Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Divorced, But Not Done Help! STBX said he wants to give us another try!

I need help! STBX just called this morning from his work and said he wants to give us another try. But he ASSUMES I am open to that idea. He did say "...if you are okay with that", but I know he knows that I will always consider this option.

He did say that it would take a lot of work and he said "and I know, most of that is me, Hoping, I know that", but he said he wants to give us another try "for the sake of S3...., and for you". ??? He did not say that he realized that he loved me or anything. Is it dangerous to get back together like this? Please advice!

A little background...
S3 and I came back from the ski trip yesterday. While we were up there at the ski resort, my cell phone did not work (no signals), but apparently STBX called three times during our trip. I think he wanted to be the one who takes S3 to his first ski trip, and must have missed him so much.

Anyway, soon as we entered the house, the house phone rang, and it was STBX. He said "I called you several times...", so I said "my cell phone did not work up there". He asked how the trip was, so I said it was fun. Then I asked him how his weekend was, and he just said "it was okay", in his depressing voice.

Then he was supposed to bring the dog back home (I asked him to take care of our dog while we were gone), and he said "Hoping...., I have a pasta sauce I made...., can I bring it over and have dinner there? Do you have pasta and parmesan cheese?" I was surprised by his request, but pretended I was affected by his statement, and simply said "sure, that's fine, I have pasta and cheese".

He came over, kissed S3 all over saying he missed him. Then he saw the roses I received from a guy for Valentines day (they are still beautiful and I had them on the table), and said "these are nice flowers, Hoping. Who gave you them?" So I said "my friend". He asked "your boyfriend?" I said "no".

Then he said "nice box", looking at a chocolate box and asked if I received it for valentine's day. It was actually from my girl friend for Christmas (I am not a big chocolate eater, so there are still some left in the box...), so I said "they are actually from Christmas".

Then he complimented some of the pictures I had on my console (I used to have a lot of our family pictures, but I took them all out and replaced with S3 and my pictures). "What a nice picture of S3 and Mama".

So the whole time I was wondering what he is up to. But I did not want to have any kind of expectations nor hope, so just kept unpacking.

When S3 asked STBX "Papa, are you going to stay now with us?", he got emotional and "oh wow....", then when S3 wanted to hold both STBX and me, to my surprise, he almost wanted to hold both of us.

S3 did not want STBX to leave, which made him feel uncomfortable, I could tell, but I told him to make the scene "light", so that S3 will not get too emotional, and STBX said okay, and left.

He called here at home (I took a day off today) in the morning but we were still in bed. Then he called me on my cell to tell me what he said.

How should I handle this? I do not want to repeat the same thing - that would hurt me and S3 so much and I never want to see S3 get hurt ever again.

STBX does not sound too convincing (he might be just getting emotional right now??), and I do not want to raise my hope too high either.

That is really great news Hoping. You wanted your miracle and now you got it.

If I were you, I would call a DBing coach. We aren't counselors on here, and I think this calls for a counselor. I would also read Michele's book again. I started to read it again, and I can see things that I didn't get the first time I read it. Read the chapter on divorce not being the answer. I think you need to read this message yourself.

I realize that reconciliation will be a lot of very hard work, however; I think it is the best thing to do. We give up on marriage so easily in this country.

Yes, H could be just emotional, but I think he meant it when he made that call. I think he has wanted to make that call many times but always chooses not to do it. Hasn't he told you this before and then the next day called you and said he didn't mean it. I can't remember if I read that in your threads or not. If he does this again, don't lose hope and continue working on yourself. He wants to reconcile but is overwhelmed just like you.

I was watching Dr. Phil the other day. The guy gets on my nerves but something he said rang a bell. It was a show on infidelity. The husband had cheated and he was advising the wife to get therapy. He said that the person who was deceived will go through predictable stages when there is not professional help. He said that the wife will be in shock and then anger. He said then they will try to reinvent themselves to "win" back the spouse. He said then when they get them back into the home they will make the spouse pay for their sins for the rest of their life and make the marriage like a prison. This is a very easy trap.

I see a lot of hurt and pain in your posts and this one too. I think you need to read about forgiveness. If you hold onto everything he did to you, it is going to eat you alive. I have seen a quote on here about how holding onto anger is like taking poison and expecting the other person to die. I read a book on forgiveness by Joyce Meyers that helped me a lot. It was called "Beauty From Ashes" It is more for people who have been abused, but anyone betrayed could easily apply it to their situation. It helped me see that everyone in this world has been hurt by someone and has to let it go. You need to learn to forgive Hoping. You have to do it for yourself. What your husband did was wrong, but people do the best they know how to do. I truly believe that. He just didn't know how to do any better.

