Ok, ok. Let me suggest this. I'll qualify it by saying like all the rest of the guys here, I told my XW how beautiful she looked all the time too and the effect was less than satisfactory usually.
But given that, I think it is similar to saying ILY a lot. Too much frequency seems to dull the effect. Not to mention, occasionally, it can be taken as guy talk for "let's have sex". I am NOT saying anyone said nice things about appearance too often or with no feeling or with ulterior motives. I AM saying that it can be perceived that way. It is nearly a "love language" thing. Saying it is nice, showing it's how you feel is better. And, of course, the best way to show it depends on the person and what they like.
Just speculating...
Note to self: No complimenting Lisa on her appearance. Geeze, you are a difficult woman
Flaneur, you going to post on your thread and tell us what's going on with you any time soon?
You just get that eraser out...no notes about me being difficult!! I'm actually VERY low maintenance!! Yes I think we do become jaded if its overly used and of course depends on the person paying the compliment too and how we perceive it.
Here's an example using yours truly. We know we women love everything, our shoes, food, girlfriends, animals, etc...well I have this habit (apparently I need to curtail it or work on it!)...when I get off the phone with one of my friends, swear to God, I end the conversation with Love You!! Well yesterday, I just about blew it with someone...I stopped myself midsentence. I called Tina and we had a good laugh.
To me an acceptable "You look beautiful" or something along that line, whatever would be on a date, special occasion, clear out of the freaking blue. Just not used as a overkill. I have a friend and I visited her and her H a few years back. The man was obsessed with her. We were out driving and he stopped the car, turned to look at me and said "Dont you think my W is the most beautiful woman in the world?" Well yeah but dude drive the freaking car!! She ended up leaving him the following weekend and not for another man either. She ran about 5 states away from that man!! LOL...I got named in the divorce decree (Swear!!) and she keeps the papers in her trunk to remind her WHY she should never get married again. The man was just twisted.
First of all, thanks guys for this being the first real hijack of my thread. I LOVE IT. Continue, please...
I don't think I said "you're beautiful" nearly enough to have it be overkill but yes, she was numb, or oblivious to it. She dresses VERY well and not for any kind of effect. She doesn't need to.
So, my night last night was good. I got home in time to spend some time with my boys and then I went to a basketball game. When I got back, I spent about an hour helping my W do some things for my son's birthday party this weekend. In the past, we didn't work well together because I was so concerned about doing something wrong, or not the way she wanted me to do it. Now I have no such concerns and we worked very well together. We cleaned out a spare room together, working shoulder to shoulder without any conflict. It was nice for a change. I went to bed and that was about it. I don't know when she came to bed. That is a first since I almost always would wait up or wake up when she came to bed. Also, for the first time since all this started, her cell phone was inside when I got home. Of course, it may be that she was on the phone with OM the whole time I was gone, but she has always made sure to leave it in her car no matter what. Curious, nothing more. I am maintaining my detachment but honestly it was easy yesterday because there was no overt OM stuff. I feel confident that I can continue detaching. I will be tested and I may fail but I hope I don't quit if that happens. Along the lines of detaching, one thing I thought of is this: Could it be that detached is how we need to live the rest of our lives with out spouses, not just through this. By that I mean if we are detached, we can give them love when they hurt because we are not hurting just because they do. We do not get angry when they are angry because our emotions are not tied to theirs. In the past, out of guilt or plain emotional reaction, my mood would mirror my wife's. In that state, I was unable to be there for her because I felt as crappy as she did if she was sad, or angry if she was. Even before all this I always wondered what it would be like if I could be happy when she was sad so I could stand beside her as a support instead of someone pulling deeper into whatever she was feeling.
Lastly, I read the Four Agreements yesterday. Very powerful stuff. I need to re-read (actually listen to it...audiobook) it to understand it fully. I consider myself pretty intelligent but this was a lot to digest. Any comments on the book and what it meant to you if you read it, are welcome. Book reports anyone?
Ability to allow people, places, or things the freedom to be themselves.
Holding back from the need to rescue, save, or fix another person from being sick, dysfunctional, or irrational.
Giving another person "the space'' to be him or herself.
Disengaging from an over-enmeshed or dependent relationship with people.
Willingness to accept that you cannot change or control a person, place, or thing.
Developing and maintaining of a safe, emotional distance from someone whom you have previously given a lot of power to affect your emotional outlook on life.
Establishing of emotional boundaries between you and those people you have become overly enmeshed or dependent with in order that all of you might be able to develop your own sense of autonomy and independence.
Process by which you are free to feel your own feelings when you see another person falter and fail and not be led by guilt to feel responsible for their failure or faltering.
Ability to maintain an emotional bond of love, concern, and caring without the negative results of rescuing, enabling, fixing, or controlling.
Placing of all things in life into a healthy, rational perspective and recognizing that there is a need to back away from the uncontrollable and unchangeable realities of life.
Ability to exercise emotional self-protection and prevention so as not to experience greater emotional devastation from having hung on beyond a reasonable and rational point.
Ability to let people you love and care for accept personal responsibility for their own actions and to practice tough love and not give in when they come to you to bail them out when their actions lead to failure or trouble for them.
Ability to allow people to be who they "really are'' rather than who you "want them to be.''
Ability to avoid being hurt, abused, taken advantage of by people who in the past have been overly dependent or enmeshed with you.
And if the negative effects of not detaching is that then you: :
Will have people, places, or things which become over-dependent on you.
Run the risk of being manipulated to do things for people, at places, or with things, which you do not really want to do.
Can become an obsessive ``fix it'' who needs to fix everything you perceive to be imperfect.
Run the risk of performing tasks because of the intimidation you experience from people, places, or things.
Will most probably become powerless in the face of the demands of the people, places, or things whom you have given the power to control you.
Will be blind to the reality that the people, places, or things which control you are the uncontrollables and unchangeables you need to let go of if you are to become a fully healthy, coping individual.
Will be easily influenced by the perception of helplessness which these people, places, or things project.
Might become caught up with your idealistic need to make everything perfect for people, places, or things important to you even if it means your own life becomes unhealthy.
Run the risk of becoming out of control of yourself and experience greater low self-esteem as a result.
Will most probably put off making a decision and following through on it, if you rationally recognize your relationship with a person, place, or thing is unhealthy and the only recourse left is to get out of the relationship.
Will be so driven by guilt and emotional dependence that the sickness in the relationship will worsen.
Run the risk of losing your autonomy and independence and derive your value or worth solely from the unhealthy relationship you continue in with the unhealthy person, place, or thing.
Yes, what you said. In reading all that, I do get a sense that I am starting to understand a lot about what this whole thing means. Most of the positive attributes I am able to recognize and value now and the negative attributes I see in my past with my wife and others. It is an eye opening experience for sure. Thanks for the expanded view.
Quote: doesn't sound like the same thing as "detachment" to me.
Really? Maybe the reasons or methods, but detachment will do much of the same things as denial. It will protect you from pain. It will help you not face problems because you will not internalize them. It will look like masking pain to others (who cares). It does avoid disagreement and disapproval because you are not seeking those things. It lets you avoid negative consequences because you just choose not to react to them. It lets you remain sane because you are isolating yourself from their insanity. It may or may not let you repress loss, and it surely lets you function more "normally". I just trying to make sure that I am not in denial now and that this thing I am going through is truly detachment. I am fully aware of my situation. I know there is an affair. I know our marriage is in deep trouble. I know I need to work on myself. Do those things mean I am NOT in denial? I am denying the negative feelings that could come from those realizations but is that the same as denial?
