Even though you wrote the above for HD, I am going to say you brightened my day. Your writing skills and imagination are wonderful.
Many perfectly normal vomen vould lof to be wit a man who vants sex four times a day This part I believe might be true, I just never met any IRL. I am working on getting BB to like four times a month.
Good. Seems H enjoys the chocolate cake more when it's freshly frosted and sitting under tinfoil on the stove...taking his own initiative sneaking pieces when no one else is watching...
Than when someone else takes the initiative and serves it on a plate to him after every meal, whether he's stuffed/not hungry after dinner or not.
The less enthusiastic he is, the more my ego-alarm bells go off and I shut down, become resentful, get frightened and basically completely lose my sense of otherness (FOO, ex-H blah blah blah).
- Very good, Karen. You're seeing your projection. You don't really know the level or origin of his inner enthusiasm/interest so it must be YOU, righht?
And "frightened." Fear. Fear is on the opposite end of anger. Anger is controlling/lashing out. Fear is feeling out of control/feeling lashed/powerless. And fear is an self-esteem issue (as is anger )...insecurity. Over what? His "enthusiasm," Something you will never control. Good you're seeing this, so you can work to shore up your self-confidence. ie, "It's his mood/way of responding; it's not me or my attractiveness/sexiness."
You both bump insecurities "crashing" I think BF terms. His is feeling pressured to perform at a frequency and level to meet your expectations; yours is taking very personally his lack of perceived interest from time to time as an indictment on your sexuality.
Kinda feed off each other kwim? His performance etc. insecurity causes him to avoid initiation and feeds his lack of confidence; your insecurity as a result of his subsequent inactions cause you to shut down and resent...which circles back to him thinking he's letting you down in the SL when his unconscious witnesses your subsequent shutting down/resentment.
In short, you both think it's own self being externally repellent to the other but it's actuallly the OP's inner insecurity/lack of self-confidence that the OP has to deal with internally.
And good on the not chasing. His recent verbalizing LM times etc. to you and getting cranky when you pressure tells me he likes to feel like the one who leads/steers the SL and not the W. We all like to feel like our women are the satisfied passive receivers from time to time. "That's right. I keep her nice n happy/content, if you know what I mean."
I think the last thing an M wants to hear is the buddy saying to other Ms, "Hey, guys, guess what? 'John's' W is unhappy because he doesn't give it to her good enough/as often as she likes."
(usually immediately followed by an smarta$$ yelling out, "I'll give it to her if she wants. I'm all man, baby.")
Again, H came to bed and said "I really want to go to bed early on Monday night so we can have sex but it won't last long because...well, you know and then maybe Thursday." Of course, I said that sounds great, what's wrong with now? He said too tired, blah, blah, blah. This is progress. I really don't think that these were empty promises. H doesn't do too much empty promising. If he doesn't follow through I will have to say something but for now, this is progress and the best part is that I didn't prompt it...
- Yes, nice. And it seems like H has a bit of an issue with "creating the mood." Meaning, hearing you say "what about now" maybe makes him feel emasculated again that he isn't the manly man setting you up for the mood.n "Aw, dangit, Karen, you're making it feel contrived now."
Kinda the inverse of why an F hates it when she hears an M "ask" her if she will have sex with him, instead of just asserting himself and taking/seducing her with overpowering (but very respectful) lust/confidence.
In the past when I have had this happen I have thanked H, told him how much it means to me or something like that. Well, I have learned that to H this kind of "praise" actually sends a negative/evalutative message of some kind. Anyone have a suggestion for showing "appreciation" without having that kind of message.
- Yes. I see it. Draws too much attention. Almost like you're so desperate (not saying you are) for his sexual "kindness" that your praises for his IOU kind of makes him feel "icky" and self-conscious for putting you in this "thank you thank you thank you"grateful posture.
Maybe your solution can be not to say anything when he rain checks for a certain day.
Or, better perhaps ann sexy-voiced, "Thursday works for me, baby." Followed by an nice kiss. Then dropping it until the set upon hnight.
What this does:
Gets you both on an equal partner plane/decision-making basis and steers away from the power-imbalanced roles of grateful wanting-sex supplicant and the evil stingy sex giver.
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
So Friday and Saturday night the baby was miserable, wouldn't go to sleep and H said in frustration - gee, I had hoped we would have sex tonight
Karen... <gasp> but its sooooooo late. and the baby... how could we possibly have sex with all these distractions?
It still seems to me Karen that for whatever reason your H has in his head, consideration of you--in his opinon (dont bother karen with y pesky sexual urges), needing things to be 'just so', whatever the reason, he gets 'thrown off'.