I think your husband has a very low self-esteem. I think anybody who messes up in life like our spouses do have very, very low self-esteems. Add to the fact that they screwed up royally and you have someone who thinks nothing of themselves. This gives them no desire to do better.

I went out to eat with my sister and her son. My nephew is three and can be a handful. Going to a restaurant with him is nearly impossible. We decided to give it another shot. He was good all during the meal. It was time to leave so we gathered up our stuff and headed for the door. My nephew was getting all excited and starting to cause trouble. As we walked through the doorway, we passed all the candies and gum machines. He was about to do the usual cry for the candy with a temper tantrum mounting. I didn't notice this, but my sister did and was getting the usual frustrations on her face. I said outloud not realizing the situation about to happen, "You were so good, Nephew!" All of a sudden, his bad behavior haulted and he had a huge smile on his face. Me and my sister both saw what positive reinforcement did like magic. It has a snowball effect just like negative reinforcement does.

To bad the DBing sessions are so expensive. I think you need someone to help guide you through this process.

I suggest that you decide whether you want ex back or not. If you do then you need to go at it full force and never waiver again. You have to be committed fully to doing whatever it takes. It is so much easier to change your behavior instead of your husband's so focus on that. We all wish we had perfect husbands that treated us like princesses. Unfortunately, most women don't get this reality.

Yes, I think you are right about not wanting to not jump into anything too quick. Your marriage is still broken and the two of you have a lot of work to do. It is good to be cautious. However, I truly believe that this is a very good sign even if he does change his mind tomorrow. Remember, baby steps......

Thanks Sam. I guess you were right in saying that there was hope in my situation. I felt you would understand, as your xH's behaviors or personality sounded very similar to mine, and also your personality is probably similar to mine (I wanted to take a charge, thinking that I would fix things for both of us, etc.).

Do I want to take him back? Absolutely. I truly believe having the original family together is the best and I still have a lot of feelings for him left.

Am I scared? Absolutely. I do not EVER want to see S3 crying b/c his father leaves him. So I want to be cautious. But this requires a fine balance, and I do not know how to approach this.

He sent me an email this morning:
"Hoping$Miracles – I would like to give our relationship a second chance for S3’s sake and also because I do still have feelings for you I realize. Also, I know I have issues in my life but I am willing to work through them together.

Are you willing to give this a second chance?"

What is the best way to answer, letting him know that my door is open but we really need to "work" on our M? I do not want to make it sound like I lay down "conditions", but I do want us to go to MC and church together, for example.

Good news and bad news.

You have been given the option of having another shot with your H. Bad news is it will probably be a lot of work because I really sense that he's not quite there.

I think this is the time to be honest with yourself and honest with him. I would let him know that it isn't as easy as just coming back home. You've had this time to work on your issues and know what you want. I doubt you are prepared to deal with half measures from him. If you have doubts about his sincerity or concerns about trusting him then it's okay to say so. He needs to know that this is a decision that isn't just his to make. Give him a bit to process what he asked and continue to make him carry the load of convincing you about another shot.

And I love what Sam said about forgiving him. You will need to find a way to do that if you want to have any chance of success. Try the books she suggested.

Hoping,

What is happening? I think your husband's email is a very good sign. I think Just_Me's advice sounds really good. He has been where you are and had success. Read his posts during this period in his relationship that is now similar to yours. I know he didn't jump right back into things.

Can you call a DBing coach just this once? I think it is OK to tell your husband that you need to think about things but then again, I don't like giving advice on your situation right now. I think professional help is best. Problem is that a lot of therapists that I have been too in person stink at marital counseling. Can you shell out the money for a phone consult with a DBing coach? I think they are best at marital problems. I have had two phone consults. The first one was Vernetta and she was great. The second one I didn't like too much, but I won't say who it was. I think he might have been having a bad day. Vernetta has a long waitlist, but I think it is because she is so good. I think telling ex you need time to think about things and then waiting for a consult could be a good plan. Shoot, I don't really know. This stuff is hard. Best wishes and good luck. Keep us informed. You are giving others hope!

Also, you had said.....

Quote:

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What is the best way to answer, letting him know that my door is open but we really need to "work" on our M? I do not want to make it sound like I lay down "conditions", but I do want us to go to MC and church together, for example.

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How about asking him what he thinks needs to happen to make things work? This would probably be a 180--wouldn't it? Let him answer and then tell him you will think about it. See what he says and what his ideas are. See if they match what you want and need.

Again, I think you need professional advice on how to say what your expectations are without sounding like you are laying down the law. You want this new relationship to be different than the old one. In my old relationship, I would "lay down the law". That just doesn't work with ex. Again, I need to probably just not give advice. I am not familar with this sort of thing. I am no marriage counselor that is for sure.

