In a nutshell, my wife and I are having desire realted issues. For a few months now, our sex life has gradually become less frequent.
The thing is, my wife says 'she wants to want to have sex'. We have talked about it before, and it is more some anxiety problem. She tells me she enjoys having sex with me, but she can't 'give in to it' or 'relax'. Part of the problem is that she has been having sex with me 'more often' because it 'makes you happy'. I think she now feels it more as pressure, as a duty or some nuisance perhaps even. She doesn't want to talk much about it. I understand it might be uneasy for her, but I want to talk about it, and find out if there is a way we can both feel relaxed and comfortable about having sex again.
Recently we had some good talks, as she more and more started using 'evasive' tactics. Like, she stopped carressing or kissing me on the couch watching TV, and instead more or less kept a distance. She would come home and would have 'chores'. We would have a nice diner, and a nice evening, but then she'd find something she 'really needs to do', or she'd go to bed and say she's really tired, or 'fall asleep' on the couch, etc.
After being patient all this time, I finally talked to her about it. I told her how I felt she was clearly avoiding me on an emotional/physical basis, and effectively making up excuses for any kind of intimacy. She loves a good snuggle, but she even avoids that as it gives her anxiety that it 'will turn into sex', so basically she avoids any kind of intimacy, ie, avoids me and my needs.
After talkig about this, and after I told her how all this hurts me a lot, she recognizes how it does hurt me, and she better understands my emotions now. Also, what is also important to me is how we have always sworn to each other to always be 'open' and 'honest'. So yes, that is a part of the problem as well, as she hasn't been open and honest about it, and used 'ploys' to evade whatever troubles her.
I have told her how I 'don't want to have sex with here' for the coming time, but that I simply want to her and me to learn how to be initmate again without any pressure or anxiety for having sex. This of course is not easy, as a lot of things (like touching her or kissing her in a certain way) still make her immediately worry about 'sex'. We can now snuggle in a more comfortable way, and she does like it, but I feel how she's still very much on guard with anything 'sexual'.
She says she wants to have sex, and I really believe she means that. But the also says she has a problem with it, how she can't help feeling anxious about it, and she doesn't know why, or what she should do about it. I'd love to help her or be patient, and I have told her I'll do whatever she wants or is comfortable with. But there's not much progress going on, and I do feel inner frustration, and it's very hard to control this and not let it influence my emotions as I know it will make it only harder for her. But then again, the emotion and frustration is real, the doubts are real, the feeling of not being loved are real, I would say it's the toughest thing I have ever had to deal with as I realize how destructive these emotions can be.
Couple of questions... how long have you been married? Any kids? Was it different in the beginning? You say the frequency has dropped in the last few months-- can you tie that to any particular event? Any therapy or counseling part of the discussion?
I can relate to the evasive tactics at bedtime. My bf virtually always comes to bed hours after I do.
We have been married a few months ago, so one could almost get suspicious. . We know each other since 2003. We don't have any kids, and are not currently planning on any, but that can always change.
It was better in the beginning. We figured some stuff out like how she 'wants' to be perfect (including sexually), and she has basically put the pressure on herself. Or so she says. I think she's most of all anxious that she 'isn't good enough at it'. It may also be that she is intimidated about previous partners I had.
I don't know if timing wise it is related, as it is such a gradual change, but I do recall we also talked about our previous partners. I am not sure if I made a mistakr there, or told about stuff that does make her feel inadequate now. She says she has this 'loving and sexual person inside, I can't just find it'. I realize that trying to put her at ease, or making her feel comfortable with anything (snuggles, sex, non sexual intimacy) might only put on additional pressure as in 'trying to help' and of course she feels like she's goign to disappoint me anyway.
mqo stated - "We figured some stuff out like how she 'wants' to be perfect (including sexually), and she has basically put the pressure on herself. Or so she says. I think she's most of all anxious that she 'isn't good enough at it'. It may also be that she is intimidated about previous partners I had."
This is/was my H to a tee. He is a perfectionist as well as a conflict avoider. Just be careful your W does not ignore the problem. It will not go away on its own.
Thanks LFL. Isn't it amazing how regardless of the differences between M and W, how this same behavior can be found in both?