His stumble, sexual immaturity?, deprivation of self, throws you into your blah blah blah that you mentioned.
something like the above would come from a place of confidance in your own attractiveness and help H see that, (hehe that is kinda silly) it doesnt have to be.
Then he had a "chat" with DD and we decided she needed to cry it out a bit. Her sleep cycle has been disrupted with the vacation and she isn't on track again yet. So, on Sunday night we put her down and she cried about 35 minutes and slept ALL NIGHT.
OMG!!! You just let the baby cry? THAT IS SOOOO mean.
I really enjoyed this. Thanks for sharing it. Seriously I watch my nephews fairly often and in the beginning there would often be this very basic, 'testing' and requirement to do what they need. Set the boundary.
Yes - indeed DD needed a boundary set. We ARE MEAN! This is normal after vacations with little ones. Last night she cried all of ten minutes then just played in her bed until she fell asleep.
DH did make good on his promise to ML. I had fallen asleep in front of the basektball game (which my alma mater won BTW) and we went to bed when the game was over. H started teasing me about going to sleep during such an important game. This is a typical initiation for H - he talks about inconsequential stuff in order to work up to things. It wasn't great sex, he seemed tired but it was nice nonetheless. It meant the world to me that he is making more effort.
We had a short talk about how the fertility meds and such will affect my moods, the amount of support from him that I will need etc... H did seem to get it and is taking a balanced view of just how deep into the fertility stuff we want to go. What is better is that he mentioned how he recognizes our need to spend more time together and mentioned several occasions coming up when he had given thought to us potentially spending time overnight etc... Of course, H is still thinking that we have to be totally alone in a secure location to get private time but I guess that is just how he thinks of it. He doesn't think to take a walk together on a Friday night with baby in the stroller or run out for ice cream for an hour on a weeknight while the big ones watch the little. He just has difficulty navigating the momentum of life.
BF - I like your suggestion to tease him a little. Maybe if I start saying things like "we couldn't possibly..." - HE might start suggesting what we could possibly...
We are going away for a weekend in a few weeks. I am thinking of suggesting that Friday night is my night to lead the sexual festivities and Saturday is his. I am thinking of directly asking him to plan a sexual surprise. Of course, I do have reference books on the shelf if he needs an idea or two.
It also occurs to me that H is feeling generally manlier right now - he has lost weight, he is training for his next triathlon, he has gone on vacation, he has bought a new/used car for me that is roomier and he has knocked himself out to detail it, new sound system etc...so it will be nice for my hour each way commute. It seems that when he feels that he has his ducks in a row he feels a lot freer to romance me. When he feels he has done his husband/partner bit he feels freer to have sex.
I still don't know what to do with the praise bit. I think maybe I do best giving him some kind of sexually oriented compliment as a thank you e.g. Next day, "C'mere you big hunk and give me a kiss" or "Don't look at me that way, you already wore me out last night" (ok- this last one is a stretch but you get the idea).
Well, my foster son through M and his wife had their third baby. So...I am a fourth time over foster-grandma. The baby is bee-you-tee-ful! He isn't named yet so we've all just been calling him Bob - all the family babies from 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 are all calling him Bob as well. I don't know what his name will be but Bob will stick as a knickname.
Ex-H is in town due to non-payment of child support court hearing. Having him pick up the kids etc...is always tense and I hate it.
H was really interesting this evening. As we were getting ready to go to hospital to see baby H asked me why I was plucking my eyebrows and I said "so they have a pleasing shape" and he said "your azz has a pleasing shape" to which I said "you can't see it from the front" and he said, "yeah but I can picture it in my head which I do often." I said, "Watch it or we won't make it to hospital to see the baby" and he said, "don't tempt me." A few short minutes later the phone rang and it was my sexually inappropriate boss calling to whine about his divorce and the front door bell rang and it was ex-H to show off his under-employed, spending all day at the gym self. Later, H started fussing about how boss and ex-H can't go around demanding my time at home etc... Then he said, "BTW this is me being jealous in case you weren't sure." Folks, you could have knocked me over with a feather. First, a compliment about my azz then an admission of having random sexual thoughts involving me AND actual jealousy on my behalf. How about that sh!t?
H also took off work tomorrow to hold my hand in court. The value of this cannot be described.
For any who wonder why I hang on, why I believe it can be better, why I love him and why I would be willing to have another (fourth) child with him - well, all of that above says it. I do love him so. Of course, I just love him best naked and sweaty - is that so wrong?
