to go to bed and watching tv. She is snuggled up to me and I'm thinking things are progressing nicely. We go upstairs, she takes a bath and comes to the bedroom and locks the door - yep, everything is progressing nicely... she climbs in bed and I start to move toward her - BAMM - end of "everything going nicely" - she is totally no desire. Just laying there... I offer to rub her back, etc... she just gets more moody and distant. Pretty soon, I looks what "mood" I had and now we're just laying there. I so much want to just say F--- it and leave the room. But, I stay and try to get her to talk. And here is what she says...
I can't believe all night long you just sat there in that chair by me watching TV and never did anything. Didn't you have a hundred ideas running through your head? Wasn't there anything you wanted to do? I know you have more imagination than that... don't you have any fantasy's? I can't get in the mood when you just roll over here and say "hey it's time" - I need you to do something earlier to set the mood...
GEEZ - I guess that just goes to prove that anything that happens more than 48 hours ago should be forgotten (I'm still holding on to something she said in a fight a year ago - she said "I don't care if you have fantasy's - count me out - I have no desire to fullfill any of them... I like myself just the way I am and have no desire to change." )
So, we did end up having a good time after all the talking I got more confident and went for it... then afterwords we talked and she said that she needs me to be more inventive and open - YET... understanding that she is definately NOT as sexual as I am and I should not hit her with unrealistic goals. I explained to her that my sex drive goes in ups and downs so I am not always a sex nut.
Also, last comment - she thinks that if we communicate about sex or she tells me what she wants or likes then she is "giving me instructions - leading me by the hand" and that turns her off. So, instead I'm supposed to just DO IT - TAKE HER like a man and be ready for her to either like it or get pissed.
Well, unfortunately I can relate to what your wife did here. So the upside is, your wife is not alone in the unrealistic and selfish manner in which she is behaving. It must be quite common!!! I can say that about her because I did quite similarily to my H! Wrongfully!
She is looking for you to push her buttons. The problem is that they are forever changing and can't be counted on. She is looking for you to read her mind. But that cannot be done...especially a woman's mind!
I think what some of the women have said here is true and this may be what they mean. Women have to take responsibility for their sexuality. We can't leave our H guessing...we have to express what we'd like or want. Find a way to do it if you can't come out and say it. Email it!!! That works well...maybe ask her to do that.
I'd get mad at my H because he wouldn't hold my hand ...that was dumb. I should have just held his! As well as taken the same stance in the bedroom.
Ok, well that doesn't really help you. You are not alone in what you face. I can say that I saw the light...and continue to see the light...I haven't arrived.
If you wife had other women who had "gotten wise" to talk to...that would probably be the greatest help!
I know it is frustrating. It doesn't mean that she doesn't love you...it means she doesn't have a clue as to how selfish she is being. But don't tell her that!!!! And even though you have every right to be mad....expressing in anger will only make her defensive and distance the two of you.
Is she willing to read? I read some things on this site recently that Michelle and others posted that dealt with this very thing. Maybe you can kindly give her something to read telling her that other women have had to deal with the same things.
Whatever you can do to kindly communicate to her what you are feeling...
I'm so sorry...keep at it! Don't stop trying or communicating what is going on with you...love her, but do what you can from your heart and don't try and jump through the hoops to please her...you never will!!!!
Wow - that entire post was freaky. That is me and my H. Just this week we had the whole "work up" to the sex and then when the moment came, I did exactly what your W did, lost all momentum. And I'm the HD, he's the LD. But I really don't think that is the issue. It just the way the two people are "clicking" or not. Sounds like this has been a pattern for you for most of your M, as it has been in mine. I know you have more imagination than that... don't you have any fantasy's? I can't get in the mood when you just roll over here I've said as much to my H. And his answer was no about the fantasies she said "I don't care if you have fantasy's - count me out - I have no desire to fullfill any of them... I like myself just the way I am and have no desire to change." ) Ouch. Well, my H has not come out and said exactly that but when he was in his depression he came close. So, we did end up having a good time after all the talking I got more confident and went for it That's good! We weren't so lucky. she thinks that if we communicate about sex or she tells me what she wants or likes then she is "giving me instructions - leading me by the hand" and that turns her off. So, instead I'm supposed to just DO IT - TAKE HER like a man and be ready for her to either like it or get pissed. I have said that exact thing to my H! Women...we're difficult. We want it the way we want it and if it feels "off" we can lose desire, even HD's. I have no words of wisdom just throwing some empathy your way, for you and your W. It's hard to sustain a strong sexual connection, especially if it has been strained throughout the M. People do get Bored with each other. That's the reality of most M SL. It takes lots of work. I think couples are often afraid to talk about that obvious fact, boredom. So she is giving you clear advice. Take charge. I have told my H this so many times and he rarely can manage to assert himself enough to pull it off. Maybe that is your problem too. Just speculating. Do you feel like you can do what she asked, "do it - take her like a man?" I think a lot of women have that fantasy/desire. I know I do. Sigh.
