Gee, I wonder why people say you come across as being cocky???
I dont.
Cobra said
Quote: You know enough to acknowledge others that know more than you, and not get into an argument with those that could take down your façade.
I can see your point how it is stupid to DEFER to someone who has MORE knowledge then you, instead of arguing with them.
ZB I was being sarcastic in reply to this remark. Why would I argue with someone who knows more or corrects my error?
Quote: I dont care about you or your opinion of what one aspect ......
A little touchy aren’t we
not touchy ZB, just meant I wasnt going to the time and effort to refute what cannot be refuted. I can offer no empirical evidence other then words and defending each wrong point he made would just be defensive, and wasting my time.
Thanks for the touchback, I Have learned sooo much from DB, and from many of the frequent flyers here. The laughs are a nice bonus, glad I decided to stop lurking for insights.
The next R will have its own set of troubles, ahhh the eternal struggle. Yes I have an Aprilia Falco, electrical is a little tempermental, but it fits me soooo well compared to the busa or the blackbird. Not to mention ... its not common. LOL.
You are a work of art and as a narcissist (of sorts), a rather tough cookie to crack......And like you, I used to love heated philosophical debates when in college. I could see trading jabs with you as very intellectually challenging
Why Cobra,
Are you flirting with me? I can understand LFL wanting to crack my smooth exterior, and Im terrifically flattered by your interest, but you wanting to get to know me so well has me a little disconcerted. I may have to dial back on that attraction.
I really like that you are educated, but you have that pesky Y chromosome, and are missing a couple other pertinent physical attributes that I prefer.
Well I think you're attractive too bf. That's why I suck up to you so much in my posts. Remember my MO is begging. Why should the ladies here have all the fun? Can't us guys get a piece of Mr. Machismo too? Surely there is enough to go around.
Sorry, your post was just to funny to resist jumping on. Keep 'em coming. I was pretty torqued earlier tonight, so I really needed it.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
I think if I could find someone with BF egotistical self confidence. Hairys sense of humor and Lou's handyman abilities I would have found the perfect man.
Now don’t go thinking like that. You might hurt yourself. Think of it more like two kids trying to outdo each other in thinking up the best put-down. More of a competitive thing. I really have little interest in your Y chromosome.
In response to Chrissy’s questions, looking into Vaknin’s site gives a lot of information. But one thing I learned is that narcissism does not mean one is filled with self-love and arrogance. The definition is broader to include a denial of self and projection of a false self to oneself and others. This could mean arrogance and egotism. It could also mean timidity and rescuing. In either case, the person could be projecting a false self to cover up personal weakness and conflicts.
I also understand that this is only the first step in the personality disorder continuum. The extreme involves a complete break with reality in the form of schizophrenia. But I must correct myself from my earlier post. I must not accuse Blackfoot of being a narcissist, but only of having narcissistic tendencies. All of us have some elements of this. A healthy dose of self confidence, even a little arrogance is needed for positive self image.
Where I make a distinction with Blackfoot is that he seems to be VERY calculating in his evaluation of women and how he can get through their barriers, all for the sole purpose of attracting them. He also seems to revel in their adoration. As I see things (and I am not a psychologist or psychic) manipulation is the telling factor. People do this for different reasons, and to varying degrees, but excessive manipulation speaks to a need to control. And from my readings, control can only be due to two things – to protect oneself from either fear or abandonment.
The theme I get from Blackfoot is that his world turns on his ability to manipulate people and project this aura of total confidence. This is a very conscious and rehearsed act, as Blackfoot has all but admitted himself. Narcissists need some form of adoration. They can brag on themselves, but isn’t it so much better, and more sophisticated, to have others brag on you for you? The trick is to do those special things for others that will endear them to you. They will then do the praising for you. You rub my back, I’ll rub yours. Read up on Vaknin’s theory of “narcissistic supply”. Its very interesting.
To me, all the pieces fit, so I called it as I saw it. Cobra
Think of it more like two kids trying to outdo each other in thinking up the best put-down. More of a competitive thing.
Darn it I was afraid of that. Now I am bored. Such a waste of energy IMO, trying to one up. No one wins and they both end up looking like jackasses.
Ill go first. HEE HAW Why is it that you want to compete with a narcissist?
Where I make a distinction with Blackfoot is that he seems to be VERY calculating in his evaluation of women and how he can get through their barriers, all for the sole purpose of attracting them
Thank you. I admit to wanting to be attractive to women, and trying to improve myself by becoming more confidant, having a positive attitude, and look for the fun in a situation in order to make their/her/my life a little better, even if its just to make the barista girl smile for a few seconds. Spread some cheer there is enough negative in the world. My motive is wanting to have a strong EC and passionate PT/ML with the woman of MY choice. . I embrace my ID, my sexual drives. If I am going to do it -by god --I want to be good at it.
but excessive manipulation speaks to a need to control. And from my readings, control can only be due to two things – to protect oneself from either fear or abandonment
I am not sure what I would be afraid of on this BB, or what effect it would have on my life if y'all abandoned me, much as I enjoy it.
Its almost as if you are attributing some insidious machevellian plan towards me to trick everyone on this forum. To what end? adoration from virtual people? reveling in my living room when someone compliments me? There is no ulterior motive to my 'civility and respect' other then treating people as I want to be treated. Its how I was raised Its called the golden rule.---Luke 6:31
Where is your thread cobra? I promise not to come attacking or offering advice, you have seen my advice already. Just want to know how you got here. age, wife, how long married, kids, etc.
1 more requst. Stop posting to my thread about the narcissim after your next reply, whatever it is I will let it go. This forum is for SSM not curing me of my narcissism, potential schizophrenia. You outed me already for my evil plan to get everyone here to adore me. there has been several new people join up in the past few days that are reaching out need some support, advice that want it.