Thanks, Just. I was hoping to get your feedback on this as well, to get a male perspective and also because I know your xW came back and you guys are working to reconcile.

I thought the day like this would make me soooooooooooo happy before. It's strange, but I was very calm the whole time he was talking. I was happy, yes, but not THAT happy. There was no "YES!!!" moment. It was a calm, "oh, wow, he actually said it..." kind of realization.

I realize that there are a lot of issues still need to be worked out. I need to have a concrete "plan" for this recovery, and H needs to have his own as well.

First of all, I really need to know what made him want to give us another try. Is it one of those "conveniences" he felt? He is just so lonely that he felt being with someone is better than beling alone?

He used S3 as one of the primary reasons, but that's strange too. S3 was always there and should have been a big factor in H's decision making process. H was okay leaving the screaming child crying for his father behind, so even though I do appreciate that now it seems H is getting some of the normal feeling back, S3 cannot be the sole reason for H to reconsider.

So I do want to know what has happened to make him change his mind. If I cannot even ask these questions, our M will not going to work anyway, so I want to be honest with him and hopefully he will be the same this time.

I am thinking of replying to H's email tomorrow, and want to include the questions below:
(1) why he is changing his mind now;
(2) what he thinks needs to be done in order to work on our M;
(3) if he is 100% committed to our M

He called at home 3 times and my cell 5 times today. He gives an impression that he has a deadline or something! Is he saying he wants to give it another try because he has to renew his apartment lease and he has no money?? Is he losing his job?? Tax reasons??

It's sad that I have to think like this, but he fooled me several times, so I really need to be cautious now!

Sam, thanks for your posts. I started to reply to Just and then could not finish it b/c I had to bring S3 to bed, so did not read your posts till now.

I think you and Just understand my situation, and value your opinions. Maybe I need to talk to a pro, you are right. I do want to believe this time H is serious, but then again I have some uncomfortable feeling as well. And I think that's normal. I remember reading Just's thread and I think he felt that way at the beginning.

I just really hope that my H is not trying to "use" me again... I would totally lose my respect for him then.

Anyway, I should not just speculate. I happened to say the same thing as you suggested Sam. I think I am going to ask H what HE thinks needs to be done to save our M.

Do you think sending these questions tomorrow but w/o saying yes or no YET would be okay, or should I just tell him that I need more time to think about this?

H called 9 times yesterday and 3 times this morning. I only answered two of them. This morning when he called, I answered, and he asked
H: "how is everything?"
M: "oh, fine"
H: "oh, okay, I am just calling to see if everything is fine. As long you are fine, that's good (??? I am not dying!!!)."
M: "yea, I am good"
H: "...well, 'cause I know you are probably in a shock (well... HELLO?? till recently you were so mean and jerk about the whole D thing!!! Yes, I am a bit confused!), so I want to make sure you are okay"
M: "I'm fine"
H: "okay"
M: "well, have a good day okay"
H: "yup'

Those frequent phone calls make me nervous. Does he have a deadline or something?? Does he want to reconcile b/c (1) his apartment lease is ending and he does not want to renew it b/c he is having financial problems; (2) he is losing his job (again) and needs to find a rent-free place; (3) he lost a grip on his financial issues and in a deep trouble and needs my financial help; (4) tax related reasons; (5) he cannot pay for his attny anymore; (6) he realized that once D is finalized, he would have to pay more than he has been giving us every month for the next 15 years.

I hate to think like this, but H has "used" me financially before, so these phone calls do make me very nervous as if he is just doing this for his own convenience. Last year, he said "let's stay together for the sake of S3", b/c he was losing his job and had no other place to go. Soon as he found a job, he was again looking for an apartment. So I got mad and kicked him out. Then he came back the next day and said "okay, no more BS, let's give this a serious try", and suggested that we go to Hawaii. I paid for everything and soon as we came back, he moved out.

So I do have a very good reason not to trust his motives. Still, I do not want to "decide" that he is trying to use me again. Of course I want to believe this time is different, but how do I find that out?

I want to reply to his email he sent me yesterday. Here is how I am thinking of responding to his email.
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H,

Thank you for your email and phone calls. I have given this a lot of thought, but feel I still need some time to think it through.

There are a few things I need to know: what made you change your mind and what do you feel is needed to rebuild our trust and M? Do you have any plans for this to be achieved?

If you would like to discuss this in person, we can meet for dinner sometime, but I believe it is better if S3 is not there.