Hey Geek- what did you decide about that morning when your wife was telling the long story and you and your D needed to leave for school/work? You didn't give us any feedback on that (if you did, and I missed it, I apologize).
Interesting that you said you are a HD woman and have that same tendency as Geek's W. I couldn't say so..as that is not my label.
I think that for those who are married for a long time that there can be cycles to a marriage. Boredom is one of them. But I also think that when couples "grow through" the boredom that is when M gets good! Because if you get past that stage...each one is basically thinking of how they can give to the other one. At least the marriages that are happy and not just surviving. We are not living in that place, yet, but we've gone there some.
Interesting that even a HD woman faces some of the same issues. Wow! How honest...
So, Geek yours is not an isolated thing...neither are you flawed in your approach....some of us women just keep moving the hoops...
I thought I posted... maybe I typed up a long answer, didn't like it and erased it... can't remember. Anyway, she did say that she was a jerk for holding us so long and I did say that we could have made more time for her to share. My main issue with that entire issue was not what she did - it was that she is a hypocrite a lot of the time. She treats me in ways that she would never allow me to do to her... for example... I cannot count the times that I would be in mid-sentence and she would say "HEY. I gotta go... I'm gonna be late...bye..." yet, if I do the same to her, she gets upset. Sometimes everything is a one-way street with her.
Quote: I can't believe all night long you just sat there in that chair by me watching TV and never did anything. Didn't you have a hundred ideas running through your head? Wasn't there anything you wanted to do? I know you have more imagination than that... don't you have any fantasy's? I can't get in the mood when you just roll over here and say "hey it's time" - I need you to do something earlier to set the mood...
here's an idea for you. but first let me make sure I have this straight. She wants you to be more take charge, more "confident" but you're hesitant because after all the "no's" you're not sure what she wants and doesn't. Am I right?
So here is what you do. (First- let me say that while you were on the couch you were probably thinking this was nice, but she was probably thinking "he said he wanted sex- this would be the perfect time for his hand to slip under my shirt, but he's just sitting there....)
Ask her if she would mind a night of experimentation. No sex planned, just a one on one night where she can help you get to know her body, so when sex does happen, you can feel more in charge.
Then you do the...
do you like me to kiss you here? neck, ear, arm, back, navel.....
do you like when I rub you here.... or here.... or here....
does this feel good to you? harder, softer.....
Can I try a running a feather down your back, arm, leg, chest....? (have a feather ready)
Ask questions like if we're snuggling would you like me to put my hand on your back under your shirt?
When you tilt your head like this... is it a cue to kiss your ear?
Is there a cologne/ that turns you on? (FYI- vanilla smell is supposed to be a major aphroziac. burn vanilla scented candles. I have vanilla lotion and body spray!)
Do you get cold during sex? (H knows to turn the heat up a few degress to make me more comfortable)
Would you like me to say things like..... during the day? (for example, my H used to say "man, you're sexy when you dry off" after i got out of the shower-- that was him dropping a hint. If I felt I could be in the mood later, I'd give him a kiss thank you, or do a sexy pose, or whatever.... but if not, there'd be no real reaction. But maybe after a sexy phone call or email he might have changed my mood. then a foot rub, doing the dishes for me.... That would be a get lucky night for him )
Whatever......... see if she'll have a night of just that with you. Or even an hour.
then try for another hour for actual sexual preferences. Do you like this position, is this how or this??? Have you ever wanted to try being tied up, or some Kama Sutra positions, or toys......
Tell her that you understand that she doesn't want to SAY things to you, but you're having trouble reading her hints and cues during sex. When you do this.... does it mean it felt good keep going or stop you're ruining the mood?
Sometimes an "Ouw" and an "ahh" can sound the same.
Quote: she did say that she was a jerk for holding us so long and I did say that we could have made more time for her to share.
Wow, that was really good.
Geek, correct me if I'm wrong, but something in the tone of your posts reminds me of me in the following way: there is a part of me that just wants to prove my bf WRONG. Part of me always seems to have an "open case" where I'm collecting evidence against him, as in, "see, there he goes again, I KNEW he didn't really care," or "he does THAT to me, but if I ever did THAT to him, he'd blow a fuse!" Does that sound like you?
I'm not saying she does or doesn't do the stuff you've mentioned, but it seems to me that you are collecting evidence against her-- for what purpose? To have a reason to be distant? To have a reason to leave her? Or just for the satisfaction of proving her demanding, wrong, a hypocrite?
Believe me, all of what I've just written could apply to me, too. I feel like that when I first met my bf, my heart was totally open, and one little thing after another just pushed it more and more closed... and now I do go around ranting in my head about how he's this and he's that.
Having said all that, I don't know what to do with my attitude. It's true, just as I'm sure it's true with your W, that she corrects stuff that you do that she does all the time. You seem to have a chip on your shoulder-- justified or not, and it probably IS justified-- and it's so hard to make progress toward intimacy when that chip keeps getting in the way. I'm kind of stuck here, too.
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