Last night was a very possitive one. When we got to bed, we snuggled. I had already told her that I am happy with not having sex, how I just want to be intimate, kiss her all over, etc. She was relaxed enough to allow me to caress her, and most amazingly, she even got an orgasm. I guess for her most of all, not having any pressure to it (ie, not seeing everything as foreplay and then 'having to perform') is the most important. I know I shouldn't push it, and I will wait now for a few days how she reacts to this and be very gentle and easy to not put any pressure or expectations following this possitive experience. It may sound weird, but I think that although this was a very good moment, it also might make her anxious about me expecting 'more after it' or 'having to give me some back' or something.
These problems certainly can be found in both sexes. I think men are just less likely to talk about being LD themselves.
Good to hear last night went well. In fact, we did almost the same thing. He had an orgasm and was more than willing to "give" me one but I just didn't want to make it a necessity all the time. (Less pressure).
Sometimes it is nice just to please your partner. I don't want that all the time though. At least for me, there needs to be variety.
I also made the mistake of sharing too much about previous partners and all it did was make him feel bad. Too late now. I have a thread of my own if you would like to read the whole distressing story
FWIW...my LDH is VERY reluctant to talk about being LD. I believe this is very common in male or female LD people....why? A variety of reasons I'm sure....but with my LDH I believe much of it has to do with the fact that he knows he's letting me down in this area and is ashamed to talk about it. Not that I've berated him or belittled him because of it...but merely because I've brought up the fact that our lack of SL is a BIG problem for me.
My W is also very reluctant talking about it. And I think in a way it makes her feel worse as the way she does tend to talk about it often start with 'I know I am disappointing you...' 'I know I don't give you enough...', etc.
It's a kind of a defeatist approach, but i have realized by now it's VERY hard to break that circle. This morning I tried to provide good 'after care' (dear god, let me never use that phrase in her presence ), I got up early to make coffee, gave her some good morning hugs (making sure there wasn't any sexual ambiguity to it). In a sense I think that's important. That whenever we are intimate in some way, or I give her a lot of love and affection (and getting little in return), that there isn't a 'score to be kept'. that she doesn't have to 'live up to me' or that I want something in return for it.
Over the last days/weeks, I have come to realize how some of my own behavior has been destructive. By telling her how much I show affection, and how much I am in need for some as well, I think it both adds to the pressure of 'having to show affection and desire', and adding to a feeling of guilt of not 'giving me what I need' or being 'selfish'.
It's a hard mindset to achieve, trying to take things as they come, giving your W love and affection WITHOUT expecting anything in return. It's hard as it means you will have to deal with your own hurt and feelings of rejection and abondonement in a possitive way, and that is VERY hard I can tell you.
But peronally, if you do alter your own expectations, as in not going for demand driven thoughts as 'It's been a week since we last had any initmacy', 'I have given her so much, why doesn't she give me any?', it does become easier. Because if you expect something in return at some point (ie checking the 'score' or how long it has been since, how you have been giving and giving and it's about damn time for something in return), you are setting yourself up for disappointment and feelings of unfairness, rejection and resentment. It's not easy, but I try to expect nothing and hope and appreciate whatever will come my way.
The most important to me was that she now recognizes and acknowledges my feelings of rejection, abandonement, frustration and hurt. We have talked about this, and she understands I was most of all hurt by her ignoring and avoiding how I got emotionally hurt by her 'ploys' to be avoid intimacy as those most of all gave me signals of rejection and not feeling loved.
It's a long and fragile process I guess, rebuilding mutual trust and an open and honest approach to intimnacy, and disconnecting the love/intimacy/sex/guilt circle.
Oh, another thing I should mention is that my W is on Depakote (divalproex sodium) for treating mood swings. she isn't on a very high dose (1500mg), but I suspect this might have something to do with it as well. OTOH, she has been on depakote for some years now, also when she wasn't LD, so it's hard to say if the two are related or not.
Well, nice setback this day as we're back to the same old.
Just to illustrate. The W had a pedicure tonight. Comes home, checks what's in brewing in the kitchen (I cook most of the times), lands on the couch, gives me a quick kiss and then grabs for the laptop to 'check her email' and 'surf the bulletin boards'.
I am simply lost at these moments. We have often talked about these issues, and it's not like I need her attention ALL the time, but it would be nice if I would be first on the list of priorities, not last or taken for granted. :\
. We know each other since 2003. We don't have any kids, and are not currently planning on any, but that can always change.
), I got up early to make coffee, gave her some good morning hugs (making sure there wasn't any sexual ambiguity to it). In a sense I think that's important. That whenever we are intimate in some way, or I give her a lot of love and affection (and getting little in return), that there isn't a 'score to be kept'. that she doesn't have to 'live up to me' or that I want something in return for it.