Karen
PS Looks like I missed a lot of excitement on this board. It will be interesting to see who chooses to stick it out and learn something and who really was here just to stir up trouble.
So to paraphrase your H: [Your eyebrows have a pleasing shape? Hell, your a$$ has an pleasing shape...and I picture it in my head quite often.]
But...like...weren't you just...like...saying how H never compliments you? LOL
Karen's H? Are you reding this MB, you crafty lurker? Hmmmm? Come out, come out wherever you arrre...
Great stuff Karen.
Ohhh, yeah. About the boss calling the house to bitch about his D? Um...
Maybe he can go tell it to the guys down at his local pub?
Boss and x in H's face. Nice he has an sense of humor about it too. See? I told you he notices OP complimenting you, whether verbally or emotionally. Like Fs, Ms have an innate spidey sense of their Fs drawing unsolicited attention from other Ms. Just less reactive than Fs usually
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
About the boss calling the house to bitch about his D...
This is totally out of bounds and your boss knows it. If he doesn't, then he should because as a manager he probably had harrassment awareness training. I think you should very diplomatically tell him you do not care to listen to his problems, though you feel for him. If he persists, take it up with human resources.
If you do not, you run the risk of becoming part of this little secret. If things ever get nasty and you go to a lawsuit, the first thing his lawyers will ask you is why you didn't go to HR. There is surely a policy in place that tells you to do this, which you probably read. So any future allegations against your boss will become watered down. You are letting him back you into a corner and it will only get harder to get out.
Yeah - my boss is a NUT! I am his second in command so I get all the personal crap interspersed with business while having a "supervision". Strangely, we have no sexual harrassment policy in our policy and procedure manual. I know we are still governed by the law in that area in general. My boss (and the CEO) has a long history of riding the line on that. I will just have to reset the boundary about whining at me when I am off the clock.
Stig - hardly recognize my H lately (in a good way). This guy reminds me of the H I dated. I am loving it and when I get home today I am giving him a big, giant hug with no expectations attached. H met me at court, we hammered out an agreement about exH's arrears, child support amount etc...and H couldn't have been more wonderful.
pardon me for barging, but why the IUI? been there, done that...6 times, actually...and more. Off the subject, i know, and NOMB, too. Do you have a diagnosis? I have to say, your sitch seems foreign to me, ("into the looking glass"), having spent alot of time in infertility message boards, and living that whole roller-coaster. (if you're just getting started with this, you're in for quite a ride.) Anyway, I found it more typical among the IF wives to whom I've spoken to be in the LD camp. (so much so, I have to wonder why THEY are wondering why they're not conceiving. hello?) So many threads on how to optimize conception chances with the least possible amount of sex. (I kid you not). Very difficult for the likes of me (HD), but I figured it was par for the course, I guess. anyway, you certainly won't have that problem, but boy, I could write a book. imagine getting it once a month, governed by the date on the calendar, so we can make a baby. not "'cuz I like you". ugh...the memories... anyway, I'm babbling. Just wanted to say good luck...AND more importantly, tread carefully with this. It ain't all peaches and cream for the guys, even though it seems like it. I dare say the whole experience really messed me up big time. Its bad enough having your SL governed by your spouse...worse to be governed by a "thing" (the infertility), or a 3rd party ("the docs"). yikes. Maybe worse for a SS-HDH who's already resentful enough...but I suspect it could possibly be an issue for any guy, hd or ld. anyway, just a "heads up"..and if I can be of any help, let me know.
(oh, and we were eventually sucessful w/ ivf..one 3yo DS...after 3+ years of hell. Loooong story!).
I am lucky enough to have three biolgical children who were easily conceived. Two were from a prior M. The diagnosis is advanced maternal age - 38 and low morphology (H). We have been having timed intercourse for one year with two chemical pregnancies and one miscarriage so it looks like we need some help. I don't think the timed intercourse has helped the SSM problem. H loves children and would dearly like another. I love children and am willing to go for limited medical intervention. I doubt we will go as far as IVF and I know we aren't interested in donor stuff since we are already parents - we have many teen/young adult foster kids too. Some live with us and some don't. We aren't the "typical" infertile couple. We aren't the typical family. Nothing is typical about us. I feel guilty for even being in the RE office because I have had friends go through it all and it is terrible. Glad you had success.
Well all - despite obvious exhaustion H continues with the sexual innuendo. I am a happy girl.
due to non-payment of child support court hearing. Having him pick up the kids etc...is always tense and I hate it.