I've visited that website in the past it has some great information on it.
I want to point out though that EVERYONE has narcissistic tendancies...but that doesn't mean we are all narcissists. It's to what degree do you have these tendancies, and how many of the tendancies do you have that make you a narcissist.
Our first C is the one that brought this to my attention. So in order to better understand I researched it, came across SV's website and others, and learned quite a bit about this....I also posted quite a bit about it when I first joined this BB eons ago.
I wanted to point that out mainly because there could be people reading this thread (who are new here or don't necessarily particpate) who might read that website and see a couple of things their SO does that would be considered a narcissistic tendancy...and then run off the deep end thinking they're dealing with a full-blown narcissist, which could really complicate their situation.
Sorry BF, I know you wanted to get off this topic...I apologize for the brief hi-jack...just wanted to address this where it was written.
And Cobra...you and I don't see BF the same at all. Sure, he's fun to banter back and forth with, but I would hardly attribute any of his posts on here as narcissistic.
OK, let’s get down to brass tacks shall we? You and others here seem to think I am attacking you only for the sport of competition, as a means to boosting my self esteem. That is not the case. I see something very troubling in your posts. Others seem to sense it but I’m not sure anyone has put their finger on it.
First let me say in response to GEL’s comments that I should NOT say you are a true narcissist. I know better than to make such a claim, as I think there are relatively few of them around. But I do believe you have quite a few of these tendencies. And I agree that we all have some of this. A good dose of confidence and self esteem is essential to a healthy persona. So why do I see a problem? I interpret your suggestions as falling into two camps, what I will call tactics and overall strategy.
By tactics I am thinking of how someone would approach a particular issue, how to get a point across, how to resolve a particular habit, a point in time action. Here I think your words are particularly effective, and I have praised you for this. It is the area I need the most work in. I should have been more tactful in my approach to Globule, but I had my reasons.
By overall strategy, I mean the lifestyle approach taken in dealing with another person. It is here that I think you methods can be dangerous to a relationship. True compatibility in a healthy relationship depends on honesty, openness, good communication, and a thorough understanding of you and your partner’s issues (I’m sure I’m missing other important things). Leave any one of these elements out and problems will begin to crop up. What I see in your comments is an overall strategy to work your partner in ways that appeal to their ego but ultimately serve as manipulation. Once they become aware of this, and cannot get you to acknowledge or change what you are doing, they have no choice but to leave the relationship.
I can speak with some authority on this subject because as I mentioned before, my mother has these same traits. As a child, I can recall her being very controlling and shaming when angry. But like most people, when things are going well, she is a delight to be around, the proverbial life of the party. Her friends adore her and people seem to be attracted to her by some magnetic pull. She firmly believes she was a great mother and sacrificed for my brothers and I. But when I speak to her of the damage done from her angry spells, the toxic shaming she would put forth, the fights with my father, she will not accept any responsibility. She becomes very defensive and angry about it. The lethality comes about when she has to deal with stress.
The sad part is that she truly wants to help others. But her childhood trauma is more than she can overcome. She was born into in a high class family in Japan before the war, raised mostly by a nanny. So she had little maternal affection. They lived in Hiroshima and lost everything in the atomic bomb. Her family survived, but the emotional scars were permanent. Actually, I think the maternal bonds are her biggest problem, and to protect herself from her mother’s “abandonment” she built very strong walls and denials. She maintains fantasies on how people should behave toward outsiders and within the family. Her effect is very dysfunctional and toxic. I am trying to get her to understand where this originates and how it affects her, so she can acknowledge it and change.
Why is my mother relevant here? Because I see some of the same issues in Blackfoot. This is a board to deal with our emotional issues. Blackfoot is still young, without children and unaware of the damage that can be wrought on such vulnerable minds. I believe that following his advice carte blanche can become toxic to a family, but may not be apparent for years to come. Manipulation and control of others is never healthy. This is my agenda, nothing more. I see something in his posts that others do not. Should I stay quiet about it? I don’t think so. We are here to learn. I have this knowledge from hard experience. My greatest good can come from sharing that knowledge.
Blackfoot, you should think about this because from what I recall, you lost a marriage using your overall strategy. I know you do not see what I am saying, but try this. If you are still communicating with your ex, bring this very subject up to her and see what she says. I suspect that at some point she became aware of your strategy, understood the futility in trying to change you and left. If she will talk about it, I would be very interested to hear what she says. Your tactics for dealing with single point in time issues are good and there is a lot of appeal in them for those who you target. But the pattern, the overall strategy, becomes one of manipulation and control. It can be lethal for a marriage, especially for someone who is intelligent enough (as you say she is) to understand what is going.
I know you have had considerable pain over your breakup. But in my mind you still seem to have some confusion over what went wrong. My take is that during the days after she left, your “crazy making” was from not being able to reconcile her actions when the sincere intentions and efforts you had been making. You could not find a rational explanation for why she left. This would drive anyone crazy. But I think that subconsciously (and possibly consciously) you are aware of your manipulations and that you had lost control of her. For someone with narcissistic tendencies, this is where the panic sets in. The fear of abandonment I speak about is that of reliving hurts from the past, when as a child you felt alone, scared and therefore abandoned, whether you were physically alone or not. This is not from me, it is consistently stated in all the books I read.
Take a new perspective on what happened. This is hard medicine, I know. I honestly believe you are sincere in you desire to help others, to “help” your wife, to reconcile and find happiness. But like my mother, you cannot fix what you do not or will not see. Just think about it.
Why should the ladies here have all the fun? Can't us guys get a piece of Mr. Machismo too? Surely there is enough to go around. 
