Did anyone notice that Corri was (I think) the only one who put the relationship killers in the context of things SHE did to kill the relationship?
A bit sobering, to me, as I sometimes forget my contribution to the passionate slaughter (even though Ms.Hdog tries to remind me about from time to time).
Quote: By failing to understand that the minute I began backing off on who and what I am, I agreed to contribute to the demise of my R.
Ouch. Getting back to "who and what I am" from "who and what I'd become" is a hard road. I wish an older Hairdog could have come back from the future and told me to "be yourself." Ms.Hdog would have either left me or not (probably not), but I'd definitely not have nearly as much ground to make up.
I noticed she did that too....but I answered NOP's questions towards the spouse as that's what he asked. I'm sure I could give PLENTY of things I've done as well.....no, wait...I can't....I'm perfect! LOL Ok...quit laughing!
Mine covered both of us. I was incongruent, insecure, and emotionally reactive, or at least disassociative. Then she taught me what those things were to the Nth degree. A woman scorned and all that jazz.
Lil there is no birth right. HP has the right to be loved as her H is capable, and she earns, thru loving him as she is capable and he earns.
An apt topic as we head into the usual season for reflection. Thank you, NOP, and everyone, for chiming in.
What put our relationship into a coma was both of us taking each other for granted, I think. It seems easy to forget to just enjoy the relationship every day, the simple stuff like actively seeking each other's company.
Sorry, but I think this IS your birthright. Why do you think it isn't?
blackfoot said
Quote: Lil there is no birth right. HP has the right to be loved as her H is capable, and she earns, thru loving him as she is capable and he earns.
When honey said "love slave," she was being a bit facetious and a bit literal, but the point I want to make is that no one has to EARN the right to be loved. Love isn't something that someone pays us because of what we do and who we are. To be loved by another is pure, unearned grace... and it is our birthright.
Of course I don't mean that honey has the God-given right to expect that this particular man or any particular man will be her personal slave and be at her beck and call and do everything she wants sexually and otherwise at the drop of a hat. That's ridiculous.
The point that I'm trying to make is that we do not have to perform and/or produce in order to merit/deserve/earn love. And in fact we cannot, as many on this board know from experience. We can perform and produce till we turn blue and our partner does not have to love us or act loving.
But honey and each of us has the birthright to be loved in the way we want to be loved and not to settle for less. When I read your statement, honey, it just seemed to say to me, "I have no right to expect anyone to be my 'love slave' and I am misguided, wrong, and out of luck if I believe I have a right to the kind of love that would really fill my tank."
Everyone can make a choice about) what the "deal-breakers" are, but that doesn't mean we were wrong or "getting too big for our britches" if we want more.
To be loved and to do nothing to EARN it-- I believe this is a birthright.
As for the specifics of how that plays out in life... well, that's a different chapter.
Sheesh, you guys are too much. I understood what HP was saying. She's simply saying that it was wrong for her to expect MrHP to do whatever she wanted regardless of his feelings, wants, needs, desires, whenever she wanted it and in the way she wanted it done; Hence, her love SLAVE. She's not entitled to that, and she is just saying that she realizes that now. Love should be something freely given: since it is a gift, you shouldn't expect to be able to dictate the terms of how and when it shall be shown. On the other hand, it is reasonable to state your prefereneces, and in an ideal R, your lover will do what he or she can to cater to your preferences. Big differences between stating preferences and making (or wishing) demands and expecting them to be fulfilled exactly as you wish.
--GGB, wondering if MrsGGB would be my love slave for a day
I do not have to earn the love that H gives me, but the flip side of that is that I don't get to dictate what kind of love it is, the strength of it, how it is demonstrated, etc.
All I have the right to do is to decide whether it suits me well enough to stick around.
MrH gives me everything that he is capable of giving. Over the years, what he is capable of has grown and expanded. I would bet that it will continue to do so.
Do I have a 'right' to it? No of course not. I am worthy and deserving of love but do I get to also specify exactly how it's delivered? No of course not.
Part of the resolution of this problem, for me, has been in accepting that perfection is not going to happen. My H worships me in his own ways and is utterly devoted to me. He is not sexually slobbering all the time--and that is a disappointment to me, don't misunderstand--but again who ever said that it was my birthright to have that?
Is it my H's birthright to have a spotless house, all the time, no matter what? Toilets that you can eat off? All of his laundry neatly in the drawers without him ever having to touch the washer? Truly, I don't think so. It is his preference, not my obligation. Because I love him, I make it a priority in my day. Do I do it to his satisfaction? Oh hell no. In order to do that, I'd have to ship my kids off, lol.
It has taken me an hour to compose this reply, as I keep getting up and down, so I have no idea if it is coherent or if I answered your question!
This whole 'earning love' conversation is pretty interesting to me. I've thought a lot about it... love. I've come to the conclusion... and mind you, this is my own theories from my own ponderings... that I do not 'deserve' nor do I 'earn' love.
I AM love. Why do I say I AM love, rather than it being some elusive energy that sits 'out there' that I have to find the magic formula for in order to deserve it or earn it.
Well... this is where I am at in my ponderings:
Let's think of the basic foundations of love. In order for love to flourish between two people, we must have security/safety, trust, respect, honesty and vulnerability... these form the bonds of emotional attachment... these are not things we GET from someone else, these are things we GIVE to someone else, for what you call love, or the feeling of love, is what flows OUT of you, not toward you. In order to respect and honor other, we graciously accept the security/safety, trust, respect, honesty and vulnerability that comes our way from them... yet even in so doing, we are STILL giving, because this acceptance is done with love, and love always flows OUT.
If I AM love, and this is the highest form of self that I want to be, then I first and foremost act and react in loving ways regardless of what 'other' does or does not do. It does not mean I am a doormat, for that would mean I am NOT honoring myself, respecting myself, etc., and hence mean, I am NOT love. It means I am being something else, and that's okay, as long as I don't confuse the two.
I think what happens in most marriages, or any other closely bonded group... is not that 'love' goes away, but our agreed upon terms to cooperate and live together harmoniously have gone by the wayside (if, in fact, those things has been clearly established to begin with... and of course they are always open for renegotiation.) Yet... I think we often confuse the two.... concept of love/concept of harmony.
I can love the entire world and everyone in it until the day I die. Doesn't mean I can necessarily live harmoniously with them... and not being able to harmoniously live with someone does not mean that I do not love them.
Love is something I am, it is what I do, it is what I give. It is not what I get. Waiting to receive inhibits my ability to give... it takes up space in my being... and the more space my expectations take up... the less space I have to devote to loving. My energies become scattered... my feeling of 'love' diminishes... and I think it is because my needs are not being met... my expectations are not being filled... I am not being 'loved.' No. I've stopped giving love and started waiting for it... and of course my feelings of love go away because I'm not doing it anymore.
I am love. It starts with me, it ends with me, and then starts all over again. Mother Theresa was once asked how she could tirelessly work with starving and sick children... how did that not drain her... and she responded (I am paraphrasing here)... 'there were days when I wondered the same thing myself. So I gave love. And then I gave some more and I continued giving love. And instead of finding exhaustion and hoplessness, all I found was more love to give.
Okay... so that's Mother Theresa... but this is not a pious love of which she speaks.
So... my point here is... this is love... to me. And in my ponderings, etc., I've found that my ability to love has never been broken, because I don't deserve it nor do I earn it... I AM love, and all I can do with that is give it. My confusing it with what it means to me to cooperate and live in harmony with someone is what has been all tangled up. For me.
Wow. What a friggin' tangent. Okay... gotta go to bed. Nite.
LOL Ok...quit laughing!