Have a good day,
Hoping

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Those who have experienced in recovery or false recovery in M, I greatly appreciate if you could give me some feedback on my email. THANKS!!!!!!!!

Oh gosh Hoping,

I don't know what to advise you to do. This is difficult. I do think this though.

I don't think you should include the middle paragraph in your email to him. If he is wanting to be back together for the reasons you listed, he is not going to tell you. Putting all those questions out there like that just sounds like more of the same behavior from the past. It is going to keep things going the way they have always been. There seems to be a child-parent aspect to you and your husband's relationship. This just seem to just gets things started back into the same cycle.

Have you read "Men are From Mars, Women are From Venus"? I read this book and applied it to my situation and it worked wonders. I can hear so much of myself in you when you speak. I am very controlling and believe things should happen a certain sort of way. I had me and ex's life all planned without any input from him. I made the list and he followed. This led to disaster.

I also see my mother do this same sort of thing in her marriage. I don't want to be like my parents so I made effort to change. It was like I could see 20 years into my future watching them. My parents have a parent-child relationship. My mom is the parent and my dad is the child. It just makes my mother crazy that my dad won't do this or that. After being with my mother for so many years, my father took on the child role in the relationship because it was the only way he could survive. I clearly see why my mom gets so frustrated with my father, but I also see how my mom creates the situation. I usual see things from my mom's perspective more than my fathers, however; it is because things seem so far gone that there is no other way. I start thinking, "Dad, she will never change so you be the one to step up to bat." My mom will never change so why even try telling her things. Years and years of this parent-child role has created their situation. For them it is pretty much hopeless.

Anyway I am reading key areas in the book and putting them out here. It says that men feel motivated when they feel "needed". Why would your husband feel motivated when you let him know that you definitely don't need him for anything? I hope you don't feel insulted by what I am saying. It is just that I can see the path you are taking because I have been down this same path.

Let me explain this path. I was engaged to a guy that sounds a lot like your husband. He was laid back and I was a planner. Eventually, I realized that being with him would turn my life into a constant struggle with money and finances. He seemed to have little motivation. I don't really know if that was true or not, but it was true when I interacted with him. Then I met my husband who I chose because he seemed to be the exact opposite of my former fiance. What happened? Ex started to act just like the guy I was engaged to. Was ex really like this--No! Now that I am not in ex's life, he pays his bills and gets things done just fine without me there. I created the situation by constantly being a nagging winch. I think that is why he left me too. He had to much self-esteem to put up with a nagging winch like me. Even though he is a drug addict, his life stays intact as far as money and daily responsibility is concerned.

The book also says that three primary needs for a man are to be appreciated, accepted and trusted. Like you I showed my ex none of these things. Oh!!!!--In the beginning I did, but as time moved forward I did these things less and less. By the time our divorce was filed it was very impossible to show an ounce of appreciation, acceptance and trust. He deserved none of these.

I wanted to be different though because I wanted my marriage to work. I started out slow by showing appreciation for little things. I thanked ex for paying me the money in our divorce settlement. Was this money deservedly mine? Of course! But I thanked him anyway. This motivated him to do more and more for me. It started a snowball effect. He tells me all the time that his main goal in life is to pay me every penny I am owed. Can you believe that!! My newly, learned behavior changed the way ex interacted with me.

I then tried to trust him. I started by letting go of his addiction. I stopped trying to control it. I let him know that I trusted that he was capable of getting better all on his own because he is. People are strong Hoping. They are capable of managing just fine without us. Going to Alanon helped me do this. If fact that is what Alanon is all about. Not trying to control the person's addiction and trusting that God will do that job. Shoot as I read this stuff in this book, I am reapplying to my own situation in a better way. I may have to read this book tonight.

As for acceptance, this was hard to do. If only ex did this or that, his life would be so much better. I let it go though, and I showed love for all of him--warts and all. Yes, he knows we can't be together if he is a drug addict, but he knows I love him anyway. This motivates him to do more and be a better person.

This is a way far-off tangent that you may not want to deal with now. I know you are at a crossroads right now, and you have more urgent things happening. I am going to put it out there anyways. I just don't want to see you go down the same old path.

Yes, your husband wrong too. He seems to be making mistake after mistake. However, you are only in control of you. This means it is up to you to make the first set of changes.

The books are
1. Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus
2. Men, Women and Relationships - I highly recommend this book in addition to the first one. It is great!

Both are by John Grey which I am sure you already know.

Hope things are still going well. I am sure you thought this day would never come and things seem more complicated than ever. Best wishes and God bless. You are a good Mom, Hoping. Your son is lucky to have you. I can just picture a three-year old skiing. How cute!!! I hope this all works out for you and your family. I think it will!